burkocatepe

wing flex

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In my opinion , wing flex is not realistic on 747 and 777 planes. 737 is somewhat ok.But i believe you can make them better. Is it really hard to create a very realistic flex look?

 

thanks

 

burak

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15 minutes ago, burkocatepe said:

In my opinion , wing flex is not realistic on 747 and 777 planes. 737 is somewhat ok.But i believe you can make them better. Is it really hard to create a very realistic flex look?

 

thanks

 

burak

I cannot confirm how accurately PMDG have modelled wing flex on their current flagship jet aircraft. However, PMDG have built a reputation over the last twenty years for not leaving something half done, and I think it would be safe to assume that their modelling of wing flex is quite accurate. If you don’t mind me asking, what makes it look unrealistic to you? And what are you comparing it against? :)

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I have never seen realistic wingflex in flight or on landing with any aircraft in P3D,   This doesn't seem to be a PMDG specific issue.   P3D/FSX doesn't seem to allow for fluid, realistic animation models.  It would be good if someone could explain why this is.  Gear compression is also quite unrealistic.  Xplane absolutely nails the animation physics.  I don't use xplane, but I like what they do with animations.

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11 minutes ago, VHOEI said:

I cannot confirm how accurately PMDG have modelled wing flex on their current flagship jet aircraft. However, PMDG have built a reputation over the last twenty years for not leaving something half done, and I think it would be safe to assume that their modelling of wing flex is quite accurate. If you don’t mind me asking, what makes it look unrealistic to you? And what are you comparing it against? :)

I m comparing against real life :)  well, watch this video of xplane , you will understand the difference.

 

 

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1 minute ago, burkocatepe said:

I m comparing against real life :)  well, watch this video of xplane , you will understand the difference.

 

I understand, I have been an XP native and have loved the way things look in the sim. (I guess I have gotten used to the PMDG animations that have a reduced frame rate to save us performance and some of the nuances of FSX/P3D.)

I presume that ErichB has answer though. 

9 minutes ago, ErichB said:

I have never seen realistic wingflex in flight or on landing with any aircraft in P3D,   This doesn't seem to be a PMDG specific issue.   P3D/FSX doesn't seem to allow for fluid, realistic animation models.  It would be good if someone could explain why this is.  Gear compression is also quite unrealistic.  Xplane absolutely nails the animation physics.  I don't use xplane, but I like what they do with animations.

 

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5 hours ago, burkocatepe said:

In my opinion

We don't build planes on opinions. We build them on data. Bring data. Until that point, it's just an opinion, and the world of physics and sims doesn't run on those.

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1 hour ago, scandinavian13 said:

We don't build planes on opinions. We build them on data. Bring data. Until that point, it's just an opinion, and the world of physics and sims doesn't run on those.

Kyle, you always bring sense and reason to these topics, but in this case, the OP has raised a valid question. 

I don't think this is a PMDG  issue, but it doesn't seem to me that fluid wing flex animation is possible in P3D. because no-one has managed to achieve it.  You will know better than I if that is true.  But if you look at the video posted above -  just looking at the wing alone will convince you that's a real wing.  The slight and persistent wing wobble is exceptionally convincing.  Why is that not possible in P3D?  A core sim physics issue?

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2 hours ago, scandinavian13 said:

We don't build planes on opinions. We build them on data. Bring data. Until that point, it's just an opinion, and the world of physics and sims doesn't run on those.

What data are you talking about? I know what physics is. There is always a way to make it better. It needs improvement. Its not my job to give the data. I just compare real world and sim. Look at x plane wing flex. Somebody out there can make it. So there is data . Just try to think wider.

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2 hours ago, ErichB said:

Kyle, you always bring sense and reason to these topics, but in this case, the OP has raised a valid question. 

I don't think this is a PMDG  issue, but it doesn't seem to me that fluid wing flex animation is possible in P3D. because no-one has managed to achieve it.  You will know better than I if that is true.  But if you look at the video posted above -  just looking at the wing alone will convince you that's a real wing.  The slight and persistent wing wobble is exceptionally convincing.  Why is that not possible in P3D?  A core sim physics issue?

I think this type of question should be more addressed towards P3D.. as its a P3D issue with the engine.

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1 hour ago, burkocatepe said:

What data are you talking about? I know what physics is. There is always a way to make it better. It needs improvement. Its not my job to give the data. I just compare real world and sim. Look at x plane wing flex. Somebody out there can make it. So there is data . Just try to think wider.

He's referring to your OPINION that the wingflex is unrealistic. Unless you have time in a 737, 777, or 747 (not as a passenger) or work on the aircraft, then they don't take suggestions like "this isn't realistic" seriously as you have no way of knowing if it's realistic or not. I'd assume it's a P3D issue, rather than a PMDG issue.

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On 9/22/2017 at 7:07 PM, Milton Waddams said:

Unless you have time in a 737, 777, or 747 (not as a passenger) or work on the aircraft, then they don't take suggestions like "this isn't realistic" seriously as you have no way of knowing if it's realistic or not.

How would time as P1 or P2 be any use in knowing what the wingflex looks like from the passenger cabin?

You don't need any time at all as a pilot to know what the wings look like when you are on board an airliner, you just need to be on board the thing and have a pair of eyes, and to be honest, you'd be able to see the wing far better from row 8 in the cabin than you would from up in the cockpit, that is in fact why there is a little mark above the windows in the cabin of most airliners, it's to tell the crew which is the best window to look out of if they go back into the cabin to inspect the wing for ice etc, because you can't see it properly from the cockpit.

Here's an A320 shot on my phone from out the window of seat 6A last week coming back from France (and yeah, I know PMDG don't make an A320, but unfortunately that was the plane I was on), no need for me to be piloting the thing to observe whether the wing was bouncing up and down, which actually it doesn't appear to be doing that much, although if you watch the dark line along the top of the wing behind the slats, it does give an indication of how much the wing is bending (skim to about 7 mins in if you wanna see the take off with the wing taking on the load etc). And yes, I did want to slap that whiny little kid on the opposite side of the aisle, I was glad when they cranked up the rubber bands so I couldn't hear the little brat:

 

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Which simulator and which weather are you using Burak? Add-on weather engines can be apocalyptic in nature...

 

I'll leave this here... 

and I found this over on an X-plane forum (not sure if I'm allowed a direct link, but I quote:

"

Terrible pity we can't have wing flex like PMDG's gorgeous 777. If only we could have it, it would be 10 steps closer to perfection. 

Edited March 31, 2016 by Zeke*Earl"

 

Seems you can't please everyone :D 

Edited by HighBypass

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51 minutes ago, HighBypass said:

Terrible pity we can't have wing flex like PMDG's gorgeous 777. If only we could have it, it would be 10 steps closer to perfection. 

Lol good point.

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Let's be completely honest - the wing flexing animations of bouncing in turblenece etc. of PMDG's planes in P3D is not realistic.  I don't use other planes in P3D apart from PMDG, so I am not sure if it is a PMDG or a P3D thing.

The wing flex animation in all of them look nothing like what you see in the real world looking out the window.  I am talking about the way the wings wobble and "flap around".  In P3D it always looks jerky and not good.  The X-Plane video above looks far more like what you see in the real world.  A more smooth animation.  I think PMDG have the shape and everything correct - just some limitation somewhere makes the animation jerky.

Also - don't bring this data and time as a professional on a 7x7 into it.  You don't need it to see with your eyes out the window and look at how something moves.  Wings don't move in jerks like in P3D.  That is a fact that can be backed up with endless evidence.  To argue against that is foolish.

Maybe PMDG are saying they've modeled it with real data, which I am sure they have.  But P3D is probably like a dodgy old VHS trying to play a bluray disc

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