Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

Jim Young

ProATC-X Update

Recommended Posts

I have been asked by some others to start up a new thread regarding ProATC-X to try to bring everyone up-to-date. The latest update is 1043 and the next update is expected to be released soon. Back in June, Al Chock, here at AVSIM, did an excellent short and sweet review of this product and that thread went into 26 pages and 647 posts - http://forum.avsim.net/topic/376905-a-quick-fly-by-of-pro-atc/ . It became difficult to follow for some as no one really has the time to read 647 posts. I have heard that the next release will contain new runway data as the current data in ProATC is out-of-date. I think this will be the major update everyone is really looking forward to getting. I hope so! I had a lot of problems with the bad runway data as ProATC directed me to non-existent runways at KORD. I was able to fix that by going into the database and making sure that runway was not used for takeoff or landings. I think the database and the ability to make edits is one of the best features of ProATC (the best IMHO being the ability to have background ATC during your flight). It would also send me to an existing runway and tell me to hold short and contact ATC but, when I got to that runway and contacted ATC, ATC would tell me to go to the runway and contact them. I heard this is a problem with the AIRAC and runway data which they promise to fix. Right now I think the biggest problem is getting the top of descent to work better. This was a major complaint in the previous threat and it was supposedly fixed in the last update (1043) but it doesn’t work all the time for me. For instance, from Chicago to St Louis I was flying the SID and almost got to my assigned altitude but was told by ATC to descend before getting to the first waypoint after the SID and about 240NM from St Louis! By the time I got to the first waypoint, I was down to FL 4600 and had to fly that all the way to St Louis. It was acting like the first waypoint was the destination. I had to fly the rest of the way at 4600 feet no faster than 250 NM (that’s no fun! If it happens, trust me, end the flight and start again). Flying from LAX to San Francisco, there is no problem whatsoever. So, for me, it’s sort of hit or miss. I did have one successful flight at assigned altitude from Chicago to St Louis but ATC stopped responding at the last waypoint of the Clearance Flight Plan. I never received an Approach Flight Plan. I tried to send in my logs but they are trying to complete the updates and most of the information I have seen on their site is that this problem will be fixed in the next update.

 

The program has come a long way since June when it was first released with a lot of updates. The fact that it is compatible for the most part with PMDG’s 737NGX is one great accomplishment (IMHO again). The implementation of the ProATC.log that you can send them if you have an issue was a great update too as the developers can see exactly what caused the problem and fix it or tell you what you did wrong. I think it will eventually become a great program to replace the default ATC, hopefully after this next update. Just interested in some of the thoughts from some others who are using the program. If someone wants to do another quick review of the program here showing the latest features and fixes, they are most welcomed. I’m pretty busy to do it myself right now. If you have any questions, I will try to answer them though.

 

Best regards,

 

Jim

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Help AVSIM continue to serve you!
Please donate today!

FYI, Update 1100 has been released. Has the ability to import AIRAC data plus some new features. Hopefully this will be the last. I have updated and downloaded the AIRAC data and imported it into ProATC-X. Works well. Testing....

 

Best regards,

Jim

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Jim, I noticed on the Aerosoft NavData Pro that there is an option to use it with ProAtc...please keep us informed about the updates, I have NOT purchased it yet but I'd like too. I watched some youtube videos and I was not impressed. Does this addon give you SID/STARS, how are the Radar Vectors, does it simulate IFR into non-towered Airports with CTAF/FSS?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Does this addon give you SID/STARS, how are the Radar Vectors, does it simulate IFR into non-towered Airports with CTAF/FSS?

 

You will need Aerosoft's NavData Pro if you want to import the latest AIRAC data into the program (I heard they would like to get Navigraph data compatible too). You do receive SID/STARS but no radar vectors. It does not simulate IFR into non-towered airports.

 

Best regards,

Jim

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Jim, I have been following this thread plus the older "Chock" thread regarding ProAtc-X. I did purchase the addon a few days ago after reading that it seems to be a really good FSX atc replacement.

Trying out a default flight plan (KJFK-KBOS), I don't seem to get proper taxi instructions, i.e. parked at gate 1 at JFK (Gate A1 in FSX & P3D) then told to hold short of R/W 04L via V,V,P or in a previous session

with the same FP, R/W 04R via K,K,Q. There were many other taxiways before the instructed ones, they seem to only give three at a time. It also states in the manuel that it helps get you get to the R/W

by quote "pointing the compass needle to the position assigned while taxiing. Thus you always know where to go. Just make sure you stay on taxi-ways while rolling", what does that mean?.

I have installed latest update, but have not yet purchased any new AIRAC data.

 

Any help would be appreciated.

 

 

John.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The taxi instructions are not very realistic IMHO as, for one, you are not located at the same gate in the ProATC Flight Plan. I have seen where some of the gates are not the same as those shown in FSX. But I try to get close. There is no ground controller who's going to jump all over you if you happen to be on the wrong taxiway enroute to your departure R/W so I pull up the overhead view window to see where the runway is located and follow the taxiway that appears to be the fastest route. If I have the PMDG 737 loaded and the FMC programmed, the panel will show the runway location and that gives you some guidance too getting to the proper runway. I heard the gate issue was going to be fixed when the AIRAC update is released but I have the AIRAC data and I'm still confused with the gates in ProATC and those that are shown in the default FSX or an addon airport (I haven't gone to a lot of airports yet but the four I have been too, the data is wrong or difficult to find. I wouldn't be too concerned with this "issue". Same goes when landing. I skip the part where ATC advises me to contact ground after landing and, instead, end ProATC and pull up GSX (Ctrl+F12) and get a gate assigned that way. GSX also provides a follow-me vehicle to follow to the arrival gate so a bit more realistic. If you have FSX ATC turned on, you can also ask the controller there to provide a gate and you can then turn on progressive taxi. FSX ATC will still work even though ProATC is activated. If you don't have the AIRAC data, ProATC will sometimes direct you to a runway but when you get there and ask for takeoff, it doesn't recognize that you are there. So this is a small bug which was fixed with the AIRAC import.

 

Staying on the taxiways while rolling is always advisable as in real life, if you go off a taxiway onto ground or off the taxiway and hit a taxiway sign or light, you can get into real trouble and cost your airline a few thousand. They also don't want you to take shortcuts across parking areas. Hope this helps.

 

Best regards,

Jim

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks Jim for your reply. I have GSX so I shall use that for the arrival gate. I would of thought with all the updates they have released they would of solved the gate problem, perhaps I am

expecting too much. I must admit I really do like the voices, they are very clear and not too quick. But what do think they mean about follwing a compass pointer to the active?.

 

Thanks.

 

John.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Just to keep everyone updated.

The next update of ProATC will be the inclusion of Addon scenery taxiways and Parking.

Date of update: not known at this point in time.

Just in case anyone was going to ask :P

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Are they going to make the voices better, they are just awful and they speak way way to fast?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ron, I think the ATC voices are great and you can make your own and/or download ones created by others.

 

what do think they mean about follwing a compass pointer to the active

 

Okay, now I see what you mean about the compass pointer! I have never used the feature but see how it is done. Check out the taxi instructions video at the following link - http://www.pointsoftware.de/proatcx_e/proatcxflight.html. As you can see, after getting approval to taxi, the pilot changed the setting on the PFD from the Map Display to the VOR or APP display which has the compass display on the PFD. It's like the glideslope feature. Keep the magenta line on line and you'll get to your destination. I haven't tried it but that's what they mean.

 

Best regards,

Jim

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I just watched the videos they have on their website. It looks pretty good. I have 2 questions though...

 

1) Has anyone tried this with Prepar3d?

 

2) The ATC chatter sounds great but are they talking to actual UT2 traffic or is it just random sound effects?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

1) Has anyone tried this with Prepar3d?

 

As I understand it, it will be made compatible with P3D

 

2) The ATC chatter sounds great but are they talking to actual UT2 traffic or is it just random sound effects?

 

The ATC background chatter is random; however, if you are in the approach phase of your flight, only approach ATC will be heard in the background. You can download and add ATC as much as you want and add it to the appropriate folders, CLR, DEP, ARR, ENR, etc. I bought and installed Real ATC as it provides great ATC background for the US. ProATC comes with European ATC only.

 

Best regards,

Jim

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Jim,

 

Thanks for the answers. It's ok that's it's only random chatter but does the program know where the UT2 traffic is and only vector you into the final when it knows you're clear or do you end up too close to other aircraft etc?

 

What Real ATC did you get? Have you got a link? I only really fly in Europe at the moment but I'd like to have a look...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No. It does not know where the UT2 traffic or any AI traffic is located (although the program does state it sees what FSX sees). It is successful 'seeing' some AI like at departure but I haven't seen it moving ground AI traffic out of the way to avoid a crash. I have had several flights where AI traffic will be moving across my arriving runway or lining to takeoff as I approach. So that simply does not work at this time. What I use most of the time is the neat utility called AISmooth that monitors all AI traffic and keeps them out of your way I think mainly so you can takeoff without waiting for 20 AI to arrive and avoid the Go Around feature in the FSX default. You always have top priority. It still doesn't see the AI taxiing on the ground.

 

Best regards,

Jim

 

What Real ATC did you get? Have you got a link?

 

Forgot to add - here's the link to Ralph Zimmerman's collection - http://realatc.net/RealATC.htm.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks Jim, I have crash detection switched off anyway for when I'm on IVAO so it's not the end of the world. Think I might give it a go now.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Chris, I can confirm that ProAtc works in P3D, when you install ProAtc it finds or asks for the location of the saved flight plan folder for FSX, P3D, & PMDG 737NGX.

 

BTW thanks Jim, for explaining the compass pointer query, they don't say in the manuel about changing the PFD.

 

 

John.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The €50 pricetag... will that hold when the program is "finished" or is this a special price for being a betatester - like CaptainSim does with their 0.x releases of products?

 

Not nagging about the price at all, just wondering. :rolleyes:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

BTW thanks Jim, for explaining the compass pointer query, they don't say in the manuel about changing the PFD.

 

Hi John. I tried that compass pointer thingy last night and could not figure out how to get it to work. I guess I'll have to look at the video again (and again). Thanks for pointing that out to me as it was in the manual and who reads the manual? :LMAO: Glad someone does!

 

Best regards,

Jim

 

The €50 pricetag... will that hold when the program is "finished" or is this a special price for being a betatester - like CaptainSim does with their 0.x releases of products?

 

I understand what you are saying and I do not have any inside info but I would be shocked if the price for ProATCX went any higher. You still have to buy the AIRAC data and, if you want more ATC background voices, maybe the price for that too (currently around $20).

 

Best regards,

Jim

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Jim, I think I have figured out the taxi pointer thingy, it seems you follow the direction of the course indicator (green) on the PFD while taxing. I was parked a long way away from

04R at JFK, but followed th C.I and it got me there, but the taxi route I was given by the ground controller was way off.

 

 

John.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

it seems you follow the direction of the course indicator (green) on the PFD while taxing.

 

How do you get that to come up on your PFD? Click the button on the panel to change the setting to VOR or ILS?

 

Best regards,

Jim

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The feature list for this addon seems great, but from general Googling and reading reviews and user comments, it still seems heavily bugged and unreliable, at a large proportion of airports, And price tag really seems unprecedented for this type of addon. $50 maybe, but 50 Euros ..... I'll be voting with my wallet at this stage....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Jim, After geting taxi instructions, click PFD switch to VOR and click centrer of switch which brings up the compass rose with the course indicator, just follow the

direction of the green arrow. Also note this is with the default 737.

 

 

John.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Okay, that's why I didn't see it. I was using the PMDG737. I did the same thing with the PMDG737 and did not see the green arrow. In any case, the PMDG shows the runway in the PFD so you can make that bigger by changing the distance to 5 miles and then just head in the direction of the runway. I think I'm going to do a couple of flights with the default heavies as I have been solely testing lately with the PMDG737. Right now I'm watching live this guy who's going to jump from 120,000 feet above Earth! It's over in the Hangar Chat forum.

 

Best regards,

Jim

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sorry to be overly simplistic here...but I don't get it. This ATC program doesn't even interact with AI traffic which is a feature that is over a decade old and exists on competing products from Radar Contact and ProFlight. It seems to be very buggy and the fact that it simply does use makerunways.exe to sync its database with your addons makes no sense to me. SO in in my overly simplistic view this seems to be a NEW product with LESS features, LESS functionality and MORE buggy than its existing competition?

 

Again, my apologies if I'm being overly simplistic and not seeing the greatness of the program that maybe only owners of the program know about? If so, can someone divulge what these are...because right now I totally don't get the point to this program except to be ANOTHER ATC program on the market that falls short? Am I wrong?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Capt Mike,

 

I appreciate your views. You certainly have a right to make them. Respectfully, I think you're wrong though. For one who's a real Squadron Commander who flies real things for the Civil Air Patrol, I can see some justification in your comments. It is hard to duplicate that on a computer. FSX is a game simulating flight. There are a lot of wantabees who would like to be like you. They all can't so they play a game or tune up on their already real-life flight skills. There are many here who really enjoy this addition to FSX and see it getting better and better. Microsoft is not going to improve the default FSX ATC and Radar Contact has stopped updating and improving that ATC program (which I admit was good back in the FS9 days. I was a loyal supporter). Radar Contact had it's growing pains too! Here's just an example of what they put into Version 4:

 

AI interactions including:


    • Ground traffic frozen to prevent runway incursions while you’re on final.
    • Chatter appropriate to their actions.
    • Detecting AI planes that will cause a conflict in the future.
    • When you’re on final, slow faster planes behind you, and speed up slower planes in front of you.

So they had a lot of growing pains too.

 

The people who are developing this new ATC addon, ProATC-X are working dilligently to improve this product and they are not finished. I agree, there are a lot of issues right now but it is improving almost weekly. The developer is truly dedicated to making this the best ATC program ever. I would venture to say the program will eventually interact with AI traffic. That element of the program is in need of some work.... well a lot of work, especially on the ground. But I think it will eventually happen. But, if it doesn't, I have an ATC program that has a co-pilot who will help me fly my heavy's, a flight crew I can interact with, and I can listen to realistic ATC in the background just like in real life (just to name a few). Let us wantabees and many others here have our fun and play with something that is a little bit better than the default and maybe (in some minds) a lot better than Radar Contact.

 

Respectfully,

Jim

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.