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rsrandazzo

PMDG Recommendations on Navigraph AIRAC

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Captains-I've just concluded a (much needed) conversation between me, Lefteris and Richard Stefan of Navigraph to see if we can't resolve some of the confusion that has surrounded commercial developers interface to Navigraph's new product line and their plans for the future.The news is all good, fortunately- and we are finally able to give some clear guidance on how the transition from Navdata (freeware) to Navigraph (commercial) AIRAC cycles product will affect you- and what changes you can expect it to have on your PMDG products.PMDG was contacted many months ago regarding the new Navigraph commercial arrangement and we have been in full support of the change taking place about the time the DAFIF information would no longer be available as a free information source. In fact- it has been our expectation that the relationship that Richard Stefan succesfully negotiated will provide better worldwide coverage and ultimately lead to a better customer experience in a broad range of PMDG, LDS, PSS and FeelThere products.Navigraph has been extremely busy making this transition to the new format and unfortunately some miscommunications resulted that led to PMDG and some other commercial developers being given incomplete and somewhat inaccurate information on Navigraph's future plans.I'm not going to go into details- but suffice it to say that Richard was able to correct the mis-information that was sent out- and we are happy to be back on track with a clear understanding of where Navigraph is taking their product line in the future.Thanks to our conversation with Richard I can also give you (finally) some idea of what to expect on the simulation side of the equation. (We've been unable to make any comment- since we weren't able to obtain information from Navigraph until today...)Currently we anticipate all PMDG products will continue to ship with a navdata installation that is current as of the time the product is released to marketing. So the MD11, the 747-400/400F for FSX, the NGX and the A320X will all ship with navdata current as of the date that product releases.We will provide in that product information to assist new customers in finding Navigraph and purchasing a subscription plan to keep their navigation data up to date- just as we have done traditionally with Navdata.Through partnership with Navigraph and PMDG- there will be no incremental product cost for the first set of navigation data, although we will strongly encourage all customers to purchase a subscription for future updates!In short- you should see no changes on the sim-product side, and you would be well advised to set up a subscription service to obtain most current global data from Navigraph.Richard gave me some estimates that he anticipates having the SID/STAR series completed "before year end" and I'm sure we'll all look forward to those.


Robert S. Randazzo coolcap.gif

PLEASE NOTE THAT PMDG HAS DEPARTED AVSIM

You can find us at:  http://forum.pmdg.com

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Thanks for the update as always Robert.


Mike Roth

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As it should be. I also expect PMDG to maintain open access to the programming of SIDSTAR procedures and navigation data format used by the FMC simulation to prevent a sole source situation from arising. This is not an issue if your new products use the same "language;" however, new features or "command constructs" should be available to your customers. Thanks.


Dan Downs KCRP

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Excellent news Robert. Glad you, Lefteris and Richard could come to an understanding that in turn will benefit us all.


Eric Fisher  

 

 

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This is indeed welcome news Robert, I am delighted you have ironed out any problems there may, or may not, have been with Richard and navigraph.I hope other 3rd party developers who have used Richard's service in the past follow your example.Many thanks.Dave

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Guest SAS449

What impact will the Universal AIRAC database format have on existing PMDG products?From NaviGraph (Richard Stefan)website:"We have this universal format now, but currently it

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Guest tmetzinger

>As it should be. I also expect PMDG to maintain open access>to the programming of SIDSTAR procedures and navigation data>format used by the FMC simulation to prevent a sole source>situation from arising. This is not an issue if your new>products use the same "language;" however, new features or>"command constructs" should be available to your customers.>Thanks.I'm with Dan. This is directed at both Richard/Navigraph, and PMDG (and LDS, and...).The key to the success of this hobby has been the extensive "open" environment, so that folks who are willing to do a little work can improve their experience (at their own risk), and other peoples experiences as well if they wish to take the risk.I would be very disappointed if the Navigation data sets became "closed" in future products. I wouldn't mind having to use tools (hopefully free) to deconstruct/modify/reconstruct a new data format, as long as I can correct/enhance the data.Otherwise, I'll end up being an unreasonable jerk (I hear people saying "what's the difference"?) and demand one hundred percent accuracy and completeness for my money.I will also go on the record and say that the new Navigraph data is a very good value for the money - it's much more complete and correct than the DAFIF-derived info we'd seen in the past.Best Wishes,Tim

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Guest tmetzinger

I believe the current products will be left alone, but future products may use the universal format. As long as the "community" can get access to that format so we can correct/enhance the data it will be fine.-Tim Metzinger

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Guest NAVData

Gentlemen,first of all thanks to PMDG (Robert & Lefteris) for the conversation last night and the clear words about my future and about the way of PMDG. We have figured out, that there were some misunderstandings between Navdata/Navigraph and PMDG (and possible all other major addon developer) about the future of the data-updates especially about the "common interface".First of all, i/we won

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Guest SAS449

Clear as crystal Richard.Thanks for the clarification

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I personally would not like the code for new FMC's to be hijacked by one developer with all the keys to modify or add anything.For those like me living in under-published plan areas of the globe like South Africa, we have to update things like sids, stars and airways ourselves.As long as there is an ability for us to integrate and import our own procedures into the FMC freely, we will be happy.Anthing less than that would be limiting and will certianly count against the product.Lets not end up with another monopoly type operation in the FS business.RegardsAnthony ReesSouth Africa

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Guest SAS449

Guess it's just to learn to use the ARINC424 format, then you'll be able to make any procedures you want for the FMC. When it's implemented in the FMC that is, sometime in the future. Suggest wait and see as the best strategy at this point.Perhaps there will be a public .dll that translates clear text files into a structured binary so that you can use text-based sid/star procedure file.Anyway, this still lies in the future, no need to speculate - we may all be dead at that point ;)

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Good news all away around. I've advocated ARINC424 since I learned of the DAFIF's plans to go secure months ago. The transition doesn't have to be rushed because you've found a migration path that is both fully compatible and low cost. The biggest challange to ARINC424 is adopting old procedures with their many layers of conditional legs and fixes, whereas the new RNAV GPS and RNP are ready to go. I look forward to any participation that the user is invited to take part, hopefully soon after you get the SIDSTARS integrated with AIRAC data.Thanks.


Dan Downs KCRP

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Guest tmetzinger

Very nice. Using a standard that is good enough for real ops means that it should be relatively future-proof.Like Dan, I'd be thrilled to act as a guinea pig for any tools designed to let users modify the base data set.

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i also would have been happy with a $5 to $10 increase on the product as whole to include an infinate updates to sid stars an airacs


Cheers Josh Cliff

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