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Businessjets - are you interested?

Businessjets PMDG-Style  

356 members have voted

  1. 1. Are you interested in a Businessjet with PMDG Level systemsimulation and graphics?



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I wonder if Orbx will get flak from Gulfstream for having static GV with their KMRY scenery :rolleyes:  

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Note that I said "we wouldn't really need extreme systems depth if you pick the right aircraft".

 

I was referring more to avionics complexity. The aircraft I listed are not Fly-By-Wire and do not have complex avionics packages (bells and whistles), which often seem to take ages to properly re-create in FSX. 

 

A Challenger 605's avionics package is an order of magnitude more complex than the 601/604. Same for the newer Globals, Hawkers and Citations compared to their older relatives.

 

Much like the DC6 PMDG is currently developing, many of these older aircraft have analog gauges in the cockpit, relatively simple systems and comparatively basic avionics....requiring fewer resources and less time to develop than heavy hitters like the T7, 74 or NGX. That's why I threw in the idea of it being a side project.

 

 

If PMDG insist that they're sticking with tubeliners then so be it. Can't blame them for having a good handle on where their market is. I can keep dreaming though.....

 

Cheers,

David B

It's a mistake to assume analogue gauges mean simple systems. Muliple fuel tanks, hydraulic systems, AC and DC electrics, pneumatics, pressurisation, IFR avionics, etc, are complex systems whether they are analogue or digitally controlled. The DC-6 may be analogue but it's a complex multi-engined aircraft. Similarly FBW isn't a major hurdle. See Ryan's previous statements regarding that (along the lines that all PMDG addons bypass FSX's direct control relationships and so are essentially "fly-by-software"). In simple terms if you can simulate an autopilot you can simulate FBW. Even Wilco/feelthere can manage it. B)

 

I really don't see the necessity for a PMDG business jet. I accept that for some people "only PMDG" will do. But there are a number of more than capable developers out there who have produced good business jet sims in the past. Why not let them get on with their niche market and leave PMDG for their speciality (complex airliners).


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It's a mistake to assume analogue gauges mean simple systems. Muliple fuel tanks, hydraulic systems, AC and DC electrics, pneumatics, pressurisation, IFR avionics, etc, are complex systems whether they are analogue or digitally controlled. The DC-6 may be analogue but it's a complex multi-engined aircraft. Similarly FBW isn't a major hurdle. See Ryan's previous statements regarding that (along the lines that all PMDG addons bypass FSX's direct control relationships and so are essentially "fly-by-software"). In simple terms if you can simulate an autopilot you can simulate FBW. Even Wilco/feelthere can manage it. B)

 

I really don't see the necessity for a PMDG business jet. I accept that for some people "only PMDG" will do. But there are a number of more than capable developers out there who have produced good business jet sims in the past. Why not let them get on with their niche market and leave PMDG for their speciality (complex airliners).

 

Again, like I said before, I was referring more to the avionics. A fully functioning G3000 or Falcon EASY system will be more difficult to program correctly than an analog cockpit. The back end (below the surface) is a different story.

 

Then again...sure.... a 1940's era propliner, and a 1970's business jet will have some system complexity to them...but compared to what's going on below the surface on a modern airliner?... where almost every system has multiple backups, built-in redundancies, with different failure modes and software logic for different situations?

 

As for Fly-by-Wire....I'm pretty sure issues with the FBW logic/behaviour are a major factor in what has delayed the 77L SP1 this long. (please correct me if this is wrong)

 

 

PMDG has proven to consistently be on the leading edge of aircraft simulations for FSX. They have forced many other developers to step up their game, but IMHO, have yet to be surpassed. Of course people will be asking PMDG to put their exceptional talents to work on aircraft they want to see in FSX.

 

If you had a favorite aircraft that had basically no representation in FSX, wouldn't PMDG be first on your list if you had your pick of current developers to work on the project? There are some close seconds for me, but hey...start at the top....there's no harm in asking. (and they've already answered...moving on)

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No, I'm not turned on by business jets. 

 

But then again I'm a strange creature, I work on F16's on a daily basis and I'm starting to find them boring as h***

 

  What do you do?

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As for Fly-by-Wire....I'm pretty sure issues with the FBW logic/behaviour are a major factor in what has delayed the 77L SP1 this long. (please correct me if this is wrong)

One problem with one implementation of FBW does not mean FBW simulation is inherently difficult in FSX. Please read Ryan's comments on the subject, don't take my word for it.

 

PMDG has proven to consistently be on the leading edge of aircraft simulations for FSX. They have forced many other developers to step up their game, but IMHO, have yet to be surpassed. Of course people will be asking PMDG to put their exceptional talents to work on aircraft they want to see in FSX.

Yes but PMDG can't do everything. That's completely unrealistic.

 

If you had a favorite aircraft that had basically no representation in FSX, wouldn't PMDG be first on your list if you had your pick of current developers to work on the project? There are some close seconds for me, but hey...start at the top....there's no harm in asking. (and they've already answered...moving on)

I wouldn't say business jets had been ignored. Also, if PMDG did do your favourite aircraft that means you will have a very long wait for it, given their known workload, compared to other developers taking it on.

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The MD-11 is an awesome aircraft.  I was really stoked they were making it, and bought it nearly immediately after it came out.  Despite the "because it's PMDG" notion, the aircraft did not sell well.

 

Only PMDG know how much profit the MD-11 made, and if it was worth the investment.

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Only PMDG know how much profit the MD-11 made, and if it was worth the investment.

 

What point are you trying to make here?  That I'm just guessing?  They've publicly stated that it didn't sell well.  In fact, it's even in video form as a direct quote from RSR himself...


Kyle Rodgers

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Sure, PMDG might sell more copies of Business Jet A than Some Other Developer, but that doesn't mean it's a viable, profitable endeavor

 

 

Eaglesoft have released numerous business jets, I'm sure they amassed as a decent return on the investment. Same for Flight1, I'm sure they regarded the return on the investment as acceptable. I'm not sure why such an endeavour would no longer be viable... just because it's PMDG.

 

Why do you have that opinion? Do PMDG have greater overheads? Anything else you have in mind? 

 

I still suspect that the reason PMDG shy away from business jets, is that they don't have a close enough relationship with a company to simulate a business jet to their high standards.

 

Flight1 did of course, Flight1 have a close relationship with Cessna. So much so, that the review I wrote for the Mustang and published on Mutley's Hangar, actually appeared on the Cessna home page. [Much to my delight]

What point are you trying to make here?  That I'm just guessing?  They've publicly stated that it didn't sell well.  In fact, it's even in video form as a direct quote from RSR himself...

 

 

That I wasn't aware of. 

 

I detected just a touch of hostility there. Just a semblance. My sub-space emitter is primed, ready to beam a data bust through higher dimensional space, in order to once again tweak your positronic matrix... just so you know.    :smile:   

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Eaglesoft have released numerous business jets, I'm sure they amassed as a decent return on the investment. Same for Flight1, I'm sure they regarded the return on the investment as acceptable. I'm not sure why such an endeavour would no longer be viable... just because it's PMDG.

 

From what I know of the other companies, they're a lot smaller, and I'm not sure what level of dedication their staff has, so I'm not entirely sure they're directly comparable.

 

EDIT: by "level of dedication," I'm talking about time commitment, and presence of other jobs.  I'm not questioning their commitment as employees or anything.

 

I still suspect that the reason PMDG shy away from business jets, is that they don't have a close enough relationship with a company to simulate a business jet to their high standards.

 

Flight1 did of course, Flight1 have a close relationship with Cessna. So much so, that the review I wrote for the Mustang and published on Mutley's Hangar, actually appeared on the Cessna home page. [Much to my delight]

 

That could be it to a certain degree, but when if you think about it, businesses are often born out of a passion.  If your passion is GA, then great.  You're going to sacrifice overall sales because the market is smaller, but if you're okay with that, then go for it.  RSR has mentioned more than a few times that his passion is for the 744.  Under the assumption that you hire people with similar passions and interests, I'm assuming most of the team enjoys working on similarly-sized projects.  Of course, there's the occasional side project (again the DC-6 very closely related to RSR's and the team's interests as noted in the old post about it), but those are aimed at bringing in a little more revenue where it didn't previously exist.

 

So, to speak a little more to my "viable, profitable endeavor" comment, that's subjective to the team, really.  Honestly, I'd love to go sit on a beach and be a lifeguard all day, but given the amount of money I can currently make in other job roles, it's not a viable, profitable endeavor.  Going to the beach is an interest of mine, but when compared to other jobs that could enable that interest, along with many others, it's not a viable option.

 

If PMDG can make more, and are more interested in other projects, a comparably lower volume project isn't a viable, profitable option.  It may be profitable, in and of itself, but to be more correct about how I'm phrasing it, it's not as profitable as where their strengths and attention lie.  In other words, I'm not saying they'd lose money, but there's a massive opportunity cost there.


Kyle Rodgers

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I'd love to go sit on a beach and be a lifeguard all day,

 

Kyle, an awful image of you sitting on a beach in a pair of speedo's has just entered my mind.

 

Kyle, please don't ever do that, no please, don't.

 

:(

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Kyle, an awful image of you sitting on a beach in a pair of speedo's has just entered my mind.

 

Eww...no.  I don't think I'd ever do that, so worry not.  I never have in the past, and I doubt I ever will.

 

The closest you're going to find me to that is my biking shorts, and you can see they come down to just above my knee (not the best picture of them, particularly because you can't see the logo, which I find to be hilarious - the pants have the same logo as the shirt):

IMG_1997.JPG

 

...and yes, this picture was taken because the dude driving the car had some sweet 20s, and I have some sweeter 24s.


Kyle Rodgers

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I think the results of the poll won't really reflect reality of the PMDG customers opinion, since the people that participate in the forum is just a small sample of the costumers and most of us are huge fans that would probably buy anything PMDG produced. Even then we see that about 1/3 would not be interested.

 

I would definitely buy a PMDG Business jet, but I think we all want PMDG to sell successful products that will enable them to grow even more.


Pedro Espindola

PMDG_737ngx_proud_own2_378x68.jpg

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Would rather see some more regional turboprops, than exec jets. apart from the Dash 400 and J31 there are no reasonable models out there for  FSX/P3D. (MJC's Dash 300 and Flight 1's ATR bit long in tooth now) i.e.

Corporate version of JS41

Smaller brother of js 41 - JS31/32

Dash 8 100/200/300 including combi/freight versions

ATR 42/72 -500/600 in passenger and all 3 freighter versions

Saab 340/200 pax/freighter versions

Dornier 228/328/328jet

LET 410

 

also  cs100 and cs300, Sukhoi Superjet, Mitsubishi Rejional Jet would be great.

 

rather see these first than any business jet.

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Would rather see some more regional turboprops, than exec jets. apart from the Dash 400 and J31 there are no reasonable models out there for  FSX/P3D. (MJC's Dash 300 and Flight 1's ATR bit long in tooth now) i.e.

Corporate version of JS41

Smaller brother of js 41 - JS31/32

Dash 8 100/200/300 including combi/freight versions

ATR 42/72 -500/600 in passenger and all 3 freighter versions

Saab 340/200 pax/freighter versions

Dornier 228/328/328jet

LET 410

 

also  cs100 and cs300, Sukhoi Superjet, Mitsubishi Rejional Jet would be great.

 

rather see these first than any business jet.

 

Just FYI:

 

Dash 8 300 - Pretty sure this is Majestic's next project.  (Don't know about the 100/200)

 

Razbam is currently developing an ATR 42-500, SAAB 340 and EMB120. Their Metroliner is surprisingly good as well.

 

 

I would also like to see a Dorner and JS31/32 ....always found them to be  interesting aircraft.

 

Cheers,

David B

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If PMDG was at all interested in Business Jets and they could convince Gulfstream to model their G650, it would be a dream come true.

 

Troy


Troy Kemp

Win 11 64 Pro on 1TB nvme + 500GB ssd  / P3Dv5.3+ on 1TB nvme+ 250GB with P3D addons / MS2020 2TB nvme /I9 13900K@ 5.8ghz / 32GB DDR4 3600mhz / MSI MPG Z690 DDR4 with wifi / RTX 4090FE

 

 

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