Oh yea, forgot about this one....Here is another Canadian that escaped Canadian Healthcare for the USA...

 

 

If it wasn't for him there would be no song

BTW I love that song 'Sweet Home Alabama'

 

(Just trying to make up for that last Pam Anderson comment folks) :ph34r:

You cannot compare the United States to other nations. We are the third largest country in the world (by population) and our population is very diverse and spread out. Military spending is necessary because the world relies on the US for leadership. We have approximately 12,000,000 undocumented immigrants in our country that have access to healthcare in ER's and clinics. How would the UK, Canada or NZ deal with 12,000,000 people using the system that have no skin in the game?

 

The US is not a perfect country but it bears burdens that other countries do not have to face. Smaller countries with homogeneous populations and strong central governments are able to institute nationalized healthcare far easier that a country like the US. You are talking about an upheaval of 1/6th of our economy and while something needs to be done, I'm not sure the current plan is the right course of action.

 

I am a conservative but I also believe no one should go broke because they get sick or have to go broke before they are eligible for assistance. I honestly do not understand why we have healthcare for the poor (Medicaid), healthcare for vets (VA), healthcare for seniors (Medicare). Why isn't it possible to roll all programs in to one public health insurance agency with capped rates that are determined on a sliding scale based on income AND ASSETS. It would provide competition for the private sector but it wouldn't wipe out the private sector.

You cannot compare the United States to other nations

 

I agree mostly, however the USA had a status in the world before WW1.....that was standoffish.

 

In the history of the USA, Boom Times was before WW1 (Gilded Age), When WW1 came the USA was the last nation to get involved. War was the last thing on its mind.

 

1920's....boom times again.

1930's depression

1940's WAR however USA didn't declared war until it was attacked and dragged into war (after it began).

 

1945 war over. USA never took a standoffish stance ever again.

The other nations like UK stood down and focused on government programs for the people, same for France, Germany, Japan, etc etc etc.....the USA was the one that went off in a direction after WW2. The rest of the world didn't follow the USA after WW2 (other then things like NATO) but not forgetting those government programs for the people.

 

I don't know at this point, what did the USA gain today compared to its allies after WW2, and even more compare it to Germany or Japan????

 

Modern Healthcare was a result of WW2 and the only nation that didn't initiate that from its allies is the USA, even Germany and Japan made it happen

It is all separate because you and some of the rest of us in this thread don't agree with the rulings in America. Every single one of those programs was tacked on after bloodbaths through our government.

 

And while the comment about most Americans being covered, 15% don't have coverage, that amounts to well over 40 million people while low income Americans, 40% of them are not covered. The only real large group of Americans that are covered as a whole are children and thank goodness for that.

You cannot compare the United States to other nations.

 

But there is evidence from the World Heath Organisation that the United States is spending much more on health care in comparison to other counties. Figure HE5.1 shows the USA spends 16% of its GDP on healthcare: France (the next highest country) spends only 11.5%. By comparision the UK spends only 8.7% - that's about half the United States expenditure.

 

Evidence from the World Bank confirms this. The United State spends $8362 annually per head on health care. France spends $4691, and the UK spends $3503.

We have approximately 12,000,000 undocumented immigrants in our country that have access to healthcare in ER's and clinics. How would the UK, Canada or NZ deal with 12,000,000 people using the system that have no skin in the game?

 

We have a massive problem with so-called 'healthcare tourists' (whether here legally or not) here so don't think that we haven't. People that are taking advantage of the situation - but you have to deal with these cases when it is offered for all. No system is perfect and there will always (and I mean always) be people who play the system.

 

No system is perfect and there will always (and I mean always) people who play the system.

 

Couldn't agree more.

 

 

<br />How would the UK, Canada or NZ deal with 12,000,000 people using the system that have no skin in the game?<br />

 

In New Zealand we are only a population of 4.4 million people. Per capita, we have our fair share of immigration fraud as well. Best way I can put it....The city of Chicago is about equivalent to the population of New Zealand, therefore the issues in New Zealand are about equivalent to the city of Chicago (but with not as many guns).

 

I don't know at this point, what did the USA gain today compared to its allies after WW2, and even more compare it to Germany or Japan????

 

 

Seventy years of relative peace without another world war? Surely even New Zealand benefited from that. And Germany and Japan certainly gained from the treasure expended by the United States on their behalf after the war to rebuild those countries.

In New Zealand we are only a population of 4.4 million people. Per capita, we have our fair share of immigration fraud as well. Best way I can put it....The city of Chicago is about equivalent to the population of New Zealand, therefore the issues in New Zealand are about equivalent to the city of Chicago (but with not as many guns).

 

What? New Zealand's population is only equivalent to Chicago? I thought we were debating over whether or not it is feasible for the US to adopt the healthcare system of a small nation. But New Zealand only actually has to support the population of a city?

Seventy years of relative peace without another world war? Surely even New Zealand benefited from that. And Germany and Japan certainly gained from the treasure expended by the United States on their behalf after the war to rebuild those countries.

 

Not true...never underestimate the smaller nations, since WW2 New Zealand has been involved in:

 

Compulsory Military Training 1949–1959, 1962–1972

Malaysia 1949–1966

Malayan Emergency 1949–1964

Indonesia-Malaysia Confrontation 1963–66

Korean War 1950–1953

Vietnam War 1964–72 http://en.wikipedia....the_Vietnam_War

Kashmir 1952–76

Lebanon/Syria/Israel – UNTSO

Rhodesia: Operation Agila 1979–80

Multi-National Force and Observers 1982–present

Former Yugoslavia 1992–2007

East Timor 1999–2003, 2006

Solomon Islands 2000–present

Iraq 2003–present

Afghanistan

Tonga 2006–present

 

 

You see KevinAu, comments like that are not good because New Zealand has many soldiers lost in the field of battle since WW2.

 

2nd 1st farewell their fallen comrades with a huge haka:

 

 

Haka is used throughout New Zealand by many, not only Māori, to demonstrate their collective thoughts. There is a haka for each of the Services, as well as the Defence Force. Units with the NZ Army have their own haka. This video shows the soldiers of 2/1 RNZIR Battalion performing their Unit haka, powerfully acknowledging the lives and feats of their fallen comrades as they come onto the Unit's parade ground. It is also an emotive farewell for they will leave via the waharoa (the carved entrance way) for the very last time.

 

Haka --sometimes termed a posture dance could also be described as a chant with actions. There are various forms of haka; some with weapons some without, some have set actions others may be 'free style.' Haka is used by Māori (indigenous people of New Zealand) for a myriad of reasons; to challenge or express defiance or contempt, to demonstrate approval or appreciation, to encourage or to discourage, to acknowledge feats and achievements, to welcome, to farewell, as an exp<b></b>ression of pride, happiness or sorrow. There is almost no inappropriate occasion for haka; it is an outward display of inner thoughts and emotions. Within the context of an occasion it is abundantly clear which emotion is being expressed.

But there is evidence from the World Heath Organisation that the United States is spending much more on health care in comparison to other counties. Figure HE5.1 shows the USA spends 16% of its GDP on healthcare: France (the next highest country) spends only 11.5%. By comparision the UK spends only 8.7% - that's about half the United States expenditure.

 

Evidence from the World Bank confirms this. The United State spends $8362 annually per head on health care. France spends $4691, and the UK spends $3503.

 

Exactly. There is something not right with the United States spending $8362 per head. And to institute national healthcare now without doing anything to reduce that number is insane.

 

Not true...never underestimate the smaller nations, since WW2 New Zealand has been involved in:

 

Compulsory Military Training 1949–1959, 1962–1972

Malaysia 1949–1966

Malayan Emergency 1949–1964

Indonesia-Malaysia Confrontation 1963–66

Korean War 1950–1953

Vietnam War 1964–72 http://en.wikipedia....the_Vietnam_War

Kashmir 1952–76

Lebanon/Syria/Israel – UNTSO

Rhodesia: Operation Agila 1979–80

Multi-National Force and Observers 1982–present

Former Yugoslavia 1992–2007

East Timor 1999–2003, 2006

Solomon Islands 2000–present

Iraq 2003–present

Tonga 2006–present

 

You see comments like that are not good because New Zealand has many solders lost in the field of battle

 

 

I never said New Zealand never participated in any military action since WWII. But you have benefited from there not having been WWIII yet. That was all I said in that post.

the world relies on the US for leadership

 

Sorry, I had to laugh at that bit

<br /> never said New Zealand never participated in any military action since WWII.  But you have benefited from there not having been WWIII yet.  That was all I said in that post. <br />

 

The USA has never acted alone since WW2. Remember that the USA is only 4.46% of the world population. Reality is the USA has never been able to accomplish anything without help from its allies. That has always been true. Even NASA has had a tremendous amount of help from its friends, or any other US government program for that matter. So get off your high horse already and be grateful that the USA has always had friends in the world.

 

Even better, travel around the world and see for yourself

The USA has never acted alone since ww2. Remember that the USA is only 4.46% of the world population. Reality is the USA has never been able to accomplish anything without help from its allies. That has always been true. Even NASA has had a tremendous amount of help from its friends, or any other US government program for that matter. So get off your high horse already and be grateful that the USA has always had friends in the world.

 

Even better, travel around the world and see for yourself

 

That's right, the USA has not, and tries not to, act on our collective goals alone. However, the USA has spent much more than others towards those goals. And the acknowledgement that the USA receives for that is "why don't you guys just try cutting your defense spending" and "sorry, I had to laugh at that bit."