It's interesting to me to watch this thread (and add to it) and see, kinda in real time, a really useful re-examination of what this hobby is all about: that for a lot of different reasons, we all just really love aviation and are looking for platforms that satisfy our various ways of pursuing that enthusiasm--whether we're trying to tweak that skill set that will get us that PPL, or rolling a Spitfire over the English countryside because the Spitfire is just so damn lovely.  (I saw my first one when I was about six at some kind of fair in Toronto in the late 60's, and then that Ballantine book that I read like a bible). Hopefully A2A will make a really nice one for FSW.

 

Tim

Regarding that Spitfire. It'll be interesting to see how it pans out if A2A did start putting stuff up for FSW via Steam, currently they don't sell much through Steam for FSX; as far as I'm aware only their Accu-Feel add on is sold that way. Of course you can still buy A2A stuff and install it in FSX-SE, but the fact remains, Accu-Feel is the only A2A product on Steam.

This does make me wonder if there is any market research reasoning behind that, given that the Steamworks API does give sellers quite a lot of sales info. The most expensive Steam FSX DLC add-on at the moment is (I think) FS Global (priced at £39.99), and if you look at most of the add-ons as DLC for FSX via Steam, the average price (as a guesstimate) is about 14 quid for something, many add-on aeroplanes are around that price mark or slightly less, with the odd one being more. The Aerosoft A318/319 and A320/321 add on packages are the most expensive FSX-SE DLC aeroplanes you can buy through Steam (£34.99), working out at (near as damn it) fairly close to that 14 quid mark for one aeroplane, when you consider that you get two airliners in those packages.

So, if you consider that A2A's Spitfire is 29.99 (Dollars), and an additional 19.99 (Dollars) if you get the Accu-Sim expansion for it, that puts it up to just shy of 50 Dollars for the add-on with all the whistles and bells, which if we transpose to Sterling, is about 40 quid. This is well over twice the price of the next nearest aeroplane add on sold as DLC through Steam, and whilst I think most people who like their flight sims will agree that the A2A Spitfire is a truly excellent add-on and is worth having (including also getting the Accu-Sim expansion for it) if you really want a very good Spitfire for FSX, I wonder if A2A think it might be regarded as a bit pricey for the average Steam customer? Certainly there are a lot of FSX add-ons which tip well past that 40 quid price mark, but none of those are sold through Steam. That makes me wonder if Just Flight's Spit, which whilst not the study sim treatment of A2A's effort, is still pretty good, might be more the kind of thing which appeals to Steam buyers in terms of pricing.

I'm not sure what DTG is trying to accomplish with their Early Access program.

Maybe FSW-DLC is the ultimate answer, but their initial base airplanes are buggy and every Community Update fixes some problems and creates others.  Testing and QA does not appear to be part of the program.

I find it discouraging that we, the (paying) users submit detailed bug reports and that the updates come out without any apparent QA...

Does not exactly inspire confidence..  sorry to be so negative, but this team is full of promises, and does not deliver..

Interesting (and quite disappointing) conclusions, Bert. Although it's kinda what I feared... 

With respect, I think those conclusions are a little premature less than a month into the Early Access program. How many years has it taken LM to develop Prepar3D to v4? And what resources are at LM's disposal compared to a small British game developer?

Even with the buggy cockpits its still quite possible to do enjoyable flights.  The Malibu's autopilot can be made to work if you follow that guide that was posted.  there are still bugs but Ive adjusted things so that I can enjoy it well enough.

If you design skies try this: take the default afternoon sky texture and set the lighting pixels as follows:

pixel1 (ambient) RGB 51 51 51

pixel2(direct) RGB 209 209 209

pixels 3 and 4 RGB 255 255 255

pixel 5 RGB 153 151 151

If its overall too bright, decrease the brightness of the second pixel.  If the clouds are too bright, decrease the brightness of either the first or fifth pixel.  Eventually they totally change the current system ( I think) so you can adjust things now but maybe not later.

 

The planes look great.  if they would just fix the avionics.  but it definitely has a future if people give it/DTG a chance...and I have other sims I can enjoy at the same time.

2 hours ago, Bert Pieke said:

...

I find it discouraging that we, the (paying) users submit detailed bug reports and that the updates come out without any apparent QA...

Does not exactly inspire confidence..  sorry to be so negative, but this team is full of promises, and does not deliver..

I feel ya Bert!  I am really disgusted because I submitted a support ticket 4 days ago and haven't yet received an acknowledgement nor anything else related.  But I do understand what you're saying.  I read on the Steam discussion board where someone from DTG said that night lighting wasn't even on the to-do list and maybe it doesn't hold the same priority of the airplanes, but definitely something that should be addressed soon - even the taxi and landing lights still don't illuminate the ground not to mention total blackness everywhere else.

anyways, I feel like I'm whining, but I am a paying customer after all.  I see XP-11 in my near future and if I go that direction, FSW will cease to exist in my immediate future - and that's hard for me to say since I have been a MSFS user since the very beginning.

thank you for your candid comments and thank you for your continued awesome contributions to the community.

Robert

I'll say it again: It's less than a month into the Early Access program guys!

3 minutes ago, A32xx said:

I'll say it again: It's less than a month into the Early Access program guys!

I get that part, but when I'm told to submit a support ticket for an issue I'm having and get no response, they need not expect a sympathetic response here.

since DTG will not publish a roadmap of current fixes, we don't even know if our bug reports are even being looked at much less addressed.  Bert's comments above are certainly valid as this man has been around long enough to know how these things should go.  If DTG don't like this feedback, let them come here and address our concerns; otherwise, I see no reason to stick around and continue to point things out without even a "we're working on it, but in the mean time here's what you can do".   I've seen single devs support hundreds of players in EA and be able to address issues on a very timely basis and at least give feedback about what can and cannot be done.  Silence is not a very good way to do business - EA or Final Release of a product.

Fair enough, that's your choice. My choice is to stay tuned to FSW, because I too have been around long enough to know how these things should go. If  FSW can be compared to X-Plane for example, or rather Dovetail Games to Laminar Research, we're in for a long haul of slow and steady development. Since FSW has already got ATC and seasonal weather and scenery, maybe we should count our blessings and resist the urge to stamp our feet like petulant children?

and my Dallas skyline recently got updated so you might want to check your favorite city for changes.  It could all just be my imagination though.  its been known to happen.

 

7 minutes ago, A32xx said:

...resist the urge to stamp our feet like petulant children?

jajajajaja....I know I am pitching a temper tantrum, but dadgum, they dangle this thing in front of us and tease us and turn us into rabid fiends.  I'll get over it, but I just felt the need to vent.  BTW, I am an old "petulant child" and want it my way and I don't want to share my ice creme.

1 minute ago, SmokeDiddy said:

jajajajaja....I know I am pitching a temper tantrum, but dadgum, they dangle this thing in front of us and tease us and turn us into rabid fiends.  I'll get over it, but I just felt the need to vent.  BTW, I am an old "petulant child" and want it my way and I don't want to share my ice creme.

Me too! I just know it's going to be a while before anyone can go on VATSIM or IVAO with FSW. But it'll be worth waiting for!

11 hours ago, Chock said:

Regarding that Spitfire. It'll be interesting to see how it pans out if A2A did start putting stuff up for FSW via Steam, currently they don't sell much through Steam for FSX; as far as I'm aware only their Accu-Feel add on is sold that way. Of course you can still buy A2A stuff and install it in FSX-SE, but the fact remains, Accu-Feel is the only A2A product on Steam....

 ...That makes me wonder if Just Flight's Spit, which whilst not the study sim treatment of A2A's effort, is still pretty good, might be more the kind of thing which appeals to Steam buyers in terms of pricing.

Frankly, Just Flight is going to have to bring their game way up when the DLC market opens up for FSW.  Default FSW aircraft are now, at the very least, visually on par with the aircraft in the most current IL2 iterations, and JF doesn't produce anything that looks that good.

7 hours ago, hypercide said:

Frankly, Just Flight is going to have to bring their game way up when the DLC market opens up for FSW.  Default FSW aircraft are now, at the very least, visually on par with the aircraft in the most current IL2 iterations, and JF doesn't produce anything that looks that good.

You mean, IL.2 Battle of ?  The aircraft look graphically very very good, although we don't have interactive cockpits, like we do in FSX, FSW, P3D, XP, AEFS2...