What I dont understand is why they can't have multiple forums for developers like LDS. A general forum, a support forum, etc etc. Filter the support forum, but let all posts be made in the general forum. If a stupid post is made, delete it and ban the person who posted it.

I'm in agreement with Tom. I've been a "picster" since day one and have thoughly enjoyed what I've learned at the hands of real world pilots and mechanics on the forum.Lately it has been invaded by idiots who for one reason or another can't be patient for a release date and have personnally attacked some of the development team members. I can't blame Wade and the team for saying enough is enough.Some time back we almost lost the chance of seeing an upgrade to 2002 because of the actions of a childest few. I really don't see the PIC forum being much different than what it was before except those that just want to vent meaningless venom won't be heard. Well so what.

>I certainly am not about to question this. But it all depends>how they actually exercise this 'screening'. Because as>practice shows once you get hold of this power your>"threshold" of sensitivies tend to change and even only>slightly 'difficult' post will get zapped. I tried to post a>few times on the PSS forum and each time I tried to 'censor'>myself before posting to avoid being 'controverial'. It never>got through. I gave up. This taught me lesson to stay away>from such forums/companies. Flight1 and PMDG are in my opinion>exemplary vendors who know how to handle such situations. I couldn't agree more. This is the very first time I've ever seen this kind of tactic on a forum. The PSS forum is a complete joke and very useless. I know I've asked a couple questions on there when I first bought a couple 2002 add-ons and they never got through, so I was left asking elsewhere. To me, they should stop the forum all together. If you're looking to enjoy a product you bought and there's no central place to get help from users and developers alike, then why bother. Flight One, PMDG, and a few others seem to keep things going well in their forums, thus you get excellent customer service in a reasonable amount of time. No matter how large the forums are, there's always people who can moderate by locking or removing bad posts. There's always gonna be trouble posters who troll just to cause trouble as well. It's part of the Internet, dealing with trolls and idiots who waste bandwidth, however, making the rest of us suffer is poor policy. I think people from both sides need to be more tolerant and not take everything so serious. Just moderate like everyone else on the net and kick the users who abuse their privileges.

Tom said," get so tired of those that claim censorhip and discrimination here. I am increasingly getting to the point where I think banning is a good thing. Having 17,500 community members here who want to learn and share is far better than having 18,000 of which some can't get it, don't like it, and have an endless agenda against everything that the community would rather stand for."Here, Here!!!

Well said Tom.Thats what Usenet is for. Plenty of opportunity to be unmoderated there. However you get what you give. Plenty of idiots there as well.

Good. Its a support forum.I happen to like going to forums for support and not wasting my time reading rubbish. In fact, if the team designing the package didn't have to read the rubbish, they will finish the plane quicker :(Ray Keattch.

It seems to be being moderated with a light touch at the moment. It also seems to be civilised. Frankly, some of the things that went on over the last month (and not just relating to release dates)made me look away in horror.The main thing for me is that the delays caused by time zones are minimised.

> Having 17,500 community>members here who want to learn and share is far better than>having 18,000 of which some can't get it, don't like it, and>have an endless agenda against everything that the community>would rather stand for.I am in full support of Tom's comments. I am a moderator at our own forums (flight1) and I know it was mentioned in several posts here that we were among a few dev forums that know how to moderate.I am not sure why that belief is held, but I am pleased that some feel that way, because I assure you a few others don't. Our forum was setup to assist and support users, not to be place that people feel they can say anything they want just because they bought a product. (Or didn

Yeah, yeah, yeah.. and you still owe me four beers. You wimped out on Denver... You had a date with Betti if I recall. But you will be there next year, right? Now its seven.. :)Back at ya dude.

>Yeah, yeah, yeah.. and you still owe me four beers. You>wimped out on Denver... You had a date with Betti if I recall.>But you will be there next year, right? Now its seven.. :)>>Back at ya dude. Har har... A date with Betti? oh man... I owe you at least a dozen now...:-xxrotflmao Yeah, I will definitly try to make it this coming year. Merry Christmas Tom and all the Avsim staff... Here's to ya' :-beerchug Best,Jim

>I am always amazed at some of the attitudes I see in these>forums. What possible justification would there be for>wanting, allowing or otherwise accepting "contraversial">topics in a Vendor's SUPPORT forum? PSS and Wade and company>have made the decision that they don't want to put up with the>BS they have repeatedly seen in thier forums. How can you>possibly question that? It seems to me that there is a>minority in this community who want to be able to say and do>anything that moves them at the moment, without regard for>others, or AVSIM policies. Ain't going to happen. And if that>forces you to choose to go elsewhere, well, you know what they>say about the "door not hitting you on the way out".exactly.their forum,their rules.when it's my forum,i'll make my rules.in the meantime,i'm happy there still is a forum.to all those that cannot understand that simple rule:build your own forum,then put up with exactly the same gibberish as is posted in this thread.until that day:sssshhh.tataJP.

>....... In fact, if the team designing the>package didn't have to read the rubbish, they will finish the>plane quicker :(>>Ray Keattch.Totall agree, the only difference is that now they have to read all the rubbish instead of picking through it.Andy b

>......"contraversial"G i hop this is not a diigg at mi spelinge. If it iz, it wud apier I I ovaestimayted u Mr Allenswurf. I fowt u wud bee mower tolerant and not so qwick to point owt a perzons inadequacies.I cannot cheque if this spelinge is cowect as there does not apier to be a spelinge chequer attached to this fowum so I must a s s ume it iz cowect.fank u four weading this.Andy bEdit: for spelinge cowextion.

My comment here isn't so much aimed at the specific subject of the thread, but there is a commonality. I figure this is as good a place as any to make it. See my post count? Proof I rarely participate here, but it's with good reason. I read these forums daily. I'm part of a silent sect of people who I'm sure are legion, that don't get into the discussions because of the statement I'm about to make. It's not aimed at anyone in particular but it definitely applies to some.I have NEVER, in any of the gaming forums I have ever been in (including the l337 pwnage Counterstrike types) seen some of the ill-mannered, pretentious, anal-retentive, arrogant, and downright rude attitudes that I've seen here. Whether it's a discussion of the merits of one addon package versus another, or those completely innane debates over Airbus vs. Boeing, some of the people who are very active and long-time members of this forum are the biggest jerks I've ever witnessed. I'm sorry, but it makes it hard for people like me who are generally non-confrontational, and just want to get involved in the community to post without fear of some know-it-all twit firing off a snarky remark.Tom, I apologize for just blasting away like this, but I'm going to take the chance that there are many, many others who feel this way. Once upon a time, flight simulation was a gentlemen's hobby in the gaming world (and make no mistake, Flight Simulator is, in fact, a game). While there are quite a few members here who maintain the old school level of integrity, the past 4 or 5 years or so has seen a slow, steady decline in the overall discourse that takes place.Does censoring and banning solve it? Maybe, maybe not. Tom has clearly stated what the deal is here. We're guests in his house, and if he doesn't like how you behave, he can boot you as he pleases. Personally, I admire his patience in dealing with some of the crap that goes on. The purpose of this post was mainly to vent, but I'd implore some of you-- especially you confrontational types that don't like to give an inch in your arguments, be they IFDG versus Posky, or Airbus versus Boeing to do a little thinking before you rattle off something that only does more to polarize opinions and create ill will. It's okay to disagree, but ####, could you be a little NICER about it? Thanks,

What is the problem ? If messages are read before or locked later, what is the difference ?Are other developers fora any better ? Look e.g. in the DF 727 forum. Someone was asking why the control surfaces move without hydraulic pressure. It was locked an hour or so later without the chance to discuss it at all. That was only meant as one example. And before that gets in the wrong throat, I really like their 727. IMO, developers fora are good for "beta testers screenshot flooding" before release, for technical support or for the users to say yes to everything. To really discuss about a product you must go elsewhere anyway. But is that really a new surprise ?! Speaking about fora in general, there are some out there with little or no moderation at all and still good mood. The users themselves manage to "regulate" it. I don't really know why that works in some fora and in some not.Mike