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ahmed.alnoman

B777 Frame rates on P3D

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Hello, 

 

Thanks for this great product and many thanks for supporting P3D. I purchased both the base and -300 package for the B777 on P3D last night. The biggest thing that caught my attention was the frame rates running under the same conditions as with other add-ons (FlyTampa LOWW, and ASN). The frame rates are very low compared to other add-on aircrafts that I'm running on P3D. I have my frame rate locked at 30FPS, usually I get it anywhere between 25 ~ 30. With the B777 the frame rate was between 12 ~ 17. It made it very sluggish. 

 

Any help or advice will be much appreciated.

 

Ahmed Noman

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Hello, 

 

Thanks for this great product and many thanks for supporting P3D. I purchased both the base and -300 package for the B777 on P3D last night. The biggest thing that caught my attention was the frame rates running under the same conditions as with other add-ons (FlyTampa LOWW, and ASN). The frame rates are very low compared to other add-on aircrafts that I'm running on P3D. I have my frame rate locked at 30FPS, usually I get it anywhere between 25 ~ 30. With the B777 the frame rate was between 12 ~ 17. It made it very sluggish. 

 

Any help or advice will be much appreciated.

 

Ahmed Noman

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I also have bought the T7 200-LRF and 300-ER for P3D yesterday. The installations went fine, the OPC did a great job and everything showed up perfectly inside P3D. Liveries installed also like a charm for both A/Cs.

Regarding framerates:

in outside spot view I get 20-25 FPS (ext. locked to 20 via 1/3 vsync nvidia inspector).

In VC view I only get 14 to 17 FPS. But that is o.k. for me because I only have a GTX 425M on a 1stGEN i7 laptop. P3D finally makes use of newest GPU technology. My GPU is over 4 years old (almost first with DX11) and that is simply too old...

I knew when investing in P3D + PMDG A/Cs a new GPU-monster PC becomes obligatory. But I am still on hold for that new PC because P3D's 3D-Vision policy is still obscure... and for me there is no turning back towards flat VC panels...

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Reading these 2 posts, glad to note it is not just me, or my set-up. Admittedly, my GPU is old now, GTX560Ti made by Gigabyte, whose products I will never buy again. Am looking to get a 960, or 970, or a 980

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Frame rates are kind of poor even while flying above 30,000 feet.

Do you also have this huge difference in FPS numbers when switching between VC view and e.g. outside spot view?

(For me everything above stable 20 FPS is well flyable. Just below that is "when the party gets disturbed". Means: I am not dreaming of 60FPS+, just asking for 20FPS+...)

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Heck of a complex add-on, to run in a heck of a resource-intensive platform like P3D.

 

I don't own the PMDG 777 in P3D, but certainly for the Aerosoft A320, I have to turn settings down a lot in P3D, to get to similar frames as in FSX.

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Frame rates are kind of poor even while flying above 30,000 feet.

Looking at your machine Spec,  it doesn't hold much hope for any of us  :rolleyes:

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Same with me, compared to 30-35 fps with other complex addons (airbusx) im getting low 20's at altitude and on the ground with the pmdg 777.  Hope the ngx fares better.

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My spec :

I5 4670k

8gig RAM

MSI GTX 970 twinfrozer IV 1200mhz clock speed (not OC)

 

I get betweem 22-30 fps in VC even in populated area unless I go somewhere like LA. It also is highly depending if I have an FTX Orbx product int that region. I get between 55-60fps in spot view. It's very smooth with no stutter. I also got lots of bell and whistle enable. So you can achieve that if you tweak P3D properly.

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Do you also have this huge difference in FPS numbers when switching between VC view and e.g. outside spot view?

(For me everything above stable 20 FPS is well flyable. Just below that is "when the party gets disturbed". Means: I am not dreaming of 60FPS+, just asking for 20FPS+...)

I get poor frame-rates in VC compared to FSX-MS and FSX-SE, and external views only yield around no more than 20FPS(albeit I have a 30FPS limit). Not exactly the Nirvana I was hoping. I'm hoping for better when I change GPU, cause the CPU and RAM are rock solid.

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Heck of a complex add-on, to run in a heck of a resource-intensive platform like P3D.

 

I don't own the PMDG 777 in P3D, but certainly for the Aerosoft A320, I have to turn settings down a lot in P3D, to get to similar frames as in FSX.

I agree to every single word of your post as it is exactly my experience...

 

In an earlier post on the release I called it "FSXifying" P3D for the sake of flyability.

That actually can not be the target we aimed for.

 

But I am still confident that there will (has to) be a hardware recommendation officially suggested or stated at some point, so that milages vary in reasonable ranges... 

 

I would say folks around here don't want tweaks, they want solutions...

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My spec :

I5 4670k

8gig RAM

MSI GTX 970 twinfrozer IV 1200mhz clock speed (not OC)

 

I get betweem 22-30 fps in VC even in populated area unless I go somewhere like LA. It also is highly depending if I have an FTX Orbx product int that region. I get between 55-60fps in spot view. It's very smooth with no stutter. I also got lots of bell and whistle enable. So you can achieve that if you tweak P3D properly.

I have almost the same specs except my cpu is an old lynfield quad at 3.8. That must be why your fps are slightly higher.  To give pmdg and p3d some credit I will say that p3d looks one million times better than fsx dx10 even with sweetfx.  I am able to use cloud shadows, water reflections, hdr, tesselation, vc shadows etc with almost no impact on fps, the same could not be said of fsx.  Also while the fps number is lower p3d is virtually stutter free.  But thats whats odd, while I cannot seem to increase the fps using any tweaks, the higher settings in p3d dont lower the fps either.  Guess I'll have to live with 22 fps for now.

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I get poor frame-rates in VC compared to FSX-MS and FSX-SE, and external views only yield around no more than 20FPS(albeit I have a 30FPS limit). Not exactly the Nirvana I was hoping. I'm hoping for better when I change GPU, cause the CPU and RAM are rock solid.

Exactly the same experience here. New GPU power on top of my wish list, though providing a 3D-Vision solution is mandatory for me

 

 

 


I am able to use cloud shadows, water reflections, hdr, tesselation, vc shadows etc with almost no impact on fps, the same could not be said of fsx. Also while the fps number is lower p3d is virtually stutter free.

 

That sounds promising. Probably a system like "fogboundturtle"'s would be a nice turnkey solution for meanwhile-tweaking-dislikers.

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Well grabbed the plane last night (just the base version) and on my GTX970 I am honestly getting no better FPS than I do on the FSX version. Outside around 25fps and around 20 in the VC. Yes I have a lot of bars at max like I do on the FSX version so a little disappointed.

 

Barry Hicks

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Well grabbed the plane last night (just the base version) and on my GTX970 I am honestly getting no better FPS than I do on the FSX version. Outside around 25fps and around 20 in the VC. Yes I have a lot of bars at max like I do on the FSX version so a little disappointed.

 

Barry Hicks

You need to be smart on what you enable to max or not. What will give you the best bang of the buck. Per example. I am only using 2xMSAA because I can enable MFAA in the Nvidia panel and I get the same effect as 4xMSAA but at the cost of 2xMSAA. I only use 2048x2048 texture.  I get smart about what object shadow I turn on, cloud distance, etc...I think Rob in the P3D forum section has given screenshot of all his setup and I kinda follow that but tweak it for my own. I also tweak the prepar3d.cfg to get better usage of my CPU core.

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I'm getting a smooth 25 to 35 FPS in the VC depending on the airport and since I use 4x SGSS via NI it depends a lot on the weather.  SGSS has a much bigger impact in P3D than it does in FSX, especially with any cloud cover.  Performance is actually much better than I was expecting given the size and complexity and it is smooth, no stutters.  I thought for sure I was going to have to reduce SGSS to 2x or even turn it off.  VAS consumption is my only concern at this point.  I seem to have a VAS leak somewhere that I didn't have before so I need to isolate and eliminate that now.  I sure haven't had to worry about VAS before in P3D until I installed this bad boy.

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Overclock is still necessary in my case. CPU is still bottleneck in p3d as in fsx before.. Guess p3d have to still resolve this issue.. I am running my i5 3570k on 4.4 and is much better... Cause I like complexity and also visuals.. :) Without overclock is just killing my frames.CPU is working on 100% and my old 660ti not even on 60% so until p3d will use all cpu resources we have to trade performance vs visuals..

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on my GTX970 I am honestly getting no better FPS than I do on the FSX version. Outside around 25fps and around 20 in the VC.

A GTX970 is a quite performant beast...

It was no wonder for me anymore that throwing heavy GPUs against FSX legacy code did not make much sense anymore. CPU power counted most...

But what actually makes me angry is that also in P3D v2.x brilliant GPU power doesn't seem to promise excellent results.

But and BTW the VC view framedrops for the T7 actually must be caused by CPU "overload" or respectively "bottleneck-I-don't-know-what" problems:

outside views (eye candy) accelerated, cockpit views slowed down?

 

(I am dreaming of a turnkey system right now with a toll free number which I can call when the machine is not running at a reasonable pace...)

 

EDIT:

 

 

Overclock is still necessary in my case. CPU is still bottleneck in p3d as in fsx before.. Guess p3d have to still resolve this issue.. I am running my i5 3570k on 4.4 and is much better... Cause I like complexity and also visuals.. :) Without overclock is just killing my frames.CPU is working on 100% and my old 660ti not even on 60% so until p3d will use all cpu resources we have to trade performance vs visuals..

 

exactly this!

Edited by vr-pilot

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Try unlocking your frame rate.  Also, P3D behaves very different from FSX with many tweaks we're used to. Be sure to apply the recommended tweaks provided by LM in a link provided in the Introduction document.  Try starting with a clean board, no changes to the default cfg and NI settings then make changes slowly.

 

I get consistent 25+ fps in the VC except at Aerosoft's Heathrow, and that's the only exception. All FSDT, FlightBeam ect. airports are fine.  I'll reserve comment on Aerosoft for now.

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I am dreaming p3d will add better management of cpu.. Otherwise to get system which can run everything max will cost me more then actual Flight simulator which pilots use to practice.. :lol:

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I'm curious, what does unlocking your frame rate do vs locking other than the obvious and why would you lock for some add-ons and not for others?

 

Edit: I tried unlimited FPS with the T7 at TJSJ and am now getting over 40fps where I was lucky to get 25 before. Any info as to why this happened would be greatly appreciated.

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I am dreaming p3d will add better management of cpu.. Otherwise to get system which can run everything max will cost me more then actual Flight simulator which pilots use to practice.. :lol:

 

This is an limitation with Windows and DirectX 11. Only 1 cpu core can talk to 1 GPU core simultaneously . So it happens often that you core 1 is assign to talk to the GPU and its waiting for some cycle clock from the GPU. DirectX 12 will help alleviate this problem by allow true multithreading from a DirectX perspective. 

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I am dreaming p3d will add better management of cpu.. Otherwise to get system which can run everything max will cost me more then actual Flight simulator which pilots use to practice.. :lol:

 

:lol:  And I read "somewhere" that actually this "combo" is meant to be used as a "reasonable price simulator".  BUT JOKE APART: at the end of the day this is what it's all about... 

Mentioning minimum or recommended system specifications is obviously not the best way to reach a widespread level of satisfactory results. Here something has to be done by both parties involved: something that "does do the trick". Straight, without detours and without waste of time. Some kind of setup guideline including what to expect at which level.

Otherwise quite some disappointed expectations (frustrations) will exist among a number of users not being in the lucky position of fortunately doing everything right...

 

 

 

VAS consumption is my only concern at this point. I seem to have a VAS leak somewhere that I didn't have before so I need to isolate and eliminate that now. I sure haven't had to worry about VAS before in P3D until I installed this bad boy.

 

The VAS damocles sword... That will be the 64-bit promise's burden... good luck! :unsure:

What shall we do every time the sim crashes before the simulated plane actually did?

(But IMO going 64-bit should really avoid OOMs soon)

 

EDIT:

 

 

This is an limitation with Windows and DirectX 11. Only 1 cpu core can talk to 1 GPU core simultaneously . So it happens often that you core 1 is assign to talk to the GPU and its waiting for some cycle clock from the GPU. DirectX 12 will help alleviate this problem by allow true multithreading from a DirectX perspective. 

 

Wow! Thanks! This sounds like an amazing future!

(I'm a believer! B)  )

multithreaded DX12 + 64bit ... it never stops

C'mon that rocks  :p0502:

Edited by vr-pilot

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