2 minutes ago, Flyfaster said:

Sure here is a start with the publications/specs and manuals. let me know what exact figures you need:

https://cessna.txtav.com/en/citation/cj4

https://www.midcont.net/pdf/citationcj4.pdf

https://www.tadistributors.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/SD-CJ4-Unit-0200-to-TBD-2015-Oct.pdf

https://gist.github.com/anonymous/a2097bd1f6f84a0f0c6228cc1497c393

 

Thanks, I found some of those, but the github link looks promising.

Once I get this A380 a cockpit, I'll switch gears 😉

What I really need is the ISA SL fuel flow, so basically fuel flow at takeoff on an ISA day at sea level. I know roughly what fuel flow should be at cruise, though I'd like to also know it at high speed cruise at 31,000'.

Just now, cwburnett said:

Thanks, I found some of those, but the github link looks promising.

Once I get this A380 a cockpit, I'll switch gears 😉

What I really need is the ISA SL fuel flow, so basically fuel flow at takeoff on an ISA day at sea level. I know roughly what fuel flow should be at cruise, though I'd like to also know it at high speed cruise at 31,000'.

Ok but just FYI we don't flight plan that way. It is blocked so for instance fuel flow hour 1, then each subsequent hour. Obviously understanding takeoff fuel flow is obscenely high relative to cruise climb, cruise etc. 🙂 

I'll try and get everything for both Jets for you standby.

7 minutes ago, Flyfaster said:

Ok but just FYI we don't flight plan that way. It is blocked so for instance fuel flow hour 1, then each subsequent hour. Obviously understanding takeoff fuel flow is obscenely high relative to cruise climb, cruise etc. 🙂 

I'll try and get everything for both Jets for you standby.

Oh, I know, lol. In the past with part 25 aircraft though, I've found a mention of takeoff fuel flow in the limitations or as part of takeoff crosschecks - but maybe not anymore with FADEC and all that jazz. Or, better yet, someone that flies the plane can just tell us. I only fly planes with the spiny things up front or on the wings, so don't have any first hand knowledge. I can guess, though, which is what I've done here. 1350 pph per side takeoff fuel flow. But I could be off by a couple few hundred in either direction.

I'm aiming to consume 1,500 lbs in the first hour, roughly, but need to be able to guide the engine model to start high enough to make that work out...

Edited August 27, 20205 yr by cwburnett

11 minutes ago, cwburnett said:

Oh, I know, lol. In the past with part 25 aircraft though, I've found a mention of takeoff fuel flow in the limitations or as part of takeoff crosschecks - but maybe not anymore with FADEC and all that jazz. Or, better yet, someone that flies the plane can just tell us. I only fly planes with the spiny things up front or on the wings, so don't have any first hand knowledge. I can guess, though, which is what I've done here. 1350 pph per side takeoff fuel flow. But I could be off by a couple few hundred in either direction.

I'm aiming to consume 1,500 lbs in the first hour, roughly, but need to be able to guide the engine model to start high enough to make that work out...

Check out Citation Max. he flies a CJ3. This video in particular shows his cross check on the roll right about 8min mark:

 

Can't you just copy the folder into the community folder and replace the engines.cfg there?

1 hour ago, tweekz said:

Can't you just copy the folder into the community folder and replace the engines.cfg there?

If you mean copy the asobo-aircraft-cj4 folder from Official to Community, the answer is yes...IF you then manually go in and change the name of the package and the name of the aircraft, in both the JSON files and the aircraft.cfg to avoid any conflicts in-sim.

Philosophically, there are three ways to make the mods:

1) Directly mod the aircraft in the "official" folder - downside is that any updates from Asobo will certainly undo this, plus it's just generally not a great idea to muck about in the core file structure when a structure exists to do this outside the core sim files. This is also somewhat complicated for an average user. But, this is where I started...

2) Duplicate the aircraft files into the Community folder, rename that aircraft and mod there. The upside here is that you can keep both the original and modded version. The downside is that this can't be distributed and may be too complicated for the average user.

3) Mod the default aircraft using the Community folder to 'amend' the default aircraft files in MSFS's virtual file system the way Asobo intended. The upside here is an easy drag and drop installation that doesn't in any way change core sim files; the downside is that it can't be easily combined with other mods the way the virtual file system currently works.

The good news is that anyone with the experience and knowledge to do #1 or #2 can easily do that themselves without my help and simply apply the files in my download to either of those methods. So by focusing on #3, it makes the mod generally accessible to users that may not be comfortable with modding core sim files, while at the same time giving more experienced modders access to the raw materials they need to take their own preferred approach and incorporate my changes to engine performance.

Hope that makes sense...

20 minutes ago, cwburnett said:

Hope that makes sense...

Perfect. Love the passion of some people in the community. 😉 Keep it up!

It just occurred to me that the other night, I flew the A320 with the A32NX cockpit instrument mods (stored in Community) in an aircraft with the JetBlue livery (also in community under a separate liveries-a320 mod also stored in community)  Doesn't that fly (no pun intended) in the face of the downside of option 3 that you stated?  Two different mods on a single aircraft type...  Just a thought

Does it work because none of the "same files" are being manipulated?....  IE: the aircraft.cfg is only being altered by one of the mods....

12 minutes ago, bszuch said:

It just occurred to me that the other night, I flew the A320 with the A32NX cockpit instrument mods (stored in Community) in an aircraft with the JetBlue livery (also in community under a separate liveries-a320 mod also stored in community)  Doesn't that fly (no pun intended) in the face of the downside of option 3 that you stated?  Two different mods on a single aircraft type...  Just a thought

 

8 minutes ago, bszuch said:

Does it work because none of the "same files" are being manipulated?....  IE: the aircraft.cfg is only being altered by one of the mods....

Thanks for pointing this out. I guess the answer is, I don't know, but you've piqued my interest and I'll test it. I would have thought that both of those mods would touch aircraft.cfg, but I haven't looked closely (or at all) at the A32NX mods. I actually never tested this, I just took the word of a developer much more knowledgeable than I am. I will look into this, thanks!

46 minutes ago, bszuch said:

Does it work because none of the "same files" are being manipulated?....  IE: the aircraft.cfg is only being altered by one of the mods....

As an update, I did confirm that aircraft.cfg is NOT in the layout.json for the A320NX project, so that could be why...

20 hours ago, cwburnett said:

If you mean copy the asobo-aircraft-cj4 folder from Official to Community, the answer is yes...IF you then manually go in and change the name of the package and the name of the aircraft, in both the JSON files and the aircraft.cfg to avoid any conflicts in-sim.

Philosophically, there are three ways to make the mods:

1) Directly mod the aircraft in the "official" folder - downside is that any updates from Asobo will certainly undo this, plus it's just generally not a great idea to muck about in the core file structure when a structure exists to do this outside the core sim files. This is also somewhat complicated for an average user. But, this is where I started...

2) Duplicate the aircraft files into the Community folder, rename that aircraft and mod there. The upside here is that you can keep both the original and modded version. The downside is that this can't be distributed and may be too complicated for the average user.

3) Mod the default aircraft using the Community folder to 'amend' the default aircraft files in MSFS's virtual file system the way Asobo intended. The upside here is an easy drag and drop installation that doesn't in any way change core sim files; the downside is that it can't be easily combined with other mods the way the virtual file system currently works.

The good news is that anyone with the experience and knowledge to do #1 or #2 can easily do that themselves without my help and simply apply the files in my download to either of those methods. So by focusing on #3, it makes the mod generally accessible to users that may not be comfortable with modding core sim files, while at the same time giving more experienced modders access to the raw materials they need to take their own preferred approach and incorporate my changes to engine performance.

Hope that makes sense...

I tried your mods last night with method number 3. Everything seemed fine until mid way through the flight all my buttons on the panel  and FMC froze. I went back and tried the flight without the mods and the flight was fine. I followed the above instructions, but I am wondering if I did something wrong?

Lee

1 hour ago, Midnight Music said:

I tried your mods last night with method number 3. Everything seemed fine until mid way through the flight all my buttons on the panel  and FMC froze. I went back and tried the flight without the mods and the flight was fine. I followed the above instructions, but I am wondering if I did something wrong?

Lee

FMC/avionics freezing seems to be a common theme across the aircraft still, so probably unrelated, but I guess could be. The only changes are to the engines and a fix for the cabin altitude error some get periodically. The FMC code is elsewhere in the sim and not in the aircraft folder at all, so they're not related from a code perspective.

But, no I don't think you did anything wrong, most likely you encountered a glitch in the default FMS, but if you find that it's repeatable it *could* be related to the change with cabin altitude, I suppose, and I could package up a version of the mod without that fix and only the engine fix pretty easily.

5 minutes ago, cwburnett said:

FMC/avionics freezing seems to be a common theme across the aircraft still, so probably unrelated, but I guess could be. The only changes are to the engines and a fix for the cabin altitude error some get periodically. The FMC code is elsewhere in the sim and not in the aircraft folder at all, so they're not related from a code perspective.

But, no I don't think you did anything wrong, most likely you encountered a glitch in the default FMS, but if you find that it's repeatable it *could* be related to the change with cabin altitude, I suppose, and I could package up a version of the mod without that fix and only the engine fix pretty easily.

Thanks for the update. Yes, there are many, many problems with the whole navigation aspect of MSFS 2020. I almost feel like I've gone back to FS9. I appreciate folks like yourself trying make things better. I will keep trying with and without the mod, and see if anything else comes up.

Lee

 

really dumb question; i installed as per instructions on page 2 (dropped the file in the community folder).

but i cant find the aircraft in the sim menu. does it show up as an additional aircraft? or does selecting the standard CJ4 automatically use this mods?

thanks in advance