The upshot of the HT On = heat debate is that some programs will create more tasks, two per core. In which case it will utilise all the CPU cycles available meaning more work done = more heat.

In other words - we must be careful because often, tests of performance don't include for setup of HT operation for a fair comparison with HT disabled.

2 hours ago, fluffyflops said:

Its posts like this that makes me dream of the day the new msfs2020 comes out. 

 

That's not just P3D. Most games work the same.

1 minute ago, SteveW said:

That's not just P3D. Most games work the same.

i dont think ive ever seen a tweak for xp11 , i could be wrong.

but i hope once and for all when msfs2020 we can put all this to bed

On 10/25/2019 at 2:14 AM, SteveW said:

 

Give addons at least two LPs.

Also your testing clearly shows how certain tasks can gain advantage in HT mode by using '11' on a core for some of those on CPUs with fewer cores where the advantage of HT provides opportunity.

Sim hanging:  Turn off a few addons, traffic maybe see where the hang comes from by elimination..

Can you expand on these points.

Are you suggesting that some addons benefit from being assigned to more than one LP? Possibly using both threads on the same physical core?

Re the hang. There was no traffic loaded when the big hang happened. I'm kinda suspecting ASP4 at this point from which I use the weather engine. Clouds are provided by SkyForce3D.

Like I say, the problem with faultfinding this hang is it happens so rarely. Once yesterday in about 2-3 hours of flying.

 

Yes, most apps need two LPs minimum. One LP execution can be self blocking add waiting.

Elimination is key to problem solving. Try another plane or no traffic or whatever you might suspect.

 

8 hours ago, fluffyflops said:

i dont think ive ever seen a tweak for xp11 , i could be wrong.

but i hope once and for all when msfs2020 we can put all this to bed

What I was explaining goes for most apps we see even MS2020 works the same. However it will be interesting if they can incorporate a decent profiling system. None the less it will continue to be hard for any app like that to ascertain the partition required between the simulator and the add-ons.

1 hour ago, SledDriver said:

the problem with faultfinding this hang is it happens so rarely. Once yesterday in about 2-3 hours of flying.

 

CTDs with the sim are often from add-in dll's, have a look what's loading up. Take a look in event viewer, admin events, scroll back through your crashes to desktop. Anything there? 

A really long pause is most often caused by an unrelated process grabbing control of your system, like adobe update or similar.

Edited October 26, 20196 yr by Bert Pieke

12 hours ago, SteveW said:

CTDs with the sim are often from add-in dll's, have a look what's loading up. Take a look in event viewer, admin events, scroll back through your crashes to desktop. Anything there? 

I've not had (or mentioned) a single CTD. It's just a 10ish second hang, and then it continues fine.

 

7 hours ago, Bert Pieke said:

A really long pause is most often caused by an unrelated process grabbing control of your system, like adobe update or similar.

Thanks Bert. Really tricky to detect what it is. System is very clean. I don't install word not allowed on it - I have another machine for all the stuff not specifically related to my major apps.

Consider that this machine is used professionally as a music production workstation - like sims, this is also timing and latency critical. I use the machine for sometimes 14 hours a day producing music, and never does that very complex system experience any hangs in all that continuous use.

I'll just keep an eye on the task manager while using P3D and see if I can eventually spot which process goes busy when these very rare long pauses happen.

Ta

20 hours ago, SteveW said:

Yes, most apps need two LPs minimum. One LP execution can be self blocking add waiting.

I assume for cache reasons, they are better using two LP's on the same core?

Yet that then limits the number of cores available to assign in this way to addons which are not being assigned to P3D.

Keep in mind you can tweak the hell out of your system to minimize stutters but you’ll never eliminate them in P3D.

4 hours ago, Chapstick said:

Keep in mind you can tweak the hell out of your system to minimize stutters but you’ll never eliminate them in P3D.

Yeah I used to think the same way, but now for the most part I have P3D running nice and smooth.

What did it take to achieve such a smooth running sim you say...?

A 30Hz capable monitor... with such a monitor I've been able to set the screen mode to a 30 Hz screen mode and thus use vsync to lock @ 30 fps and a reliable vsync is really smooth, I can even get a 60vsync at times, which is really great and super smooth, however my poor old (underpowered) GPU thens tends to max out and introduces stutters, a 30 Hz vsync is the most reliable for myself.

This in turn has reduced the load on the CPU and GPU meaning I can ramp up the GFX settings and add useful tweeks to the prepar3d.cfg file that improve the look and immersion. Of course it helps to have a powerful CPU and GFX card to match.

Previously with the sim trying to max itself out with fps on a 60 Hz monitor mode, the only option was to reduce the GFX configuration, and even then it was pretty stuttery.

But now it's nice and smooth in the majority - I say majority because  3D objects and complex aircraft will still kill frame rates and cause the sim to drop out of vsync but this is where I select a different settings tune in order to then increase the frame rate.

I've lots of addins installed which has the effect of sucking out frames per-second but with the right level of tune things will look great and performance will be pretty great as well.

Plus the latest version 4.5.13 (hotfix #2) has many improvements in enhancing the operation of the sim.

Cheers

Edited October 27, 20196 yr by Rogen

12 hours ago, Rogen said:

Plus the latest version 4.5.13 (hotfix #2) has many improvements in enhancing the operation of the sim.

I'm still on HF1.

Could you expand on the HF2 benefits as you see them?

17 hours ago, Chapstick said:

Keep in mind you can tweak the hell out of your system to minimize stutters but you’ll never eliminate them in P3D.

Like rogen, I used to think that, too.  But now, it's super smooth.  I run similarly to what he reports.

On 10/28/2019 at 4:11 AM, SledDriver said:

I'm still on HF1.

Could you expand on the HF2 benefits as you see them?

Paroose the release notes. https://www.prepar3d.com/news/2019/09/115750/

I like the way you can update the client only, trial it out and if not to satisfaction roll back to the earlier release client.

It's what I've been doing for each release.

1), first give it a week or two to let the third parties get their version updates out.

2), update just the client, see which of addons are affected and needing update.

3), Update said addons.

4), spend some time with the new P3D release to check it out.

5), keep or roll back as required.

 

For the original version 4.5 release I trialled it out then rolled back due to performance issues (lack of performance that is).

Been fine with the hotfixes - not to say each one hasn't brought it's own issues, more like three steps up the ladder and one step back.

I'm getting pretty smooth performance @ 30Hz vsync with almost max settings with some additional tuning as well.

I've added shadow improvements, maxed the vegetation and autogen, set the IMAGE_PIXELS_FOR_AUTOGEN_POLYGONS to 1024, plus a little custom shader work and I've ton of addons in place.

Still... the more performance LM can deliver the better, esp. if they can improve 3D object and complex planes fps results.

Cheers

Edited November 2, 20196 yr by Rogen