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kevinh

So how goes the MD-11?

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I'll say the same thing I said the last time you asked this question.Haven't you been here long enough, that you know when they are ready, they'll give us information?


Mike Roth

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There is no harm in asking the question every few months or so. The world hasn't stopped spinning, the internet still works and no nuclear meltdowns have occured. I am simply a customer interested in the product they are making. I think if a guy can make that insane thread about a Titanic simulator go on for as long as it did, posing a simple question such as mine would be harmless. If they don't want to answer, thats up to them, not you, so you don't have to play vigilante moderator everytime I make a post. Thanks for your service though.

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Alex, step away from the computer, take a breath, and lighten up.I'm not sure why you think I'm playing, "vigilante moderator", I was merely answering your question. You're right, it is harmless, and I answered it in the way I see correct. What's wrong with answering your harmless question with my harmless answer? Or do you have a double standard for everyone?If you keep asking this question, and the answer keeps being the same, I'm going to keep responding the same way. ;)


Mike Roth

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Alex has a point Mike..To be honest I'm getting bored and fed up with this whole MD-11 thing.. by the time it comes out I'm probably going to have totally lost interest and it'll be for FS11.. so that's one less sale isn't it? It's taken too long now.. and it's been on the site for about 3 years teasing us.. maybe even more.. which I think is a tad silly really isn't it.. If we assume 1 hour a day (which is low).. from each team member.. for 3/4 of the year (again low)? Assuming 5 people are working on the project (I'm sure there are probably more) that's.. 2700 hours give or take for only 2 years.. and it's been on more than that already.. AND bearing in mind what they had 2 years ago.. all those screenshots on the site.. and now an additional 2000 hours min it still seems slow..Now.. the Airbus has now been announced and that'll probably (if we're lucky) be ready for FS11 or FS12.. I mean who knows? 3 years is the standard now for FS11 is certainly realistic and FS12 isn't that unrealistic either.. Problem is how can you start an Airbus for FS11 now.. hmmm? No one has the foggiest about FS11.. We'll have the big song and dance about compatibility again and it'll go round.. and round.. and round.. and round..I mean I KNOW.. they are good products.. and I KNOW.. it takes time.. but why bother announcing something if in reality it probably won't even be available for another 3 years minimum.. Why not announce smaller more managable projects like updates for the 747 and other versions.. like the ER.. the large 747 transport freighter.. etc.. MORE TUTORIALS! what happened to those huh? Simmers have had to release in depth and complete tutorials for the inexperienced in their spare time to compensate..I think releasing stuff like updates and expansions more regularly and keeping the big projects a secret till they are released and surprise us all.. (TA DA!!! MD-11.. enjoy!).. is a much better strategy.. probably would help your cashflow too.. with regular money trickling in.. PMDG could feed us some nice updates which have a quicker turn around here and there.. 747 new panels and guages for other versions.. 747 new liveries.. 747 new tutorials... 747 guage updates.. 747 FMC updates to functionality.. 747ER released.. 747 flight training programme released.. (maybe even your own scenery for a PMDG training airport? That might make a few quid) 747 tutorial pack released.. 747 new sounds (did this already.. and ruddy good it is too!).. etc.. etc.. 747 flight plans released.. etc etc.. a GOOD.. 747-400 fuel planner? WE ALL WANT THAT!!! Look at the number of posts about it! Maybe even one compatible with flight planning tools? I'd even pay for that if it was good! You could then update it for all your new aircraft.. release expansions for it whenever you created a new plane.. see what I mean.. LOADS of possibilities.. :)CheersCraig


Craig Read, EGLL

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well FSX seems to be getting a bashing all over the place , the reviews havent been good and its been forgotten about by simmers in my opinion. All this Vista press etc it just shows that FSX was released at the wrong time in my opinion. Regards the MD-11, yeah i suppose its been a looooong time in development but then again what do i know about the length of time it takes to develop a new aircraft for a flight simulator, the answer to that is zilch! But i happen to agree about extras for the 747-400 its by far the biggest achievement in flight simulation to date and PMDGs best work.


Paul McMahon

Ireland

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Agreed,by far the best post and the best ideas I've seen. I too am at a point that I don't really care for the MD-11 anymore really. When it comes, it comes. God knows how many times I've loaded this page since the MD was launched. Now I hope this is a one time thing. PMDG really deserves a second chance at this. But the way this product is being handled is far from ideal. Saying that posting a true and factual update every now and then, takes away from time to spend developing the MD is a bit over the top. That's far from an excuse. I hope that the next project is handled far better than this. Because I know of another well known company that botched 2 consecutive product launches and their paying the price dearly. I know that PMDG is taking their time to avoid exactly this, but in my opinion if you inform a client (in this case thousands of clients) of a new product, then starve them of any follow up isn't the way to go. I pray for all involved to maintain cool heads and not start a slapping match. Otherwise this thread will get shut and it's true purpose will be obscured.Regards,Xander KooteF/O MD-83


Xander Koote

All round aviation geek

1st Officer Boeing 777

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>Alex has a point Mike..>>To be honest I'm getting bored and fed up with this whole>MD-11 thing.. by the time it comes out I'm probably going to>have totally lost interest and it'll be for FS11.. so that's>one less sale isn't it? It's taken too long now.. and it's>been on the site for about 3 years teasing us.. maybe even>more.. which I think is a tad silly really isn't it..I wanted to stay away from this thread, but this is ridiculous! Especially your comment "it's taken too long now".We are very sorry but people want more realism and that's what they get with the MD-11. It will be a lot more complex than the B744 is. Something like that can't be done in two years, it's just not possible! It takes as long as it takes, the product has to be complete when released....Actually yes it could be done in two years, but then we'd have to pay Michael and Bill who are programming that thing for a full time job, that would mean it couldn't be sold for 50$ however.Remember that A320 that was announced a week ago from Dreamfleet and Reality XP? They also wrote that it had been in development for more than three years, this is just how it works, you can't change that. If you want a simulation as realistic as possible it just needs that much time, period. People want realism? They'll get it! But it needs time!I'm sorry to hear that you'll "loose interest" in the MD-11 when it is done... Though I can't understand how one could just "loose" interest based on the development time it needs. You don't seem to have anything else to fly at the moment, if you had I think you could be a lot more patient and enjoy what you have now. It's not as if there wouldn't be great aircraft around to fly while waiting for the MD-11 is it?No comment about your calculation of needed man hours. Just let me say, you are well well below the real number needed!Now... if you can wait until later this year you'll get an amazing airplane to fly. I know the real aircraft very well, and I know how good the PMDG MD-11 is even being still in heavy development. So trust me, that one will be very beautiful to fly, a great experience and an ultra steep learning curve. It will feel great, even on a desktop simulator.Regards,Markus


Markus Burkhard

 

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"Remember that A320 that was announced a week ago from Dreamfleet and Reality XP? They also wrote that it had been in development for more than three years, this is just how it works, you can't change that. If you want a simulation as realistic as possible it just needs that much time, period.People want realism? They'll get it! But it needs time!"They also waited to announce the product until they had something within months of release.PMDG doesn't really owe anyone anything, none of us have paid for the MD11, etc., but having said that, there is a certain amount of frustration I feel, having followed Bill's progress (as best as one can) since he first gave us a peek over at FSNordic.Seems like ages ago now.I don't really have a good explanation for that frustration, other than to say, maybe a person can only look forward to something for so long before they just get tired of getting their hopes up. That's a bit more dramatic than I intend to sound, but it's as close as I can do.PMDG will release information, and the product itself of course, as they see fit to do, and that's as right as rain, the way it should be. I, and I'd bet most of your customers (including those posting in this thread), have complete respect for all of that, and actually appreciate that you won't rush products out the door on a whim. It's just that after this long, it sure would be nice to have some idea what to expect, that's all, no more, no less.Hope you read this in the spirit it was intended.


Regards,

Brian Doney

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I think one thing we all have to keep in mind is that PMDG is working on 4 aircraft at once. I'm sure if they could divert all of their resources into the MD-11, it would probably be done but they can't. Also keep in mind that FSX played a major role in delaying the MD-11 and the FSX variant of the 747-400. As far as interest in the MD-11, I never really had any. It's not my type of aircraft. I'm a 744 type of person as are many people here. Just keep with the Queen for now (or the NG if you fly that).One very bright side to a delayed MD-11/744 is the fact that FSX is a nightmare for most people. I mean, if it can't run all by it's self, imagine adding the MD-11 or new 744. Then PMDG would have complaints about something they really have no control on. Then we would probably be right back where we started; waiting for new on updates and new products.About asking for progress updates, since it hasn't been awhile, I was getting a bit curious myself. I guess it was only a matter of time before someone popped the question. But it is true; if PMDG has news, I am sure they would tell us what it is.And finally for those little extras people want, 747-400ER(F) please. Just thought I'd ask while I'm here.Ryan GamurotLucky to live Hawai'ihttp://www.precisionmanuals.com/images/forum/supporter.jpg


Ryan Gamurot
 

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>Hope you read this in the spirit it was intended. sure I do!You're right, it has been ages ago when there were first screenshots of the MD-11 panel. But hey that was a project intended as a much smaller scale. First it was a freeware panel only for the model from how where they called again? It was not intended to have something like an FMS in it. Then Michael came along for doing that FMS, still as a freeware project. But then things changed and everything went into PMDG for being a full release including a model, sounds, and very important good flight dynamics. Almost everything has been redone since then, not only once. That's why the MD-11 case is a bit special and it took that many years until now. Remember, Bill was working all alone when he started back then.Now announcing a project early or not, that's something to debate over you're right. The thing with the A320 from Dreamfleet is, with an A320 you could indeed sell enough of them even though some others are doing the very same airplane, just because the A320 is such a popular airplane, everyone wants Airbus. Ok now we have about five(!) groups announcing an A320, that might be a bit much after all, but I think you get my point. Now with the MD-11 it is different. Imagine there were two groups developing one in secret, both investing tens of thousands of hours. This would just make no sense, the marked would not be big enough, and you certainly do need a market to sell it when you invest more than three years of development. So if the market is rather small I think it is best to announce that you are doing one, not that we end up having two of them.About that frustration with the MD-11 taking its time. I could understand that if there was nothing else to fly from the point of that announcement up to the release of the product. However there are a couple of wonderful airplanes to fly, there always were. In fact, more than anyone could fly at the same time. Those should keep everyone busy?Regards,Markus


Markus Burkhard

 

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>Actually yes it could be done in two years, but then we'd have>to pay Michael and Bill who are programming that thing for a>full time job, that would mean it couldn't be sold for 50$>however.Excellent to hear about the price, $50 seems reasonable.

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Guys,We do appreciate the constructive criticism. I'm going to let this thread stand because you're all being civil with it. I just spoke to RSR and he will have an update for you later this week that will explain what's going on...


Ryan Maziarz
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For fastest support, please submit a ticket at http://support.precisionmanuals.com

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Guest m130hub

I am eagerly looking forward to the update from RSR. I think that Markus, and the whole crew at PMDG understand where the FlightSim community is coming from, but I also believe that the time, and dedication that this product will make it their best yet. As Markus said, it should be better than the 744, better!! That makes it easier to wait for the Mighty Dog, and til its release I will continue to enjoy their past works, 737NG, 744, etc. Thanks for being responsive to this thread guys. -Michael Catherman B763 CPT, DAL3516

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