Carmine,Thank you for the note. Would like to get educated opinions on this product now that this patch supposedly fixes the originally reported problems.Regards,Dave Vega

Let me preface this post by stating that I tend to be pretty opinionated when it comes to answering posts such as this. I've oftentimes come across as abrasive when posting my opinions. I don't tend to pull punches when commenting, sometimes to a fault, as even valid issues I have raised in the past often get lost in the argumentative tone the threads I post in tend to take on. Any regulars from the PMDG forum can attest to that. I guess I could apologize for this, but it would not be genuine, so I won't.Having said all of that, I will do my best to answer your question without doing that here.This patched version of the PSS777 is certainly better than the initial release, most of the major issues seem to have been addressed. There are a few lingering items; however, that I've come across, such as thie disappearing pressurization display on the upper EICAS, that is lost when EXEecuting the FMC route, never to be seen again for the remainder of the flight.What relationship those two have, I have no idea, but this IS something that was brought to their attention months ago.The 3D external model is, in my opinion, sub-standard. I can say with certainty that I will be substituting in the venerable MelJet model, not being too much of a VC guru. I've seen only one 777 in person, and it was an -ER at that, the rest of my comparitive experience drawn from airliners.net, but the MelJet model is just more convincing in my opinion.The FDE seems much improved, though I say that as someone who's only real-world 777 experience amounts to seeing one through the cabin window of an A320 at O'Hare. It certainly seems to have lost it's original fighter-jet like bank response, and hand-flying the departure out of Newark this afteroon was a pleasure. Rob Young was recruited to tame the 777 and in my opinion he's done well.I would rate it performance-wise about average. The EFIS is set to a default refresh rate of 6 FPS, and this setting seems to perform well, albeit with a slightly noticable "jerkiness". Options here allow for 9 FPS or 18 FPS moving up, and each step brought with it a noticable hit, with the 18 FPS setting being unusable for me.FMC errors for the most part seem to have been fixed, step-climb/ETA predictions, a big problem in the initial release, now seem to function properly. The FIX page is not, and will not be implemented. The FMC also does not accept route wind data entry.Overall systems simulation, again, seems about average, though the 777 is such an automated airplane, even beyond the 744, that I will need to do more research now with the finished product before I'll be willing to draw any conclusions here. There is no inbuilt failure simualtion that I can find, and one "potentially" major ommision is that of the Thrust Asymetry Compensation system, but there again, this may not matter much, as engine failures would have to be user initiated.The VC is sort of a mixed bag. Performance wise, it seems on par with other major releases of late. Nice 3D switches and dials abound, and the night-lighting is OK. The texturing lets it down a bit though, in my opinion, as though 32-bit textures seems to have been their choice, the detail just doesn't seem to match what we've seen elsewhere. This is obviously very subjective.The 2D panel is of PSS's usual quality, they are the best in the business here, in my opinion. All panels/pop-ups are clear, legible, and attractive. Also included here, is one of the most inovative features of the product, the pop-up set-up menu, that allows on-the-fly changes of everything from panel graphics options to keyboard commands, to fuel loading; things that in other products would require the user to access a menu dropdown to change.There is also the integrated WX radar, but to be honest, this is something I could have done without, personally, so I will let someone else comment, as I don't use it.I guess what it boils down to, is that if you're looking for a 777, I'm confident that this will be the most complete release anytime soon. I DO NOT feel, however; that it is quite up to the standards that PMDG and Level-D have set. Someone said recently, when commenting on a certain 737 product, that while it was good, it just didn't quite draw them in the way a few other products do, and I'd have to say the same of the 777. There's nothing I see in this latest version that makes me regret my purchase, but I also don't see myself spending a great deal of time with it. It just does not seem to have the fidelity; does not present the same challenge to me, that other products do.Your milage may vary.

Brian,Thank you. Your review was spot on. It clearly answered my questions. I commend the product designers for having done the best they could on this product. Wish them the best on future products. Again, thank you.Regards,Dave Vega

Brian:I appreciate your honest assessment; and I am now convinced that it's a good idea to leave my credit card in my pocket. "I also don't see myself spending a great deal of time with it." Well, and on top of that, it costs a pretty penny. I just don't get it. If I were an addon plane designer, the FIRST thing I would do is to make sure that the guys working for me in terms of designing systems and models have the LDS, PMDG, and Flight1 sites permanently displayed on their computers, so they know that they have to do at least as good a job and, preferably better, compared to what is already out there. I had a job interview with Gallup years ago, and the recruiter told me that they distinguish between people who "do their best" and people who "do the best." I thought this was a good way of putting it. ricardo

Dave and Ricardo,I won't deny that I have some pretty strong opinions in regards to how this entire release has been handled, but, I have posted enough in the PSS forum itself, that I chose to refrain from reposting any of that here. I say this because, although I have tried my best to remain as unbiased and fact-based as I possibly could in the above post, I cannot deny that I had much higher expectations for the 777 than what has been delivered. This disappointment on my part may not allow for the complete picture, so I have to recommend that you, and anyone contemplating purchase, keep an eye on this and the PSS forum itself before making your purchase decision one way or the other. It's hardly fair to hold PSS hostage to my expectations, as they may not be considered reasonable by the majority of the community.Now, I'm certain you are already doing just that, and are more than capable of doing so without me saying a word, I'm certainly not trying to patronize you. Just be aware that it seems that there are already plans in the making for another patch/hotfix, and even without that, I'm sure others will have opinions contrary to mine.

it looks like its just as bad before the patch!

Well, thank you again for starting this thread and putting good advice in it.At one point I was going to get her as I am easy spending on the payware but for once I decided to hold off and it would appear as though it was a wise move. Never been a big fan of paying for additional liveries anyways...Thanks again for your input.

Hi Clayton,"it looks like its just as bad before the patch!" I think that is an unfair and rather rash comment if I may say so. I was brought in to address a few issues with the flying behaviour and some a/p functions. As far as I am aware, the major issues have been solved, and those were porpoising/instability in pitch under autopilot (there is now less than plus/minus 3 feet variation in alt hold and pitch control). The other major issue was roll control and crosswind landings. The roll is now very smooth and the 777 has been tested as fine in a 35 knot crosswinds.The other issues, relating mainly to FMC and a/p functions are beyond my brief but a good deal of them have been fixed as far as I am aware.It may be fair comment to say the aircraft is not perfect but it is entirely unfair and unfounded to describe the 777 as "just as bad" as it was before the patch.Kind Regards,Rob Young

Ricardo and VAA 008,As my old pal Buddy used to say, "Everyone's a critic." While many many folks have been very vocally criticising the PSS T7 since the first picosecond it was released, I have been very happily flying it on long distance routes, and, while there are things I would like to see implemented, (and still a few little things to be fixed I believe) I am a satisfied customer. Thankfully, I never experienced the severe issues some reported.Flying WSSS-NZCH as SQ297 approaching overhead Bali pretty soon!I personally think you are missing a good experience!!!!

Carmine http://forums.avsim.net/images/wave.gifhttp://img155.imageshack.us/img155/7118/phoenixtp8mg.jpg

>it looks like its just as bad before the patch! Do you own the bird? If so I guess you might have grounds to say that but if you owned it you would allready know that it is MUCH better after the patch. I don't understand where some folks come off giving opinions on a product they don't personally own. If you don't own the product you can't comment intelligently on it. Period. Enough said. Craig

>>I personally think you are missing a good experience!!!!>>I agree - I have the other two top heavies. Sure there's things I wish PSS included bor did differently but truth be told I can say the same of the other two as well. Point is when I fly the T7, especially now, I am fully absorbed, very busy and have a lot of fun with the distinctly 777 experience. regards,MarkXPHomeSP2/FS9.1/3.2HT/1024mb/X700pro256

Well,That's all I am waiting for, good reports on the bird... Now since you have it, can you tell me if the FMC/CDU is as good as the PMDG or Level-D?

'Good' as far as PSS has taken it - FIX page is not modelled, nor can you input wind info for the route data pages. For regular ops all other normal fmc functionality is included to my armchair pilot knowledge. If it interests you it can also import fs9 plans.Plus it's really pretty :)regards,MarkXPHomeSP2/FS9.1/3.2HT/1024mb/X700pro256

As my old pal Buddy used to say, "Everyone's a critic."I'm wondering, exactly what the problem is with that ? It's very difficult to give an honest opinion without being critical. Oh but wait, yeah, that's right, even if we remain respectful and courteous with our criticisms, we're still just supposed to hand over our money, take what we can get, and keep quiet.I always forget that part.I personally think you are missing a good experience!!!!You said it right there. It's a "good" experience, which I won't argue. However, it's far from the best available. I said above, I don't regret my purchase, at all. Even if I never fly the 777 again, that's fine, I don't mind supporting PSS and the community that way. It won't be the first aircraft purchase I've made that quickly became a hangar queen, and that's my choice to make.It IS without a doubt the most complete PSS release to date, so on that note, if you like the A3XX series, you most likely will love the 777. I'm looking for more than that, and I won't be made to feel poorly for saying so.Maybe as a community we do need to realize that not every release will be an LDS767 or PMDG744, but the fact of the matter is that those are the yardsticks we measure by at this point, and many, including myself, will have a very difficult time investing any significant effort into an aircraft that does not measure up.The PSS777 does not measure up. I'm sorry. What would you have me say ? There certainly are some very nice and unique features, but when all is said and done, anyone buying with the expectation of an LDS or PMDG-like experience WILL be disappointed.