It would be useful to know who these "middleman" are, how they actually operate, how the they prevent developers from selling to DoveTail/steeamhow they enforce secrecy on others, and any other actual information you about them.

 

Life to too short spend time researching  parallels in other fields - especially as you dont give any help.

1. Why do we/you need to know all of this?

 

2. If you don't have the time, then move on to something that you do have the time for.

1. Why do we/you need to know all of this?

 

2. If you don't have the time, then move on to something that you do have the time for.

 

Jim, so rightly said!

There are outlets for now for FSX SE at least. However, since DTG isn't likely to be bound by the same restrictions of feature adding for their new upcoming sim, they can easily block anyone from doing anything outside of their restrictions and sue anyone who dares to reverse engineer things to get around their restrictions. The end result will be as Robert Young and Scott Gentile described, either a mass exodus from the new sim by the 3rd party devs, or products devolve down into trash. Either way, another "Flight" occurs.

 

Bottom line, since DTG is effectively demanding slavery from the 3rd party devs now if they want to join in for FSX SE on their Steam channel, where DTG is restricted, can you imagine what they will do when such restrictions are removed? No one is being forced now for FSX SE to bend the knee but that's only because DTG is helpless otherwise. So they tolerate our freedom.

 

And to answer your last question, No. Dovetail's fees fall far short of not being good enough...Its more like outright robbery.

So, if you want to be a dev or supplier to Dovetail, do so, otherwise use one of the many other channels to market/distribute your stuff. No-one is being 'forced'.

 

It is of no practical purpose to rant about any particular company's business plan - to what point? Are we going to see yet another petition on how we want a company to change their ways to suit ...  mmmm, dunno who, actually.

 

Surley (Shirley? Surly? Sorry, dunno how to spell), there are other outlets for the dev?

As the devs have always done! In any case, they way company XYZ does their business is according to their business plan & no-one forces anyone to do business with them The devs have choices!

 

As to who the middlemen are... who cares, instead of worrying about stuff like that, maybe sit back, maybe do some flying, or even some dev work for the rest of us, or are Dovetail's fees not good enough?

 

Jim, so rightly said!

 

I think you need to re-read the above posts. Please read them carefully. Thank you.

I copy Jim, again...

 

 

1. Why do we/you need to know all of this?

 

2. If you don't have the time, then move on to something that you do have the time for.

Actually, the poor devs have their choices..

FSX, FSX:SE, even still FS9, the sim that DTG is aparently going to release, & P3D of course.

Im guessing English isn't your first language so I am willing to repeat myself here. Ill try to make it simple.

 

I wasn't saying FSX SE is a closed program. I was talking about the new simulator that DTG will be developing. The only reason I think DTG hasn't closed up FSX to those who wont toe the line is because of the restrictions imposed on them by Microsoft.

 

And yes, DTG is effectively enslaving those who join them. Or at least showing one aspect of slavery. They eat up all the rewards without lifting a finger in the development of the addon. Someone else does the grunt work and gets "food and board" in return instead of what they have rightfully earned.

lol.... you also in South Africa..

Come & visit, whenever you in Cape Town, & fly our Impala & Shackleton sims..

 

Obviously you are talking about Dovetail's forthcoming release.

Obviously Dovetail cannot close up FSX to those(?) simply because ALL they can do is re-release an 8 year old program with a few non-core mods, as has been mentioned so many times before.

 

I call on one of the 2x enslaved, aviation guru Jane Whittaker, who has just released 'Dangerous Approaches' exclusivly to Dovetail, to discuss the slavery issue.

 

There, I tried to explain, simply to you.

 

FSX is also 'open' format, so, as we know, FSX:SE is basically the same, anyone can add any add-ons they wish, unrestricted. DTG cannot block that, so, they cannot close FSX.

 

Unless I am mistaken, DTG/Steam is distributing whatever that whoever wants them to distribute or redistribute. No developer is forced to join them. DTG do not lift a finger in the development of the addon,why should they, & this is not expected of them.

 

Yes, the devs do the grunt work, in fact ALL the dev work, & they can decide where to market their creations. They know by now, or should, where they can expect the best returns. They, once again, to make it simple , are not forced to market anywhere.

There, I tried to explain, simply to you.

 

FSX is also 'open' format, so, as we know, FSX:SE is basically the same, anyone can add any add-ons they wish, unrestricted. DTG cannot block that, so, they cannot close FSX.

 

Unless I am mistaken, DTG/Steam is distributing whatever that whoever wants them to distribute or redistribute. No developer is forced to join them. DTG do not lift a finger in the development of the addon,why should they, & this is not expected of them.

 

Yes, the devs do the grunt work, in fact ALL the dev work, & they can decide where to market their creations. They know by now, or should, where they can expect the best returns. They, once again, to make it simple , are not forced to market anywhere.

 

Lol....You are saying pretty much what I already said. The point I was making is that if anyone tries to reach the audience through DTG, they get a very lousy deal. So if DTG treating devs so badly where they are restricted (ie FSX SE), chances are they are going to be far worse when they aren't. Anyways, glad that we are seeing most of the same picture now. Ill admit that what I say can seem quite clear and straight to me but not to others.....Comms issues :rolleyes:

 

Would love to try those sims....OT but am rather restricted in means of transport at the moment so when the opportunity arises will gladly pay a visit.

There, I tried to explain, simply to you.

 

 

 

I'm afraid you do have a somewhat simplistic view. Yes everyone is free to market products where they wish. And yes, they do not have to sell through any other portal than those they wish to. I know Jane Whittaker. He's a good review writer and has contributed as a journalist to PC Pilot many times. If you'd care to read my post again, and those of others who know a little bit more about what's going on, you'll see that there are ramifications quite a way beyond your simple explanation which I appreciate is sincerely put.

 

You'll gain a bit more of a feel for what's going on if you had a look at the Rail Simulator DLC comments from long standing DTG customers, both on Steam, and other places which DTG is not able to censor.

Jonathan, phew, as long as we on the same page.

Anyhow, Yup, we got a twin seat Impala sim as well as a full on Shack at our clubhouse, 'Cape Virtual' at Ysterplaat. We just got a spotless Harvard procedural sim as well, from (1992) about your age lol, that we want to get running.As well as mentoring 60 kids (30 juniors, 30 seniors) as part of the 'Young Falcons' project. So, give a call..

 

Robert, no problem, sure my comments are simplified, but based on what you call 'those in the know' have deemed to let us know. Such a pity then, that there is so much secrecy that one cannot make informed comments.

If DTG choses to spend  its money on acquiring a licence from Microsoft and then on developing a new flight simulator, then DTG has the right to do what it wants with it and developers have no rights - unless they contibute to DTGs costs.

 

.

True, DTG got the licence to re-distribute FSX & also to develop their own sim. Their rights are limited to what is within the licence agreement. They do not have the right to do what it wants with it. Of course it cost them to get the licence.

The devs have the right to either opt in or out, dependant on what they think or consider as 'fair remumeration'.

They have to contribute to DTG's costs?? As Robert says about people in the know, & what is being kept from us!!

 

It should be pretty simple, DTG pay the devs a fee, big or small, & this is either acceptable or not by the devs.

 

You say...-- developers have no rights - unless they contibute to DTGs costs.

Are you saying that the devs pay DTG to distribute their wares?

An interesting concept where a guy will pay a distributor to market & sell stuff, instead of the distributor paying them..

 

Or are you saying that DTG will pay 'commission' to the vendor, LESS some sort of  'contribution'?

The conspiracy theorists are out there.... (somewhere).

 

Anyhow,

the topic of this forum is "Kudu's to Dovetail & Vendors"...

not on how the current 2 & all future vendors are being screwed! and the secrecy of others who know more...

My words were (I hope) clear. If DGT meets all the costs of developing a new flight simulator then the developers have no rights.

 

In the UK (an possibly other countries) suppliers pay handsomely to get the supermarkets to feature their products prominently.

 

 

.. the secrecy of others who know more...

  or who may not?

 

Great, "DTG & DLCs" has become the new "P3D Licensing".

 

Stop it, guys. Seriously. Stop.

Sure, if a company develops a new sim, the devs are there to provide addons. What other rights would they have? Like giving one of my clients rights to tell me how to run my company? Nah, not going to happen…