News about the update?

[Stephan83 4]

so on your 580 with all max. you're running 70 fps more then people on a 3770k/4770k with a 780ti?

Hell, i only get 30fps in the ngx and i don't run a pussy system.

Show us the way my leader...!!

 

(Yes, this is sarcasm, i don't believe a word you say about 100fps in the ngx and 10 in the T7)

 

 

Aerosft airbus extended.

[scandinavian13 5,192]

Still loving that people are downvoting posts simply because they don't agree with them.

 

There's a vast difference between disagreeing civilly and disagreeing petulantly.  I'll at least admit there are other viewpoints if they're backed up reasonably.  In another thread I noted some people prefer ATC add-ons over network ATC.  Even though I despise the former, there are definitely merits to them.

 

If I destroy your argument simply because it's weak, why not counter it by coming back with a better argument, or at least bow out gracefully without the knife in the back?

 

:ph34r: Oh man, he picked apart my argument because it was nonsense.  I don't have anything to come back with, so I'll just downvote him.  That'll teach him! :ph34r:

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cowardice

[aceridgey 330]

I am going to go with the trend here. 

 

Kyle, I am support your points a lot of the time but I think you're being unfair to some people who are curious and asking a legitimate question.

 

The fact is, there has been no official word on the progress of updates for the products  (NGX SP2 anyone?). I was under the impression that hotfixes and updates would be quickly and neatly applied when they surfaced with the new operations centre. Even if it's a 5kb update, the operations centre (In theory) should be able to deliver those updates.

 

I think we're all a little frustrated and showing considerable restraint in waiting for a whisper of news, which takes only a couple of minutes to compose in a forum post.

 

My 2 cents, 

[AirborneZed 168]

 

 

Aerosft airbus extended.

 

 

...In the middle of nowhere, in cruise. Sorry, but the claim that you're getting 10fps in the T7 in the Middle of the ocean/nowhere (assuming you're doing a fair comparison) is kinda BS. Post a screenshot of that, please.  Considering 100+fps in the AXE. Again... you're high up and no autogen in being rendered.

[xkoote 57]

Indeed, I do NOT agree with the "It's ready when it's ready" concept. Because I can't say I'll pay you when I'm ready. The 777 is an amazing piece of software. But it is in fact flawed in different areas. PMDG should - make - time available to keep its customer base informed. With that said, I have a proposition to PMDG. And the BETA testers can chime in here.

 

Most jetliners have more or less the same amount of systems, pneumatic, electric, auto flight, hydraulic etc etc. I don't know if PMDG already does this but; instead of just releasing the product to the beta team, give each member a specific chapter to study and test on. e.g. "Kyle, you are testing the hydraulic system". Kyle will then test the system under normal flight, under all failure scenarios and all feature listed in the FCOMs. In that way you have essentially run through the whole FCOM systems descriptions. I don't know if that is the way it is done now but I think this is better then giving them the product without guidelines to work on. Maybe everybody is so set on testing whatever new system the 777 has that small items like the pneumatic systems get overlooked.

 

Just an idea for future products. And again PMDG, we now it's not your main source of income, we know time is short. But I feel it would be a very great idea to make it company policy to release a progress status once a month. Not because it's required. It shows decency and is a simple way of letting your customer base know that you're not in the business of "You will know, read, buy only when I decide it".

 

Kind regards,

[scandinavian13 5,192]

 

 

Kyle, I am support your points a lot of the time but I think you're being unfair to some people who are curious and asking a legitimate question.

 

I don't believe I am.  My responses (at least on this page) are all directed at this idea that there's no communication from a support perspective.  Nowhere did I refer to news about other products, or upcoming service packs.  I won't shoot that question down, though I do always offer the counterpoints:

• Last time some of the issues were more of the showstopper variety where a hotfix was immediately necessary to deliver a flyable product
• Last time people complained that there were too many hotfixes - this time they seem to be trying to put it all into one SP to avoid this issue
• Their time is better spent providing support to those who need it, and finish the fixes rather than posting here

...but to ensure people don't take me the wrong way:

These are simply counterpoints, and not an attempt to refuse to acknowledge that the validity of the points raised.  Life is grey, not black and white.

 

You want things patched as fixed?  Enjoy installing multiple hotfixes.

You don't want to install multiple hotfixes?  You'll wait a little longer.

 

There are people out there who prefer each of these.  It's an unwinnable situation, really.  You're going to upset one group to please the other.  Fact of life.

 

More communication would be nice, but it's not the end of the world if it's not as forthcoming.  I - personally - have nothing against people opining their displeasure with the approach, but there's a right way and a wrong way.  Additionally, I don't feel that it's wrong for me to toss my own opinion into the mix, or (as is more often the case) play Devil's Advocate.

[Kyle Schurb 89]

I don't even own the PMDG B777, but because I am tired of discussions like these showing up at the top of the recently-posted items at Avsim, I will "contribute."

 

The fact that there is, more or less, a "Bug Tracker" topic with known issues they confirmed will be fixed, are currently being worked on, or are investigating, is all the communication frankly that one should expect. It's certainly more than you'll get from plenty of other developers. How many years did they work on this product? Hell, if they wanted a month off, let them have it.

 

Point is, PMDG has a track record of making quality products and fixing legitimate issues in service packs, and the 777 will be no different, certainly. Looking at that bug topic, there are no glaring showstopper issues that can prevent most from enjoying the product. And if not, then put off purchasing software products until the first service pack... that's unfortunately how technology works, particularly nowadays where it's so complex. Any development team only has a set number of testers and individuals can only catch so much. When thousands of people get their hands on it, that's thousands of additional sets of eyes to find and nitpick at things. If you're expecting a perfect release with any piece of software, or sometimes hardware on the first release, you are setting yourself up for disappointment. 

 

I'm quite confident they are working on the problems. Be patient, those items will be fixed. Until then, enjoy what you have, or don't fly it until you see the "Service Pack Released" announcement.

[Don t moderate me this way 882]

Does anyone care to advise me of a better v1.0 release than the PMDG T7 (even though PMDG's version numbering differs)? You do not need to state B777s, any aircraft will do ...

 

The 'issues tracking' thread is almost as comprehensive as a changelog included in a servicepack - except for the fact that hardly any developer has ever come up with such a detailed list before release of their SP.

 

And, BTW, how long ago was the T7 released? It's been no more than 2 months and a couple of days ...

[scandinavian13 5,192]

 

 

Does anyone care to advise me of a better v1.0 release than the PMDG T7 (even though PMDG's version numbering differs)?

 

Apple Maps...duh!

 

 

 

And, BTW, how long ago was the T7 released? It's been no more than 2 months and a couple of days ...

 

I want a Twitter feed update.  Stat.  No fewer than 4 tweets per day about progress.  Personal text or phone call will also work.

 

 

Disclaimer:  This entire post is a joke and is made to add a humorous side to some of the vitriol.  The points are clearly overstated and are not intended to represent the claims or standpoints of anyone participating in this thread.

[Airbusman330 300]

Apple Maps...duh!

 

 

I want a Twitter feed update. Stat. No fewer than 4 tweets per day about progress. Personal text or phone call will also work.

 

 

Disclaimer: This entire post is a joke and is made to add a humorous side to some of the vitriol. The points are clearly overstated and are not intended to represent the claims or standpoints of anyone participating in this thread.

Pffft its all about google maps.

[scandinavian13 5,192]

Pffft its all about google maps.

 

Re-read the comment in context :wink:

[Somebody_Else 7]

Que sera, sera

Whatever will be, will be

The future's not ours to see

Que sera, sera

 

[voodoo101 21]

OMG. This topic has caused a lot for what was a simple question. I love a good discussion but this has gone beyond a joke.

 

I myself love the 777. Yes I would like the update to fix the bugs that have crept through.

 

• Do I think the product should work? No, I paid full price for a full product not to be a beta tester and find bugs. That being said, it is the nature of software that errors come along and patches are made. PMDG and the like cannot plan for every mixture of software and hardware that people may have so I can understand this.
• Do I think PMDG should release a patch now? Again no, They need time to work on the bugs and make sure that nothing else breaks in the process.
• Do I think they should refund people? No because it is not possible. If you buy any other form of media, at least here in the UK, you can only exchange if it's faulty for the same product. Otherwise everybody would be taking things back, getting a refund and then still enjoying it for free.
• Do I think that PMDG should at least give us some information of an update? Yes. Just having a tracking thread is a bit like saying "I know something doesn't work. We've fixed it but not for you". Yes it makes it easier to see if it user fault or not. Yes you can see if there is a work around and try to avoid the same thing happening again, but it still does not fix the problem. I don't really want to have to memorise a list of things not to do, in case I break the sim halfway through a 12 hour flight.

I would be very happy with a message saying "yes we know about these problems, we have fixed them and will be giving you a patch is a few weeks" or "we have fixed some issues but we would rather fix them all and have one package". Just the communication would be nice. PMDG do have a habit of stating one thing and then going silent. To quote a few, the Dash 8 that had a video and then disappeared, the DC6 that appeared on their Facebook page, the 747 v2 that we was told would not be long because they had learnt so much with the 777, which in turn was built on the knowledge gained from the 737. Don't get me wrong, I don't expect PMDG to work to any timescale, to give release date of future updates or previews. Just some information of timescale to supply fixes (not updates) of a product that I have paid my money for.

 

I know that there will be some people on here that are happy to wait. Some people only fly once and a while, some people fly everyday. It is a personal opinion the same as an opinion on what quality to accept. But there is still no need to put people down for asking a question or just because you disagree.

 

I know PMDG are not the worse, nor are they the only ones that need to supply patches. 

[ysfsim 22]

People complained that the 777 was taking too long to release. When it does (and it has some bugs like any software in initial release), they complain again about when the update is released because they are not satisfied with the company's response. PMDG said the 777 would be released when it is ready. It released, and because it is a complex software, it has some bugs. They said the patch will be released when it is ready. I haven had any serious problems with the plane to be honest-mainly because every system is different? I will bet if PMDG released progress reports, there will be complaints about that too in various forms; take your pick: you should work on this system, I want this changed, how about this, how about that etc. At that rate, would this thing be released at all. I got all the PMDG products except for the MD11 (not interested in a trijet) and I bought the 777 asap. Of course an initial release in anything will 90% of the time or more be buggy. Whining and complaining does not speed up the process and neither does status updates. PMDG has a reputation for quality software and all know it that is why you are here and bought their software. Their silence could very well be to focus on their work and not hear the nagging which could lead to unneeded pressure and frustrations. The way some people talk would suggest that PMDG does not want to finish the 777 and fix its issues. I was not on this forum when the ngx came out. Was there the same complaints and such until the service packs came out?

 

BOTTOM LINE: We all know how PMDG operates and if you don't know, you can ask before buying their products. Google is your friend. That being said, a lot of these complaints are unjustified even though there may be a valid point. But like I said, we know how they operate and they have stated it them selves.

Why are refunds and complaints discussions being tossed around like you where owed a favour? I bought the software, bugs and all because I wanted a 777 that is very well made right away. I am not going to complain because it works well enough right now and even if it didn't, it was my decision to buy it right out of the gate. I could have waited some months later and read reviews BEFORE I BUY, to know what I am getting into. Having been a customer, I like their products and will continue to buy knowing that I am getting quality and even if there are problems, it will be fixed. There are some flight sim companies I will never buy from again because of poor products and misleading sales pitches. PMDG has a reputation to keep as the best in the business. It may sound lame but if it is not true, why are you here?

 

good day

 

 

Indeed, I do NOT agree with the "It's ready when it's ready" concept.

Does this mean you also didn't agree with that before the product was released?

I don't even own the PMDG B777, but because I am tired of discussions like these showing up at the top of the recently-posted items at Avsim, I will "contribute."

 

The fact that there is, more or less, a "Bug Tracker" topic with known issues they confirmed will be fixed, are currently being worked on, or are investigating, is all the communication frankly that one should expect. It's certainly more than you'll get from plenty of other developers. How many years did they work on this product? Hell, if they wanted a month off, let them have it.

 

Point is, PMDG has a track record of making quality products and fixing legitimate issues in service packs, and the 777 will be no different, certainly. Looking at that bug topic, there are no glaring showstopper issues that can prevent most from enjoying the product. And if not, then put off purchasing software products until the first service pack... that's unfortunately how technology works, particularly nowadays where it's so complex. Any development team only has a set number of testers and individuals can only catch so much. When thousands of people get their hands on it, that's thousands of additional sets of eyes to find and nitpick at things. If you're expecting a perfect release with any piece of software, or sometimes hardware on the first release, you are setting yourself up for disappointment. 

 

I'm quite confident they are working on the problems. Be patient, those items will be fixed. Until then, enjoy what you have, or don't fly it until you see the "Service Pack Released" announcement.

+1

[Captain Kevin 586]

I think many wished they could vote with their wallet. By that I mean "man up" and offer some who are dissatisfied with a refund. 

 

If PMDG truly believe this is top rate quality software, why hide behind "no refund"?

I know of very few payware companies that actually let you have a refund. Flight1 is the only one I can think of off the top of my head. It's quite simple, really. With downloadable software, what's stopping anybody from claiming they're dissatisfied with it, get a refund, and then continue using it anyway.