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Hi Bernd, thanks for sharing.

My GPU never reaches more than 75-80% so I will leave the upscaling for what it is.

I am interested in knowing if the NV Image Sharpening will work good enough without it. And what settings are advised.

Also zi do not want the image too crisp as that is unrealistic compared to the real world ..

regards, Gerard


Gerard

7940x ( 14 cores ) : 8 cores @ 4.8 - 6 cores @ 4.0 Ghz - Gigabyte X299 Gaming 7 - 32 Gb G.Skill Trident Z 3200Mhz Cl 14 - Gigabyte GTX 2080 TI Windforce OC @1920 Mhz - 1x SSD M2 1800/1800 2TB - 2x  Sata 600 SSD 500 Mb - Thermaltake Level 10 GT case - EKWB Extreme 240 liquid cooling set push/pull - 2x 43” Sony 4K tv's in NVSurround

8700K : all 6 cores @ 5.0 GHz - Asus ROG 370 - 16 Gb 4000 MHz @ 3600 Mhz - Gigabyte GTX 2080 Windforce OC @ 1900 Mhz - 1x SSD M2 1800/1800 2TB - 2x  Sata 600 SSD 500 Mb - 1x 55” Sony 4K tv

My flightsim vids :  https://www.youtube.com/user/fswidesim/videos?shelf_id=0&sort=dd&view=0

 

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9 hours ago, GSalden said:

Thanks for explaining.

As you are using 4K too what settings you find best to work for you.

I actually like the default settings which are 0.50 for sharpening and 0.17 for film grain. That goes both for my ultrawide and 4K. For me, going above it can create noticeable aliasing with objects that are only few rows of pixels wide. That, of course, is highly dependent on AA and other settings that are being used and one value does not fit all.

Seeing as it is very simple feature with realistically only one variable, I would encourage to start with default settings and then move the sharpening slider slightly in both directions to see the results.

 

10 hours ago, AnkH said:

What AA setting you guys use along with this? The reason I ask: I just recently abandonded my 4xSSAA setup for 8xMSAA due to the fact that with my other settings, 4xSSAA results in a slide show as soon as weather is not good anymore. Which is often the case in Europe during autumn. On the other hand, I increased the draw distance of the clouds to the max, to finally have clouds till the horizon.

I am pretty happy with this adjusted setup, but the image slightly suffers from the switch to 8xMSAA and maybe I could compensate with this image sharpening?

I used 4x SSAA before and doing the same now with sharpening applied. MSAA is fair bit "muddier", so sharpening can have a very good effect, or it could create unacceptable level of aliasing. As I am unable to give any specific advice on it, I again would recommend to just try it out with default settings on and see if it works for you. You could also benefit from up scaling mentioned above, seeing as you are GPU bound.

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20 hours ago, spilok said:

Nvidia Driver 441.12 is out now.  Supposedly corrected some things.  I downloaded it and it works fine.  Still uses the Sharpening tool in Nvidia Driver settings.

Stan

Interesting,  I’ll have to update driver as I am getting glitching on tv on windows 10.

hopefully that fixes it.

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Just remember that when you opt to do a clean install, then settings must be restored afterwards as these will be cleaned out.

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I haven't tested this in P3D yet, but the general rule of photo and video processing is that if you already have image quality problems, sharpening will only make it worse.

For sharpening to work you need two things:

1) a good source
2) not to overdo the sharpening.

Sharpening isn't magic. It doesn't make detail which isn't already there. What it does is pamper to the eye's optical acuity, providing crisper edges, but leaving the area between edges mostly untouched (as controlled by the film grain setting), thereby satisfying the eye's desire to see crispness. But if you overdo it, you will have running zaggies along edges and other qualities which will rapidly deteriorate the image.

There is no correct setting. You have to set it to please yourself.

Again the general rule of sharpening is that if you are continually aware of it, you have overdone it.

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4 hours ago, GSalden said:

I am interested in knowing if the NV Image Sharpening will work good enough without it. And what settings are advised.

Also zi do not want the image too crisp as that is unrealistic compared to the real world ..

Well, i´ve tested it right now with and without upscaling. And it works perfect so far. If you want to leave the image resolution as it is for you in P3D the sharpening does his job anyway. I set this to the default values as it´s set by NVidia of you activate sharpening. It makes the image clear enough. As i´ve seen especially the distant view is better so you have a deep field of sharp view. I personally like it but of course its allways a question of the personal taste. 

I´ve also set the imageresolution in P3D down to 1024 x 768 and let the the GPU upscale the image to 1980 x 1080 and this works perfekt for me. It seems that this has eliminated the last microstutters for me. Unless my SIM was running absolutely smooth already before, there was still some sort of microstutters noticable on scenery implemented vehicles like airportbuses passing infront of my cockpit view. Now even those are as smooth as silk. I will let the setting as it´s done now and watch the further behavior.

Very important: Don´t forget to clear the shader cache after changing anything related to image settings.

Cheers 


Bernd

P3D V4.5 -  PC spec: Intel i9-9900 overclocked 5 GHz, 16 GB RAM, GPU Nvidia RTX2080, M2 SSD, Jeehell FMGS on a dedicated Server, PF3 for ATC, MCE, GSX, EFB, AS+ASCA

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just a quick question.  Does deleting the shader folder knock out the TS profiles?  Or will that still all be intact?


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1 hour ago, micstatic said:

just a quick question.  Does deleting the shader folder knock out the TS profiles?  Or will that still all be intact?

They'll be alright. Modification are done in a folder called ShadersHLSL that is in sim root folder. AppData shader folder only contains compiled shaders, not source.

Edited by Evros

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45 minutes ago, BerndB said:

Ich habe auch die Bildauflösung in P3D auf 1024 x 768 eingestellt und die GPU das Bild auf 1980 x 1080 hochskalieren lassen, und das funktioniert perfekt für mich.

Yes, it looks good, but only in windowed mode.
When I switch to full screen to enable G-Sync I only see the lower resolution.

Prost

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Personally, I would not do this. Sorry to say, but you must have a very high tolerance regarding low resolutions (or simply bad eyes...), if you can accept an image that is upscaled from 1024x768 to FullHD or even beyond.


Greetings, Chris

Intel i7-8700K@5.0GHz, 2x16GB 3200MHz CL14 RAM, Gigabyte AORUS 1080Ti, Windows 10 Home 64bit, Prepar3D 4.5

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56 minutes ago, AnkH said:

Personally, I would not do this. Sorry to say, but you must have a very high tolerance regarding low resolutions (or simply bad eyes...), if you can accept an image that is upscaled from 1024x768 to FullHD or even beyond.

I agree with that.

A lower resolution that has been upscaled never looks as crisp as a higher resolution .

 


Gerard

7940x ( 14 cores ) : 8 cores @ 4.8 - 6 cores @ 4.0 Ghz - Gigabyte X299 Gaming 7 - 32 Gb G.Skill Trident Z 3200Mhz Cl 14 - Gigabyte GTX 2080 TI Windforce OC @1920 Mhz - 1x SSD M2 1800/1800 2TB - 2x  Sata 600 SSD 500 Mb - Thermaltake Level 10 GT case - EKWB Extreme 240 liquid cooling set push/pull - 2x 43” Sony 4K tv's in NVSurround

8700K : all 6 cores @ 5.0 GHz - Asus ROG 370 - 16 Gb 4000 MHz @ 3600 Mhz - Gigabyte GTX 2080 Windforce OC @ 1900 Mhz - 1x SSD M2 1800/1800 2TB - 2x  Sata 600 SSD 500 Mb - 1x 55” Sony 4K tv

My flightsim vids :  https://www.youtube.com/user/fswidesim/videos?shelf_id=0&sort=dd&view=0

 

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5 hours ago, AnkH said:

Personally, I would not do this. Sorry to say, but you must have a very high tolerance regarding low resolutions (or simply bad eyes...), if you can accept an image that is upscaled from 1024x768 to FullHD or even beyond.

Agree with that if you just upscale an image by make it larger or by expanding the pixels of the image. The processing of upscaling in this case here is different where additonal pixels are created by the GPU based on the colorinformations of the surounding pixels. Weird is that today a lot of people are buying expensive 4k tv´s or even 8k but there is no tv station which provide 4k stuff. But because of the advanced upscaling technology in actual GPU´s of those OLED or QLED TV´s you get a sharper image in fact.

Just try it out and you will see that it works. I´ve set my SIM resolution down to 1024 x 768 and the NVidia driver upscales it to 1980 x 1080 and there is no quality difference as if i set the SIM to 1980 without upscaling. Well at least now i can see bright areas where is saw dark areas before😜


Bernd

P3D V4.5 -  PC spec: Intel i9-9900 overclocked 5 GHz, 16 GB RAM, GPU Nvidia RTX2080, M2 SSD, Jeehell FMGS on a dedicated Server, PF3 for ATC, MCE, GSX, EFB, AS+ASCA

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5 hours ago, GSalden said:

A lower resolution that has been upscaled never looks as crisp as a higher resolution .

But you mentioned before, that you prefer to have it not too much crisp because it´s unrealistic where i agree into. 😉


Bernd

P3D V4.5 -  PC spec: Intel i9-9900 overclocked 5 GHz, 16 GB RAM, GPU Nvidia RTX2080, M2 SSD, Jeehell FMGS on a dedicated Server, PF3 for ATC, MCE, GSX, EFB, AS+ASCA

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13 hours ago, holliwutt said:

Yes, it looks good, but only in windowed mode.
When I switch to full screen to enable G-Sync I only see the lower resolution.

Prost

Have you tried the following: When you switch on P3D from windowed mode into Fullscreen mode, and after this the upscaling get lost, reopen the NVidia settings and apply the upscaling settings again while you are in Fullscreen and instantly the driver should get it right.


Bernd

P3D V4.5 -  PC spec: Intel i9-9900 overclocked 5 GHz, 16 GB RAM, GPU Nvidia RTX2080, M2 SSD, Jeehell FMGS on a dedicated Server, PF3 for ATC, MCE, GSX, EFB, AS+ASCA

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I still don't entirely understand, do you have a screenshot of this "upscaling" option in the nVIDIA Control Panel?

And even more, I am lost about you explanation some posts before. Changing the resolution should affect even for P3Dv4.5 mainly the load on the GPU, not the CPU. However I understand that the upscaling will be performed entirely by the GPU. But it is still somehow irritating that you see a benefit from reducing the sim resolution from FullHD to 1024x768 on a 9900K with 5GHz.

It is just simply against all my understanding of how an engine works. Or do you have any explanation what exactly needs more CPU power when using FullHD versus 1024x768? I mean, the content of the image is exactly the same, no? Only the resolution is different, means all those things the CPU is calculating and sending to the GPU remain the same.

The ONLY thing I could think of is that with a reduced resolution, some things do not get calculated anymore at all (e.g. autogen in the distance etc.) and this results in a lower CPU load. But those things will then be "lost", even if you upscale the finally rendered image by the GPU.

I will certainly try this as soon as I know where to find this option in the nVIDIA Control Panel. But I doubt that it will convince me, I am really sensitive regarding image quality (e.g. it was really hard for me to accept that my rig can not sustain 4xSSAA in heavy bad weather conditions and night time with DL, so I had to go down to 8xMSAA). I mean, many repaints of AI planes (especially when stripes are used) look just shimmery and bad on a certain distance with 8xMSAA and 1440p. How the heck should those textures look equally good when rendered in 1024x768 and then upscaled? It is basically impossible, otherwise you would have the holy grail in your hands here...

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Greetings, Chris

Intel i7-8700K@5.0GHz, 2x16GB 3200MHz CL14 RAM, Gigabyte AORUS 1080Ti, Windows 10 Home 64bit, Prepar3D 4.5

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