I wanted to know if the flight plans that you save using PMDG 737 interchangeable with other planes? For example, a flight plan i saved for the PMDG 737, will I be able to use it in the Aerosoft Airbus X Extended and so forth?

 

Are SID/STAR the quickest way to make a flight plan? Since they already have predefined waypoints and such? I am trying to create a flight plan that goes over one city to another, so I guess I would need to make a custom one from scratch if this is the case?

 

When you create your own custom flight plan for IFR flying, do you also input in the altitude for each waypoint in your route? I am trying to create a flight plan that will be almost fully automated to where I don't have to control the plane at all. Is this possible?

I wanted to know if the flight plans that you save using PMDG 737 interchangeable with other planes?

It depends. Most advanced developers will have their own company route format. PMDG has its own format that works with all of its aircraft, which is not compatible with Level-D aircraft, etc.

 

Here are some instructions I wrote for determining, creating, exporting, and using realistic flight plans with PMDG aircraft. The method works for other company route formats as well: just choose a different export format in step 5 and move the downloaded route to the appropriate folder.

1. Determine your route by searching a realistic database such as FlightAware or the Real-World Flight Plan Database. The latter requires a free registration, but is preferable due to its flexibility (you can personally request flight plans).
   
2. Copy the route, preferably in the format WAYPOINT AIRWAY WAYPOINT . . . .
   
3. Once you have determined your route, go to the Generate Routes section of SimRoutes and complete the fields appropriately. (It is unnecessary to input SIDs and STARs, as they often vary depending on traffic and weather restrictions.)
   
4. Click Generate Route. Use the map to verify the accuracy of your route.
   
5. From the drop-down list, select PMDG as your export format, and click Download Flightplan. Other fields on this page are optional.
   
6. Copy the downloaded route, and move it to your FLIGHTPLANS folder, which should be in the PMDG directory of your FSX root folder.
   
7. Enter the file name in the company routes field of your FMC when you wish to retrieve the flight plan. You can then select SIDs and STARs from the FMC to complete your route.
   

Sorry but you lost me at #7. I thought that SID/STAR are actual pre-defined flight plans for arrival and departures? If I'm understanding correctly, a SID would pre follow your custom flight plan and the STAR would go after it? I'm still trying to understand the concept with SID/STAR.

Sorry but you lost me at #7. I thought that SID/STAR are actual pre-defined flight plans for arrival and departures? If I'm understanding correctly, a SID would pre follow your custom flight plan and the STAR would go after it? I'm still trying to understand the concept with SID/STAR.

 

The basic flight plan will consist of the departure airport;waypoints on the route (which together make up airways); and the arrival airport. How you get from the departure airport to the first waypoint on the route cannot be part of the flightplan as you wont know your departure runway until you get clearance. Same with arrival STAR, you dont know what that will be untill you well into your trip. So SIDS/STARS don't form part of the flightplan per se, but are added to it directly through the FMC.

So adding SID/STAR is an optional step then? Would it be better to add those to your existing flight plan to make the flight more "automated"? I am starting off by making a flight plan from KIAH to KLAX. I am using a common route from flightaware.com. Should I add a SID/STAR to the flight plan or no? There's also Transitions as well.

For example EGLL to EDDF will give you this as one possible flightplan: EGLL SID DVR UL9 KONAN UL607 RIDSU T881 ROLIS STAR EDDF

 

The SID and STAR are undefined as they will depend n runways in use at the dep and arr airports

 

So adding SID/STAR is an optional step then? Would it be better to add those to your existing flight plan to make the flight more "automated"? I am starting off by making a flight plan from KIAH to KLAX. I am using a common route from flightaware.com. Should I add a SID/STAR to the flight plan or no? There's also Transitions as well.

 

Not optional. ATC will tell you to fly a SID or expect vectors

 

The flight plan starts off without SID/STAR. You add them to the FMC when you get clearance.

 

KIAH SID JCT J15 INK J4 EWM J184 BXK J4 MESSI J104 PKE J4 TNP STAR KLAX

I see, so once you get clearance from ATC, does it tell you exactly what SID/STAR to use?

I see, so once you get clearance from ATC, does it tell you exactly what SID/STAR to use?

 

Well, in real life you will be told to fly a specific SID, or expect vectors after take off. You wont be told the arrival STAR until you are into your flight. In FSX ATC-land you wont. If you want more realism look at an ATC program like PFE or Radar Contact.

So adding SID/STAR is an optional step then?

Doing so is technically optional, but using SIDs and STARs effectively facilitates and smooths the departures and arrivals of both your aircraft and other traffic. Pschlute mentioned why SIDs and STARs should not be fixed.

 

Often, the names of the first and last waypoints of your route correspond with the names of good SID and STAR choices, respectively. For example, consider the route (LOWW) SITNI UL856 NEGRA (LSZH). The SID and STAR I use are conveniently titled SITNI 3A and NEGRA 1A, respectively.

 

Narrow your options by (1) eliminating SIDs and STARs that do not fit the capabilities of your aircraft (e.g., non-RNAV aircraft should not use RNAV procedures; propeller aircraft should not use jetliner-only procedures, etc.), (2) eliminating SIDs and STARs that do not fit the runways in use, and then (3) first considering SIDs and STARs with names identical to those of the first and last waypoints of your route.

One simple way is to use FSCommander to input the SIDs and STARS and transitions into a flight plan, after which you can save it into a number of different formats. The new flight plan will not have altitudes (if the aircraft you are thinking of importing it to has), but it is easy to enter than usig the FMC (if availavle).

 

Henri

Which is better...FSBuild or FSCommander?

 

Gregg

 

 

The basic flight plan will consist of the departure airport;waypoints on the route (which together make up airways); and the arrival airport. How you get from the departure airport to the first waypoint on the route cannot be part of the flightplan as you wont know your departure runway until you get clearance. Same with arrival STAR, you dont know what that will be untill you well into your trip. So SIDS/STARS don't form part of the flightplan per se, but are added to it directly through the FMC.

 

I somewhat agree with this, and for the most part I sometimes don't file a SID/STAR on my filed flight plan, however, I do file STAR's quite often: Many real world flight plans have SID's and STAR's on the filed route; you can see that on FlightAware. In many cases the SID or STAR is picked base on direction of flight and transition waypoint, so runway wouldn't matter. In some STARS, after the transition point, the route you fly depends on the runway, but the transition is always based on the direction of arrival so you can still file the STAR. Once you contact the arrival controller and get the runway assignment, you can program or update your FMS, or whatever you're using. If you don't file a STAR, the controller can't assume that you'll fly it, and therefore will either assign vectors to final, or ask you if you have the chart.

I should point out here too that in the US, SIDs and STARs are usually put into the flight plan by the pilot. ATC sometimes changes them depending on certain factors, but if you're flying with ATC in the US and don't put one, ATC may assume you are unwilling to fly one and just vector you. When I am working center and I see a plane without one I just assume they aren't able to fly SIDs and STARs and give them vectors.

 

99% of the flights on flightaware (in the US) include the SIDs and STARs in the flight plan.

 

Here's a route IAH-LAX that I just got off fightaware. The SID and STAR are included.

 

JCT7 JCT EWM J184 BXK TNP SEAVU2

 

Here's another route from JFK to DEN that DOES NOT have a SID (but it does have a STAR)

RBV J230 LARRI J230 AIR APE J178 FWA JOT J60 IOW J10 DSM J10 OBH J100 ELJAY LANDR7

 

The reason for this is that JFK uses what are called radar vectored departures. In that case the plane is told to fly a certain heading from the runway, then the radar controller vectors the plane to their first way point. Something like "Jet Blue 123, cleared direct Robbinsville."

 

It all depends on the airport and the departure procedure.

 

If your goal is to be more realistic then, yes, you should probably learn to use SIDs and STARs.

For example EGLL to EDDF will give you this as one possible flightplan: EGLL SID DVR UL9 KONAN UL607 RIDSU T881 ROLIS STAR EDDF

 

DVR is the SID, but it has four variants

 

These are DVR 5F from RWY 27R, DVR 4G from RWY 27L, DVR 6J from RWY 09R, and DVR 6K from RWY 09L. The filed flight plan must include the DVR SID (otherwise ATC will return it for correction). The variant would be deterimined by the runway in use.

 

The standard routes from EGLL to KONAN published by NATS are:

 

EGLL DVR MC 245 L9 KONAN

EGLL DVR 245 660 L9 KONAN

EGLL DVR 245 660 UL9 KONAN

 

where items after the SID are the minimum and maximum available flight levels.

 

For those interested in flying in the UK the Standard Route Document gives routes between UK airports and between airports and entry/exit points of UK airspace.

Ok thanks guys for the clarification. I learn more each day!