Of course, if you have reliable information that Flight will allow freeware, and be open to 3rd party developers to develop and market their own products without permission from Microsoft, and that Flight is generally better than what we have seen from evidence leaked by Beta testers, then I can't argue against what you are saying.Otherwise I don't agree with your prediction because I honestly don't know how the future will unfold. I just know that taking full control of the playing ground, as Microsoft intend to by deciding who and who can't develop for Flight, by taking developer's money, by banning freeware and by preventing end-users from adding anything to it, goes against the open ended architecture culture that has made the MSFS series so popular and established it as platform. It will stifle creativity and interest from genuinely creative developers, and drive away people who wish to customise it themselves, while instead meeting the needs of instant gratification generation - click to buy.I am no fan of X-plane, as it has always been miles behind FSX, but at least its developers don't impose such restrictions and postively encourage development. What choice do I have in the future, when FSX gets too old, and Flight is locked down? X-plane or Prepar3d if I want to create my own scenery.

I know a lot of people don't have a lot of faith in MS... But maybe MS doesn't need 3PD's because they can do things well enough or even better on their own? MS is a big company, bigger then ANY 3PD (obviously) and it has a lot of money so it can buy or hire the people and knowledge they need. One thing is sure (and an absolute FACT: I wasn't kidding when I said 'I know' yesterday): the people who leaked stuff from the beta haven't seen everything yet. I think I now by now why some 3PD's aren't too happy with MS and MS Flight: it is because they may be out of business coming spring.MS is more capable then a lot of people think: they didn't just create what the leaked beta's have shown. We are all in for a nice surprise. MS Flight probably won't give us everything that FSX offers us right away, but what it offers will blow some people out of the water. And some 3PD's too.

Possibly so, but so far we have no evidence at all about Flight being anything more than FSX with little better graphics, ATC dropped and most of the world removed and more arcade stuff. And do you seriously think that prepar3d devs would go out of business and all those pilots who would use Prepar3d for training would go with Flight and start flying carplane in Hawaii? :LMAO:No, Flight is no threat to prepar3d at all. Flight is a flying game, Prepar3d will be simulator for training purposes.I do not know what Flight will be, but this all so positive speculation that seems to be based on nothing... MS is very capable yes, but if they think that they will get more money by going mainstream they will do so. And going mainstream almost always means that hardcore old fans leave the game, no matter what they are saying. I have lots of examples.

Edited January 22, 201214 yr by pvjinflight

And do you seriously think that prepar3d devs would go out of business and all those pilots who would use Prepar3d for training would go with Flight and start flying carplane in Hawaii? :(

Where did I say I was thinking that?!? Nowhere. Don't put things in my mouth which I didn't say, please, thank you. :( I said SOME 3PD's may not be happy with MS Flight and SOME 3PD's may be blown out of the water. I didn't even MENTION Prepar3D...! Let me add though that Prepar3D is indeed no threat to MS Flight (nor is it the other way around) because, as you say yourself, P3D will be a simulator for training purposes... (which is something different then a sim for simmers like you and me.)

I do not know what Flight will be, but this all so positive speculation that seems to be based on nothing...

As I said it isn't speculation and it is not based on nothing. I said this twice: it shouldn't be too hard to read it well. :( But note: I am sure things will be different then we are used to. Some people posted they refuse to call MS Flight a simulator if it doesn't give us the whole globe to fly on. Well, it isn't called MS Globe or MS Earth: it's called MS Flight. Having the the whole globe or not doesn't make the game a sim or not. You may be used to having the entire world in the game, but that does not define it as a sim. In the end (and the beginning) it's about the flying and giving us a believable environment to fly in. Of course there will be people that won't like MS Flight. There isn't a single game or sim in the world that is loved by EVERYBODY. But MS Flight will certainly give us a believable environment to make believable flights in. Some people that are used to flying in FSX may not know what will happen to them when they fly in MS Flight. It will be something else and it will be something better.

Edited January 22, 201214 yr by J van E

Oh dear, there are so many of the same forum names that protested the launch of FSX how ever many years ago, thumping on their version of the holy book that they would never use the "sim" in a pink fit and urging all and sundry to abandon any support of it.Saw the same with FS2002, FS2000, FS98, Fly, Fly II and Pro Pilot... It is a strange sickness that this community periodically suffers from, and then routinely get's over and wholly embraces what they have previously shunned...FS3 and FS4 were a little different as they represented such a quantum leap over what was there before that all those who were there at the time were amazed. Yet back then I remember buying the San Francisco photo real scenery pack amongst others and wow they really generated a sense of excitement, much like each time Orbx releases a new region.I believe that soon enough, with the release of a few regional packs, some add on aircraft and a few utilities, the same will eventuate... Our small group (the so called "hard core" simmers) that have been used to the whole world being available all at once for the last few iterations of MSFS, will embrace Flight's new model readily enough if there is a good enough level of fidelity and authenticity in flight, visual and scenery engines that will take simming to a new level. For the vast majority of Flight's potential user base (the "non-hadrd core simmers), they will not care about any of that, and will buy the add on packages (DLC?) based purely on the excitement factor on a package by package basis.Geoff A, you and I have seen this often enough, does it not present a strange sense of deja vu?I reckon the more things change, the more they stay the same.

I am done with this issue.

Thank you.

Oh dear, there are so many of the same forum names that protested the launch of FSX how ever many years ago, thumping on their version of the holy book that they would never use the "sim" in a pink fit and urging all and sundry to abandon any support of it.Saw the same with FS2002, FS2000, FS98, Fly, Fly II and Pro Pilot... It is a strange sickness that this community periodically suffers from, and then routinely get's over and wholly embraces what they have previously shunned...FS3 and FS4 were a little different as they represented such a quantum leap over what was there before that all those who were there at the time were amazed. Yet back then I remember buying the San Francisco photo real scenery pack amongst others and wow they really generated a sense of excitement, much like each time Orbx releases a new region.I believe that soon enough, with the release of a few regional packs, some add on aircraft and a few utilities, the same will eventuate... Our small group (the so called "hard core" simmers) that have been used to the whole world being available all at once for the last few iterations of MSFS, will embrace Flight's new model readily enough if there is a good enough level of fidelity and authenticity in flight, visual and scenery engines that will take simming to a new level. For the vast majority of Flight's potential user base (the "non-hadrd core simmers), they will not care about any of that, and will buy the add on packages (DLC?) based purely on the excitement factor on a package by package basis.Geoff A, you and I have seen this often enough, does it not present a strange sense of deja vu?I reckon the more things change, the more they stay the same.

Like they say...history repeats... :(

But MS Flight will certainly give us a believable environment to make believable flights in. Some people that are used to flying in FSX may not know what will happen to them when they fly in MS Flight. It will be something else and it will be something better.

To me it already looks outdated when compared to Aerofly FS for example. Flight looks like FSX with some good quality payware addons, which is nothing impressive as its 2012 now. Maybe in 2009 that would have been impressive, but not anymore.

it's about the flying and giving us a believable environment to fly in.

And which way Flight has so far applied with that? At least better than FSX or X plane 10?Anyway that its pretty sure that all hardcore devs such as PMDG, Captain Sim and all others will move to some other simulator than Flight, and that naturally hardcore community will go with them. Its very obvious actually.

Edited January 22, 201214 yr by pvjinflight

I do not know what Flight will be, ......

Ok.Why claims:

Flight is a flying game, Prepar3d will be simulator for training purposes.

???

Edited January 22, 201214 yr by torium

Ok.Why claims:???

Well I meant that at least currently Flight is nothing else than flying game, but naturally I cant know where Microsoft is going to develop it in future.

Well I meant that at least currently Flight is nothing else than flying game, but naturally I cant know where Microsoft is going to develop it in future.

Currently Flight is still in beta, so you are just speculating on what you personally THINK it might be. Why don't you wait until it is released?But I can assure you that Flight is much more than just a "flying game."

Currently Flight is still in beta, so you are just speculating on what you personally THINK it might be. Why don't you wait until it is released?But I can assure you that Flight is much more than just a "flying game."

Usually beta is not too far away from final result. But I hope that you are right after all.

Edited January 22, 201214 yr by pvjinflight

Anyone know how cold it gets in Hawaii?

I believe that soon enough, with the release of a few regional packs, some add on aircraft and a few utilities, the same will eventuate

That won't happen while Microsoft insist on having full control over add-ons and the third part developer market.

But maybe MS doesn't need 3PD's because they can do things well enough or even better on their own?

You obviously have no idea about what it takes to create a decent quality add-on. Quality add-ons are the result of someones passion and inspiration, and the freedom he/she has to develop it how and when they want. For many that's also many a large part of the hobby in the MSFS culture, and it's because of this that there are so many quality freeware add-ons like project Tupolev etc. There has always been this feeling that anyone can start a project, however big or small, and then share it. That is what has made our hobby so great. Lay down restrictions and you kill all that. Nothing will get made unless MS think it will generate enough $$.You think Mcirosft can do it better? No, they can't do it at all. For example, what if you want your own customized local scenery? Will Microsoft provide that so you alone can buy it? No. Microsoft will provide you with what they think will sell, not what you want. If you want your own local customised scenery, you can't have it. You can't even start your own project to make it either. Banned.Quality products are not born out of market research carried out by bureaucratic organisations looking to make loads of money. This is the hallmark of an inferior product that gives nothing new or inspiring to the world. This is why Steve Jobs complained against Microsoft.This is the way the games industry is going - down the path of corporate greed, and the result is low quality games that sell in the millions.

+1 to previous poster. Really if Flight never gets full third party support it will stay as a dream for most of us to get good looking local scenery, unless you happen to live in some nice looking pacific island or something.

But I can assure you that Flight is much more than just a "flying game."

Currently Flight is in beta. We know that because Microsoft announced it. Anyone participating in the beta testing would agree to a Non-disclosure agreement, aka NDA. If you can "assure" us of certain features or developments of Flight, I really have to ask what part of NDA don't you understand? Is it the N or maybe the D or possibly the A?I would wager, given past beta tests and comments (5 years later) of the participants, that there is a forum for feedback and that there are Microsoft representatives who monitor and post in that forum. Go ask them if your comments of assurance fully comply with the NDA that would be in-place.For any person who may want to imply or suggest certain vague references to the testing of Flight might I suggest one thing? Shut the heck up and honor your agreement!