Since I readily admit to not understanding some things in life, let me ask for some clarification, please? Just what exactly is your desired effect in posting in the Flight forum? What is your motivation to do so? What do you personally hope to gain by posting in the Flight forum? I'm really curious and would appreciate your taking the time to explain it to me.

Sorry to jump in here, but this is the EXACT series of questions we ask when people who have NO INTEREST in any part of x plane make highly critical posts in the x plane forums.The common reply? "I'm entitled to my opinion in a public forum"

Sorry to jump in here, but this is the EXACT series of questions we ask when people who have NO INTEREST in any part of x plane make highly critical posts in the x plane forums.The common reply? "I'm entitled to my opinion in a public forum"

Meshman was possibly too subtle but what I presume he was ousting was the fact that you ask those EXACT questions but then it is OK to jump to forums and be the same 'troll'. He wasnt asking mountain man anything, I think he was showing him the hypocrisy by using the same tone, words and sentenced asked of people here.

Edited January 6, 201214 yr by JasonHarris

 

The common reply? "I'm entitled to my opinion in a public forum"

Sorry, I thought your common reply was "retaliate"? :Peace:The interaction between respective camps just points out why there will never be peace in the world, albeit in a very, very microscopic way. Driven by egos and no one brave enough to say "This is not the right thing to do" and then turn and walk away. Or in the case of a forum posting? Hitting the Back button and moving on to another posting.

You thought wrong.My common reply is to simply reply. When someone says "No one will make anything good enough in x plane to compare to anything in FSX", "X Planes flight model is crap, garbage and rubbish and is all just hype **", you think I/we should take that with a grain of salt?Come on, man. It's fine to say "I believe X Planes flight model is not accurate...", but when you start saying crap like "X Planes flight model is garbage..." as if it's FACT, based on half an hour of trying it out, then you're going to get an argument. Want me to be brave? Ok, I've even said this before, it's fine to have an opinion and BELIEVE something. It's fine to even dislike x plane. So if someone dislikes x plane so much, feel free to check out of the x plane forums here at avsim and enjoy that which gives the enjoyment you are looking for. No one is holding a gun to anyones head. No one is forcing anyone to come here and start throwing their knowledge around. If I read opinions that are simply not true.... "oh, my joystick calibration takes 10 minutes and by that time, the demo time runs out"...., then I will call people out on it. The people that have said THAT are liars. Simple as that. I've read posts where people say they get eighty-90 fps in FSX with complex add ons but it goes down to 9 fps in x plane. Another lie. No machine that can run FSX at eighty-90 fps is going to drag x plane down to 9fps.These are the types of posts I retaliate on. When it's a discussion, with a decent amount of maturity, rationality and common sense, then fine. It's a shame it gets dragged down to an FSX vs X Plane debate. And it's always the same people that do it.I've even been called narcissistic. THAT cracked me up. I VERY rarely even mention my stuff, and will more than readily mention and compliment other developers work. Whether for FSX or X Plane. Hardly narcissistic.

The issue should be, will be and MUST BE X-plane v10, the product primarily, as the OP title suggests. Because of the product or lack of a complete, finished, bug-free product, the issue also involves Laminar, it's head, as well as their past and present attitudes, behaviour and practices, which do leave something to be desired.The issue is still and MUST REMAIN : What is Laminar's ROADMAP AND TIMELINE for X-plane v10 ?In the absence of a complete, finished, bug-free, stable product todate, IT IS THE LEAST LAMINAR OWES IT'S PRESENT AND FUTURE / POTENTIAL USER BASE.

Edited January 9, 201214 yr by m_av

You're asking in the wrong forum.If you want a road map and timeline for x plane 10, email austin about it.

You thought wrong.My common reply is to simply reply. When someone says "No one will make anything good enough in x plane to compare to anything in FSX", "X Planes flight model is crap, garbage and rubbish and is all just hype **", you think I/we should take that with a grain of salt?Come on, man. It's fine to say "I believe X Planes flight model is not accurate...", but when you start saying crap like "X Planes flight model is garbage..." as if it's FACT, based on half an hour of trying it out, then you're going to get an argument.

Goran, can I ask what you are talking about? Often through one of these debates you come out with some made up phrases that are not quotes and are not attributed to anyone. What is that about? I have just read this thread backwards, who said anything quite along those lines that brought out this post? Why can't you keep to what is at hand rather than trying to take it a direction you are more comfortable ranting about.

If I read opinions that are simply not true.... "oh, my joystick calibration takes 10 minutes and by that time, the demo time runs out"...., then I will call people out on it. The people that have said THAT are liars. Simple as that.

I am not sure that is quite fair either. When you change your setting do you try them? What does that take? One circuit? about ten minutes. Take off, do a circuit, oops time ran out. How do people arrive to the correct settings without testing and that does take time. I would not flat out call some one a liar if they say they did not get te right settings in 10 minutes.

Edited January 9, 201214 yr by JasonHarris

Goran, can I ask what you are talking about? Often through one of these debates you come out with some made up phrases that are not quotes and are not attributed to anyone. What is that about? I have just read this thread backwards, who said anything quite along those lines that brought out this post? Why can't you keep to what is at hand rather than trying to take it a direction you are more comfortable ranting about.

Jason, feel free the peruse the PMDG forums. Many people have criticized x plane in there and used the terminology I used in that post. Just do a search. They won't do it very often in here. Kinda obvious why they won't.And I'm not ranting at all. I don't know where you got THAT from. At least, I don't feel like I'm ranting. I'm watching my daughter watch youtube videos on the Superman game for PS3 or something and having a laugh with her. I'm far from a ranting "mood". I might seem blunt, but that's just the way I am.

I am not sure that is quite fair either. When you change your setting do you try them? What does that take? One circuit? about ten minutes. Take off, do a circuit, oops time ran out. How do people arrive to the correct settings without testing and that does take time. I would not flat out call some one a liar if they say they did not get te right settings in 10 minutes.

When someone says it takes them 10 minutes to calibrate their joystick, I see that as going into the calibration screen and setting up the axes. Actually, I remember the quote where someone said they spent 10 minutes in the calibration screen, and when they went back to the sim, the demo time limit expired. THAT was in the PMDG forums.

Jason, feel free the peruse the PMDG forums. Many people have criticized x plane in there and used the terminology I used in that post. Just do a search. They won't do it very often in here. Kinda obvious why they won't.And I'm not ranting at all. I don't know where you got THAT from. At least, I don't feel like I'm ranting. I'm watching my daughter watch youtube videos on the Superman game for PS3 or something and having a laugh with her. I'm far from a ranting "mood". I might seem blunt, but that's just the way I am.

If people are not doing it here, or in this thread then why go on like that, what made you say that here if it was not relevant? As I say, I have seen you do it on a few occasions for no apparent reason. Heck, I could just throw in the middle of a conversation something that upsets me and if someone says ##### I point them off to the internet somewhere. It's not constructive in this thread so no need to go off on tangents. Also, it makes it appear as if someone has been saying something like that to you in thes thread and no one has.

You obviously came in late. There were many heated discussions in here about flight models last year and the year before that.The 4 key players were myself, BStolle, LAdamson and MortenM. Again, I apologize if my bluntess comes across as hostile. I certainly don't mean it. That's why I started prefacing my posts with "forgive me for saying so...", but it seems even that isn't acceptable.Did you see MikeT's "review" and the furore that caused?And that was only a month ago.

You obviously came in late. There were many heated discussions in here about flight models last year and the year before that.The 4 key players were myself, BStolle, LAdamson and MortenM. Again, I apologize if my bluntess comes across as hostile. I certainly don't mean it. That's why I started prefacing my posts with "forgive me for saying so...", but it seems even that isn't acceptable.

I still don't get it, do you randomly pop that stuff in to threads when some conversation pops in to your head from a year ago but doesn't seem overly relevant to the conversation at hand? Did one of them say something in the tone you just pointed out here? If not why don't you start up a new thread with a title like 'Bob, continuing our discussion from september'. I had no idea that quote was from bob last year and you were replying to him. It just doesnt seem right to throw that stuff in as it implying the people you are having a discussion with are saying this to you right now.

Edited January 9, 201214 yr by JasonHarris

I still don't get it, do you randomly pop that stuff in to threads when some conversation pops in to your head from a year ago but doesn't seem overly relevant to the conversation at hand?

You're going off track a bit here. I have to admit, I'm following, so I'll bring it back a notch. You said my common reply was to "retaliate". I said I retaliate to those people that are irrational, as is the case with ridiculous posts about flight model comparisons and joystick calibrations. My most common reply is to just reply, like I have been doing.

You're going off track a bit here. I have to admit, I'm following, so I'll bring it back a notch. You said my common reply was to "retaliate". I said I retaliate to those people that are irrational, as is the case with ridiculous posts about flight model comparisons and joystick calibrations. My most common reply is to just reply, like I have been doing.

You will find that is someone else, dont know who My thoughts are that whole spiel had nothing to do with the thread. If you wanted to deal with something else then deal with it in a better way. I think people reading that are going to say what on earth has been happening in this thread. If you want to be a vocal advocate for LR, which it seems you do you should ask yourself - If I was going for a job to be their PR spokesperson is that the sort of stuff I would say in a press release,in an interview, on a forum. If LR don't think that their PR person would be doing them any favors talking like that then I don't think they would see you as doing any favors for them.

I take it you either didn't bother reading my PM to you, or you did and just decided to completely ignore it.I am by no means trying to be an advocate for LR. I am, you could call it defending a product that I have a vested interest in. And one that I enjoy and one that I BELIEVE is better than the competition. Just the same way the Flight users were fiercely defending Flight before it became known it was going to be just Hawaii. Just the same way another FSX developer said he will ALWAYS defend FSX in these forums if someone criticizes it. So you tell me, what is so different? I'm passionate about x plane. I don't go advertising it in other forums. I do it here. Yet people like Larry Adamson feel the need to post sky and cloud screenshots from FSX in these forums and say that X Planes clouds now look like mashed potatoes and the FSX clouds look better. It seems FSX users are totally excused for getting defensive about FSX in the x plane forums, but X Plane users are not excused for defending x plane in an x plane forum.My replies may seem "confronting" at times, but they're honest. If that's somehow frowned upon, well, what can I say? I don't really like sugar coating. Fault me for it.

I think it interesting that pointing out something FSX does better than X-Plane 10 is "defensive about FSX".Have you ever considered... they're looking for X-Plane to do at least as well, if not better? Especially for the increased price??Neither sim wins the flight dynamics argument. Each has it's strengths and weaknesses. So... that leaves things such as scenery, graphics... etc.If people who own FSX are looking at X-Plane and expect more... I really don't see how that's being "defensive about FSX." I really don't.