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namida

Flare and Idle thrust

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Because NGX is the first aircraft for FS that implemented Approach Idle and need quite little adjustment for flare,it is time consuming process be familiar with it's character. I usually set idle at 100ft and flare at 50 with othere aircrafts, so I want to know is my behavior is in permissable range.Many cockpit video performing manual landing shows perfectly same as NGX autoland shows, it's hard to change old habit :) Eventually I get used to do that, but still curious I'm doing right or not.Any advice would be appreciate. laugh.png

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I'm going idle anywhere from ~70 to 30 feet. No flare is really needed when I'm landing. Just hold whatever pitch (+0-2 degrees) you have at Vref.

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Guys but I think it is pointless to discuss the NGX "flare" techniques yet, as we don't know what adjustments (if any) will bring the SP1. As PMDG mentioned it is something that will be looked into and most likely there will be changes. So, today pitch 0-2 on landing might change tomorrow.

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Guys but I think it is pointless to discuss the NGX "flare" techniques yet, as we don't know what adjustments (if any) will bring the SP1. As PMDG mentioned it is something that will be looked into and most likely there will be changes. So, today pitch 0-2 on landing might change tomorrow.
Yeah, but the OP wanted advice. Tonight. happy.png

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NGX really doesn't need much flare, but I'm not say to discussing it's attitude, just want to know how people are get used to NGX's new genuine characteristic.Well actually using hud like fighter jets makes landing A LOT easier but, well.. you know.. I want a classic flight at some perspective.. :) I found autoland pushs yoke little bit when descent rate is almost less than 100fpm so I'm trying to do that. xPNowadays I always make NGX floats - up and down (I usually enjoy autoland and didn't practice manual landing much) Thank you guys for kind advices and it's especially impressive zach's style watching Vref instead fpm. I will try that, too!

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I was throttling back at 20 feet and simultaneous slight flare, two degrees. However, I now throttle back at the 30 foot call, and flare slightly, a couple of degrees. I find this better. Incidentally, if you look at the real world HUD videos, you will also see a fare at the 30 foot call.

http://www.youtube.c...tch?v=nGn399xzM-
Martin Wilby

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Well i am still struggling with this one. getting better, but still the odd float or bounce, or just plain hard.

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I throttle back at 50ft, then initiate a flare right after I hear the 20ft call. I lose a lot of airspeed in that last 50ft sometimes so it's something I'm working at step by step to get in close to r/w technique. I think it's pretty difficult to really judge the flare or even complete one with FSX's limited field of view...your peripheral probably gleams a lot more in the real aircraft making it possible to pull off that last 15ft or so flare as mentioned above. For me, it's more a quarter of an inch back on the saitek yoke then any actual visual reference. If the aircraft floats then I just let it. Can't always win.

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The point is there's there's barely any "flare" when landing the NGX. Regardless of the real world or b737.orgs' technique
Boeing did this on purpose. The 800/900's longer fuselage has higher risk of tail strike, and the flare should not be accomplished with much attitude. More discussions here: http://www.pprune.org/tech-log/289527-landing-technique-b737ng.html and http://www.pprune.org/tech-log/10335-difficulty-landing-737-800-true-any-pointers.html

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Wow I found even real world pilot pushes yoke while flare in the movies Wilby linked.Now I know 50ft is a normal height many people and autopilot start flare.. ok I'll practice with this.. And I love pprune! most satisfying answers by googling ends at there. Thank you Nirattisal. Still, the height to set idle thrust is the most subtle part to master! laugh.png

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The smoothest landing I have done yet on the NGX was one where I never idled the thrust. I had remembered to turn the A/T off, but never idled the thrust. It was silky smooth, I had only noticed that I did not idle the thrust because that lovely sound of the spoilers deploying automatically never occured and a quick sweep brought the high fan speed to my attention. But on a proper landing, I idle just when I cross the threshold, or just about to, a second or so prior, and then barely a flare, and I mean barely a flare, at around 20 to 10 feet above the groundthen a nice soft landing on the runway, better than Pete Conrad, way better than Neil Armstrong.

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"Flying" the aircraft to the ground with a bit of thrust do result in typically smooth landings....but you will have all the excess energy to get rid of which isn't always 'convenient'. Although I won't lie it was something I was guilty of it back in glider days...hahahaa

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"Flying" the aircraft to the ground with a bit of thrust do result in typically smooth landings....but you will have all the excess energy to get rid of which isn't always 'convenient'. Although I won't lie it was something I was guilty of it back in glider days...hahahaa
Well in your defense, insufficient energy is a little more critical in a glider than something with engines

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Wow I found even real world pilot pushes yoke while flare in the movies Wilby linked.Now I know 50ft is a normal height many people and autopilot start flare.. ok I'll practice with this.. And I love pprune! most satisfying answers by googling ends at there. Thank you Nirattisal. Still, the height to set idle thrust is the most subtle part to master! laugh.png
Actually I think 50 is too high. The manuals we we were provided with by PMDG say 20 feet for simultaneous throttle back and flare, with the thrust levers reaching idle, ideally upon touchdown. However, as i say, I prefer 30 feet, and the videos seem to confirm that this is a technique adopted in the real world. Obviously each landing is different, if you are coming in too hot, you may decide to reduce thrust to idle earlier. Martin Wilby

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I usually throttle back at about 50-40ft, and then flare at 20-10. By the time i flare, speed drops about 5kts or so, and the plane settles nicely (that is, of course, if i don't pull back too much on the stick, as i am prone to do sometimes). I usually aim for 100-200fpm touchdown rate.

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Let's not go down that route, okay? The moderators have closed one thread on the subject. If you have a problem with 1 degree of pitch, delete the instalation. And like Flaming_Squirrel (who, BTW, doesn't sign his posts as per the forum rules) stated above, it's your loss. Now, back to flaring techniques.

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Yes I know there's another post about attitude of flare and I agree NGX seems little bit low angle than RW video. BUT I don't care it's right or wrong.. at least this post is NOT for it.. We all have flew so many routes with default jets and many other eye candy aircrafts..The good thing is we can learn through their passion, professional, the bad thing is few people wants 100% of realy thing.. (I'm not saying they're wrong!)Despite PMDG advertised it for the most big part of NGX, we have to keep in mind the limitations of simulation genre.. Of course, the more reality the better. So.. yes. Today I landed more than 8 times but all the landings made long long gentle wave! XD (Runway) __~~~~>_____________________

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The only way to say if 737 NGX landing system is good or far from reality is to let real 737 pilots chime in and let us know. IMO, even if I flown her few times only , it seems to me the the fragility is too high, I mean , just land not in smoothest way and the plane crash. I have to say that I perform manual landings only.

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I AGREE If you touch just a little harder then a butterfly this thing will crash.To sensitive to touchdown. Roger Deloge

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The NGX model is realistically modeled that the landing flare part is one of the hardest that I have encountered, yet. Flare too early then the plane will "float" over the runway. Flare too late then the plane will hit the runway "hard." I agree on what they say that you can barely notice the flare on the 737NGX. Once you put power to idle, if you maintain your current attitude, the plane would flare itself. Considering the PMDG NGX to be an "arcade game" is not a good idea...

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I dunno, I am not a real pilot but, if the reality was like NGX I expect a crash 25% of the times a 737 lands and another 25% of the times I expect a float over the runways. The remaining 50% would be good landings instead.

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I dunno, I am not a real pilot but, if the reality was like NGX I expect a crash 25% of the times a 737 lands and another 25% of the times I expect a float over the runways. The remaining 50% would be good landings instead.
The reality is like the NGX, but 737s aren't being constantly crashed because *gasp* it takes lots of training before anyone ever gets to fly one. Anyone expecting it to be easy, especially without training, is kidding themselves.

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