New MS Flight Sim shown at E3

[Peter Clark 21]

Pretty sure that’s from the Cessna marketing brochure. N27369 is registered to Textron. 

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Peter Clark said:

Pretty sure that’s from the Cessna marketing brochure. N27369 is registered to Textron. 

It was on "another' site as a leaked MSFS plane. Pretty quickly realised it was nonsense though. So deleted my post.

Edited June 15, 2019 by Guest

[Fedmediate 4]

Well all ye faithful can indulge in the hope that Microsoft has learned its lesson from the spectacular failure of FLIGHT which was an arcade point and fly game with no simulation whatsoever. Having had the football pulled up by Lucy (Microsoft) this Charlie Brown declines to make another run at the ball. The trailer did not display any controls being used, no instruments working and no panels. Why? Could it be that they do not exist? Then we have it to be used by an Xbox control. Throttle, trim, flaps? I will believe it when I see it. Until then I am not counting on it being a flyable simulator. Once burned, twice wary.

[Guest]

Take a closer look at the trailer and you'll see active MFDs and gauges. You have to look close and fast but they're there, for example at 0:57

[Fedmediate 4]

True Ganter. But I dismissed that brief flash of instruments moving as meaningless. Why barely seen? Why not go full panel? Why not demo working  throttles, flaps, trim switches and all? I would have touted this feature somewhere in the trailer because it is important and demonstrates that Microsoft has really learned its lesson from FLIGHT that crashed and burned like a lawn dart. Not one thing in the trailer demonstrated that you could actually fly the plane as opposed to point and soar around boring holes in th sky like FLIGHT. MS burned us once and are quite capable of burning again. Too much unjustified  faith and wishful hope here.

[anden145 2,302]

2 hours ago, eslader said:

I hope they read the forums and recognize that people aren't going to buy it if they don't do it right ...

I just love how everyone in here, is making it out to sound like, that the users on AVSIM, are the sole marketing group for a new simulator 😄 

Did it ever occur to anyone - and I know this sounds REALLY far fetched - that Microsoft could be aiming for a user/marketing group, that doesn't feel it necessary to purchase flight-sticks, pedals and computer hardware for thousands of dollars? Maybe... just maybe - and I know that quite a few people have expressed that it would be a miserable failure if true - that they want to aim at another demographic, than the people in here?

Edited June 15, 2019 by Anders Bermann

[188AHC 2,141]

Because it's not ready for prime time. Gracious this is a very early announcement. 

[Guest]

8 minutes ago, Anders Bermann said:

I just love how everyone in here, is making it out to sound like, that the users on AVSIM, are the sole marketing group for a new simulator 😄 

Did it every occur to anyone - and I know this sounds REALLY far fetched - that Microsoft could be aiming for a user/marketing group, that doesn't feel it necessary to purchase flight-sticks, pedals and computer hardware for thousands of dollars? Maybe... just maybe - and I know that quite a few people have expressed that it would be a miserable failure if true - that they want to aim at another demographic, than the people in here?

Do you know what Anders, strangely, it has to most of us.

[G-RFRY 1,746]

10 minutes ago, Anders Bermann said:

I just love how everyone in here, is making it out to sound like, that the users on AVSIM, are the sole marketing group for a new simulator 😄 

Did it every occur to anyone - and I know this sounds REALLY far fetched - that Microsoft could be aiming for a user/marketing group, that doesn't feel it necessary to purchase flight-sticks, pedals and computer hardware for thousands of dollars? Maybe... just maybe - and I know that quite a few people have expressed that it would be a miserable failure if true - that they want to aim at another demographic, than the people in here?

Most of the people viewing this forum are guest and not members at any one time which shows they have an interest, after Xbox FS comes out it`s possible that could also grow.  

[TechguyMaxC 516]

36 minutes ago, Fedmediate said:

Well all ye faithful can indulge in the hope that Microsoft has learned its lesson from the spectacular failure of FLIGHT which was an arcade point and fly game with no simulation whatsoever. Having had the football pulled up by Lucy (Microsoft) this Charlie Brown declines to make another run at the ball. The trailer did not display any controls being used, no instruments working and no panels. Why? Could it be that they do not exist? Then we have it to be used by an Xbox control. Throttle, trim, flaps? I will believe it when I see it. Until then I am not counting on it being a flyable simulator. Once burned, twice wary.

Guess you missed the nearly 40 year history of this simulator and the fact that only 1 entry failed.

But no, that's fine, let's just pretend like none of that happened and "MS doesn't know what they're doing".

[F737MAX 5,844]

26 minutes ago, Fedmediate said:

True Ganter. But I dismissed that brief flash of instruments moving as meaningless. Why barely seen? Why not go full panel? Why not demo working  throttles, flaps, trim switches and all? I would have touted this feature somewhere in the trailer because it is important and demonstrates that Microsoft has really learned its lesson from FLIGHT that crashed and burned like a lawn dart. Not one thing in the trailer demonstrated that you could actually fly the plane as opposed to point and soar around boring holes in th sky like FLIGHT. MS burned us once and are quite capable of burning again. Too much unjustified  faith and wishful hope here.

*Trailer*, not preview or review.
That's how marketing a half finished product works - see Hollywood film trailers...

16 minutes ago, Anders Bermann said:

I just love how everyone in here, is making it out to sound like, that the users on AVSIM, are the sole marketing group for a new simulator 😄 

Did it every occur to anyone - and I know this sounds REALLY far fetched - that Microsoft could be aiming for a user/marketing group, that doesn't feel it necessary to purchase flight-sticks, pedals and computer hardware for thousands of dollars? Maybe... just maybe - and I know that quite a few people have expressed that it would be a miserable failure if true - that they want to aim at another demographic, than the people in here?

Per the Phil Spencer interview:

Quote

"I didn't know if the PC community was going to be watching or not, but we went Flight Sim, we went Age, we went Wasteland," he says. "We want to make sure we're building games and supporting games that the PC community... we want to respect what they love."

I think we may just be part of the target audience.

There's a lot of optimism in this thread, yes. But apart from one or two overly-optimistic people, it's based on what has been highlighted by the trailer, what the near future of gaming holds for Microsoft per their E3 showcase, and by the comments of two head of departments.

There's a constant barrage from a select few who seem to want this new sim to be another failure like Flight, to fall down because its "only for gamers" or to fail because Microsoft may want to distribute mods, DLC, add-ons through their own store. It's as if they have a vested interest in the status quo or are scared by the thought that having spent heavily in a legacy sim, they may soon be left far behind.

It's right to be sceptical, who knows what we'll get, but don't be one of the gloom and doom merchants. Don't write something off entirely before there's been any confirmation that the new Flight Sim has gotten it wrong.

[ca_metal 2,087]

1 hour ago, Fedmediate said:

True Ganter. But I dismissed that brief flash of instruments moving as meaningless. Why barely seen? Why not go full panel? Why not demo working  throttles, flaps, trim switches and all? I would have touted this feature somewhere in the trailer because it is important and demonstrates that Microsoft has really learned its lesson from FLIGHT that crashed and burned like a lawn dart. Not one thing in the trailer demonstrated that you could actually fly the plane as opposed to point and soar around boring holes in th sky like FLIGHT. MS burned us once and are quite capable of burning again. Too much unjustified  faith and wishful hope here.

They were showcasing more than 60 games in that night (it's amazing to think they included the new MSFS as some bigger names must been put out of the show). Having that ammount of games to show in a limited timeframe, compromises had to be made. They did their best to show the more they could. I'm sure they will detail all that in the future.  

[WarpD 824]

2 hours ago, Anders Bermann said:

I just love how everyone in here, is making it out to sound like, that the users on AVSIM, are the sole marketing group for a new simulator 😄 

Did it ever occur to anyone - and I know this sounds REALLY far fetched - that Microsoft could be aiming for a user/marketing group, that doesn't feel it necessary to purchase flight-sticks, pedals and computer hardware for thousands of dollars? Maybe... just maybe - and I know that quite a few people have expressed that it would be a miserable failure if true - that they want to aim at another demographic, than the people in here?

They went that route already... it was called Microsoft Flight.  It failed, miserably.

[Paraffin 2,197]

1 hour ago, Anders Bermann said:

I just love how everyone in here, is making it out to sound like, that the users on AVSIM, are the sole marketing group for a new simulator 😄 

Did it every occur to anyone - and I know this sounds REALLY far fetched - that Microsoft could be aiming for a user/marketing group, that doesn't feel it necessary to purchase flight-sticks, pedals and computer hardware for thousands of dollars? Maybe... just maybe - and I know that quite a few people have expressed that it would be a miserable failure if true - that they want to aim at another demographic, than the people in here?

Hey, I've already been accused of being skeptical to a fault, so you're not the only one. 🙂

However, stepping a bit outside my normal skeptic zone, I'd like to point out that the current Xbox One supports several different steering wheels and foot pedals for car racing games, and it supports at least one joystick & throttle: the Thrustmaster T.Flight Hotas One.

There is every reason to assume that the new "Scarlett" Xbox will have at least that level of support for something besides a gamepad. Car racing games are very popular on consoles, and every once in a while an arcade air combat title surfaces on consoles like the recent Ace Combat 7 Skies Unknown.

The big question would be whether it supports multiple inputs for separate flight controls like yoke/stick, throttle quadrant, and pedal inputs, but that could be managed differently on the console and PC versions of the sim. Console users of MSFS should at least have access to a stick and throttle HOTAS.

Regarding target audiences, I think it's at least plausible that they could aim for both a casual and hardcore audience at the same time. Planes could be made flyable with a gamepad or mouse using auto coordination of rudder, and there are enough controls on a gamepad for flaps, throttle, and landing gear. An optional, deeper level of flight and navigation controls could be mapped on a keyboard (you can add a keyboard to the current Xbox One).

Worth noting: The latest survey (Summer 2018) on the Laminar dev blog, done with automated data retrieval, shows that 25% of X-Plane users fly with only a mouse and keyboard. If it works for X-Plane it can work for MSFS on the new Xbox. 

So I don't think it would be that hard to attract a casual gamer audience and hardcore simulation fans at the same time, with an approach where each aircraft model has layers you can peel back like an onion, making it as simple or as complex to fly as you want. I remember when air combat sims used to be like that, with sliders you could use to dumb down the flight model or go full hardcore realism.

I don't want to assume that's what MS is doing, it's just one path they might take. 

[sjt 49]

2 hours ago, Fedmediate said:

Well all ye faithful can indulge in the hope that Microsoft has learned its lesson from the spectacular failure of FLIGHT

“The only real mistake is the one from which we learn nothing.” - Henry Ford

“Failures are finger posts on the road to achievement.” - C.S. Lewis