New MS Flight Sim shown at E3 - Updated Information

[irrics 1,523]

@Rob_Ainscough

Why does the trailer look so much better visually than P3D and XP11?

(I think it does - maybe you disagree?)

Edited June 25, 2019 by irrics

[irrics 1,523]

4 minutes ago, Rob_Ainscough said:

So much for "new code" and "new design" ... there are real computing limits for everything that makes up a flight simulator ... that's my point.  

If that's your view - why are you "cautiously optimistic" about MSFS 2020?

What are you actually optimistic about?

You sound like you don't think there's anything they could bring to the table that isn't already being done by P3D and/or XP.

 

[Pastaiolo 1,690]

While it is true that it's not a fair comparison doing one between a flight simulator and an open world game, i also have to point out that the whole "P3D models the whole world" when compared to Aerofly FS2, Flight and DCS is completely nonsense. First of all i do not think for a moment that in every moment the whole world is available, second of all even if that is the case the whole world is drawn with really low textures and autogen is limited to few miles around you. It would make no sense for it to draw objects further away since the only end result would be to destroy performance completely. It's the same reason of why objects have different lod details based on distance. What are we even talking about?

[Longranger 148]

2 minutes ago, irrics said:

@Rob_Ainscough

Why does the trailer look so much better visually than P3D and XP11?

(I think it does - maybe you disagree?)

They use an extremly high data approach. X-Plane and P3D don't. The complete simulator has in X-Plane a size of 70 GB. Don't forget Washington alone from OrbX uses 200 GB .

[SmokeDiddy 265]

I will have to side with @Rob_Ainscoughin this discussion - not as a skeptic of MSFS 2020, but Rob is being realistic in his critiquing analysis.  I think it is short sighted to disregard his extensive knowledge and understanding in the current state of how flight sims work and what it takes to realistically move a vehicle from point A to point B in the air.  Discussions like this are healthy for our genre, but it's still too early to shut the door in either direction.

[SamYeager 245]

5 minutes ago, Rob_Ainscough said:

 it's not going to change the reality I know as a programmer who happens to also be very aware of current hardware limitations and the compromises need.

Cheers, Rob.

 

So what is it that you're "cautiously optimistic" about? It almost seems that you're saying that FS2020 will be no different from XP or P3D as they're both optimised for today's hardware so why bother having it?

[irrics 1,523]

2 minutes ago, Longranger said:

They use an extremly high data approach. X-Plane and P3D don't. The complete simulator has in X-Plane a size of 70 GB. Don't forget Washington alone from OrbX uses 200 GB .

Oh I mean more than that - lighting, weather, scenery - basically anything you could think of looked better.

[laminator 20]

3 minutes ago, Rob_Ainscough said:

P3D and XP11 are optimized for today's hardware ... heck I think Austin claimed something like over 80% of the XP10 code was re-written for XP11 ... and I can still get XP11 down to single digit FPS at 4K res just as I can in P3D with the right set of add-ons configured to extremes and some visual enhancement tweaks to go even further.  So much for "new code" and "new design" ... there are real computing limits for everything that makes up a flight simulator ... that's my point.  

Sure you can bog down any sim with a big enough burden to calculate/display, no doubt!

I myself am a XP user since ver7, and despite the code refactoring in large areas in v11 the sim has still trouble to utilize all my cores to a high extent. I don´t own P3Dv4, but I hear from friends and read that it´s basically the same story there too. I think we deserve software that really utilizes our expensive overclocked rigs, that´s all I ask for 😉

I used all versions of MSFS since MS Flightsim for Amiga back in 1986/87(?) and on PC since 1990, XP since v7, and I welcome if a new challenger enters the field, its good for us from a consumer perspective. If they do it right, great! If they fail, we continue to use our beloved sims further on. no real harm done.

regards

Thomas

[irrics 1,523]

4 minutes ago, SamYeager said:

So what is it that you're "cautiously optimistic" about? It almost seems that you're saying that FS2020 will be no different from XP or P3D as they're both optimised for today's hardware so why bother having it?

That's where I'm confused also

Edited June 25, 2019 by irrics

[Longranger 148]

 

1 minute ago, irrics said:

Oh I mean more than that - lighting, weather, scenery - basically anything you could think of looked better.

What was rendered on a single computer?ö. There were many parts that weren't the result by an AI but by an artist. They had optimized the used filters. Yes, it was rendered but it was handpicked and optimized.for every second. That's the problem of videos.

[irrics 1,523]

1 minute ago, Longranger said:

 

What was rendered on a single computer?ö. There were many parts that weren't the result by an AI but by an artist. They had optimized the used filters. Yes, it was rendered but it was handpicked and optimized.for every second. That's the problem of videos.

How do you know what was or wasn't in game footage or what touch up was done?

That sounds like you're baking in some assumptions there, correct?

[Amon1973 1,430]

Time will tell who is right and who is wrong in this debate, either way when MS release MSFS2020 one side will have to eat humble pie.

[Longranger 148]

2 minutes ago, irrics said:

How do you know what was or wasn't in game footage or what touch up was done?

That sounds like you're baking in some assumptions there, correct?

Sure. Primarily the assumption that they are several months away from release. Many of these things are optimized just before release. So they can't have the suitable algorithms ready. Since these optimzations were done, it was a human.

[irrics 1,523]

4 minutes ago, Longranger said:

So they can't have the suitable algorithms ready

How do you know how long they've been working on this and what state the development is at?

Edited June 25, 2019 by irrics

[irrics 1,523]

4 minutes ago, eaim said:

Time will tell who is right and who is wrong in this debate, either way when MS release MSFS2020 one side will have to eat humble pie.

My money is on the "pie eating" taking place in the cockpits of P3D and XP pilots

Edited June 25, 2019 by irrics