I don't want to imagine what we would do without all those highly talented modders.

THANK YOU!  Your work is so much appreciated.

But there are two sides of the same coin. We have mods which improve the things, which is the really good part. But we also need mods for repairing issues which were either broken from the beginning or came later with an update. The latter should become redundant, the sooner the better.

1 hour ago, Nemo said:

I don't want to imagine what we would do without all those highly talented modders.

THANK YOU!  Your work is so much appreciated.

But there are two sides of the same coin. We have mods which improve the things, which is the really good part. But we also need mods for repairing issues which were either broken from the beginning or came later with an update. The latter should become redundant, the sooner the better.

Yes. I think the vast majority here share the same sentiment.

PS. That Skyvan looks like the one from Zell am See! 

I don't totally disagree with the sentiment, but I noticed a few comments yesterday in the big update thread that surprised me - a few people saying they didn't want to use 'mods' because they don't need them in other sims...this really got me shaking my head, as this seems to be more an issue of semantics than anything else.

mods = add-ons = third party software that improves the experience of the base game/sim.

Why do some praise the work of third parties in P3D and XP when they're called 'add-ons', but shun the work of third parties in MSFS when they're called 'mods'? They are the same thing - someone writes new code that adds to or changes default sim/game behavior.

Almost nobody in this community uses a completely vanilla install of FSX, P3D or XP. Why would we expect they would or should use a completely vanilla install of MSFS?

This platform is the most open to add-ins/mods of any in recent history. That's why so many 'mods' have come out of the woodwork for this platform. From what I can tell, numerically there are many more 'add-ons' for this platform than there were for any of the other sims at the same point in their lifecycle. How many items are listed on flightsim.to alone?

There's a lot to be improved in the base platform, nobody can deny that - and not even the MSFS/Asobo teams deny it. But we're also in a situation where the core sim developers are giving a helping hand to payware and freeware third parties with much more enthusiasm than I've ever seen before, especially with respect to FSX or P3D.

Just a little food for thought...

I love community mods. I love mods a lot more then payware, not because it is free but because I try to imagine somebody sitting behind his computer who thinks "I need a tool, but it's not available, lets built it"  Tools like LittleNavMap give me so much pleasure. Or somebody who makes a repaint that appeals to me, or makes the coffee cup that I just wanted.

I'm not amazed when a payware firm delivers a nice plane. Thats their job, that's what I pay for.

I'm amazed when a person that I dont know, who lives in a place that I didnt even know that it exicted, makes something he enjoyed making and now wants to share that with me.

Take a look at FBW or WT, after a hard days work they start on MSFS and  their fix for the latest updat is finished as I wake up.

Edited March 10, 20215 yr by hansb57

Nobody NEEDS to use the mods, including me.  But as good as this sim is out of the box, it would be so much less without the mods, and I probably wouldn't spend so much time with it, as it simply would be as satisfying, or look so good.

And for people who almost like to boast that they don't use them, they are missing out. You do have to be careful of clashes, and keep on top of the updates, but other than that, I wouldn't be without them.

I keep about 10 mods in my community folder, including aircraft enhancements such as the great CJ4, The Garmin, UI mods and scenery enhancements, and the only problem I get is when Asobo accidentally stomp all over them during an update.

Shame about the trees. I wonder what their thinking was with that one. Undocumented again and no explanation, so I suppose we will never understand why. 

Edited March 10, 20215 yr by bobcat999

3 minutes ago, bobcat999 said:

 

Shame about the trees. I wonder what their thinking was with that one. Undocumented again and no explanation, so I suppose we will never understand why. 

What about the trees (default)? they are usually handled better by mod's and third parties anyways.

1 minute ago, jbdbow1970 said:

What about the trees (default)? they are usually handled better by mod's and third parties anyways.

Have a look in the trees thread JDB.  The trees mods (which were excellent compared to default) have been crippled by another undocumented change by Asobo for some unknown reason. Really disappointing.

People need face the fact and be prepared to accept that "mods" (modifying the default) will be broken after every update just like when there are updates to other sims not naming any but I have and others have dealt with this in the past we just live with it and wait for a fix.

Edited March 10, 20215 yr by jbdbow1970

Hardly a day goes by when I don't download a free scenery mod, airport, aircraft, etc. So I would like to thank all of them for enriching my personal simulator experience.  Most of the stuff is amazing and I am grateful for the work they put in.

I mostly download from flightsim to nowadays as there does not appear to be so much on Avsim ir flightsim.com any more.  Does anyone find many other sources to explore?

Edited March 10, 20215 yr by cianpars

If I may disagree with my colleague ever so slightly, I think there is a very minor but still tangible difference between "mods" and "add-ons".   To me a "mod" changes or replaces something core to the game itself, whereas an "add-on", such as a plane or an airport, is purely additive.   Because of their nature there is inherently a slightly higher risk to using mods by this definition.

We strive at Working Title to make sure that everything we do is additive, and doesn't touch core files, so in a way even though we're modifying things like the Garmins and the CJ4, we're a lot less likely to break things outside of what we do.   But even then, we're not perfect and mistakes can happen.   And there's no guarantee that other "modders" are as careful as we are.

That said, even commercial products can break things in a sim:  look at what happened with Zinertek's airport enhancement breaking contrails yesterday.   There are no guarantees, and I think Chris is right to the extent that the line between "mod" and "add-on" is much more nebulous than it has been in other sims because of the flexibility it grants people.

What it comes down to is that people need to be smart consumers with this as with all things.   If you layer every mod you find on top of each other and never update anything you're almost certain to have problems.   But, if you follow the wisdom of crowds, so to speak; and only install things that have a good reputation, like our work, or FBW's, or that of a bunch of other modders whom I am certainly not slighting by not mentioning by name here; and keep them relatively up to date; then you are likely to have few problems and have a much improved and more enjoyable time.

Some people don't want that work or risk, and that's cool.  But I hope they at least keep in mind the lesson that even proven commercial "add-ons" can cause problems, too.

 

Edited March 10, 20215 yr by kaosfere

I try to see it simple. There are mods which were necessary to repair issues like "trees&distance" or "Alaska water height fixes" and there are mods to make things better like "WT G3000" or "TBM 930 improvements". Off course, there is no clear differentiation between those mods. But most important, I'm grateful that we have all of them.

And there I was thinking this was a bit of flattery for our hardworking Moderators... 😉

12 minutes ago, Paul_Yorks said:

And there I was thinking this was a bit of flattery for our hardworking Moderators... 😉

that's a good one :-)    mod, modders, moderators, ...

As easily recognizable, English is not my first language and those abbreviations aren't either my world

Edited March 10, 20215 yr by Nemo

Totally agree! Without modders PC gaming just wouldnt be the same. Wether its Skyrim, GTA5 , Fallout 4, X-Plane 11 or MSFS its the modders constantly giving their valuable time to make the experience better for the rest of us. Shout out to the modder crew 🙂