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A new Airbus A321...

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Hi,

...A new Airbus A321 XLR has just been presented at the Paris Le Bourget Air Show.

180/200 Pax, it can fly for about ten hours with an additional tank (+-4600miles).

Richard

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Richard Portier

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Yep, this is a pretty slick aircraft and perfect to use on transatlantic routes in lieu of larger capacity, less fuel efficient aircraft like the 787, A330, and aging 767.

The Boeing 757 is the current counterpart to the A321XLR but it is getting old and isn't as fuel efficient.  Boeing is supposedly designing a new mid-size aircraft, the 797, to replace the 757 but with the 737 Max troubles those plans may have been set back so who knows how long before the 797 is ready to fly.

Although I have advocated for Boeing to design and build a truly next generation passenger aircraft, I also think that having an interim option is a good idea.  Like they've done with the 777X, they could pretty easily upgrade the 757 with new engines, improved aerodynamics, updated avionics, and perhaps some composite sections and make it a real competitor to the A321LR and XLR.

Dave

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, DaveCT2003 said:

That was odd. A link to a another forum post, that was in fact a link to this - https://www.foxbusiness.com/industrials/airbus-boeing-launch-new-long-range-jet

Apparently the above was seen as a complaining... yikes.

Edited by seatbackpocket
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6 minutes ago, seatbackpocket said:

That was odd. A link to a another forum post, that was in fact a link to this - https://www.foxbusiness.com/industrials/airbus-boeing-launch-new-long-range-jet

 

Just as odd as you complaining about it, friend.  I had provided the link while I was on my phone, so it was easier that way.

 

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My source is from the "La Tribune" french economic paper. According to a statement by Christian Scherer, Airbus' sales manager, the A321 XLR will be available from 2023..., a protocol agreement appears to have been signed with Air Lease Corporation (ALC) for the purchase of 27 A321 XLRs, including 50 A220-300s and 23 A321Neos.

Richard


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3 hours ago, dave2013 said:

Like they've done with the 777X, they could pretty easily upgrade the 757 with new engines, improved aerodynamics, updated avionics, and perhaps some composite sections and make it a real competitor to the A321LR and XLR.

I don't know if I would call the upgrade easily, considering the 757 has been out of production since 2004 and the tooling for it is most likely gone.


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10 hours ago, dave2013 said:

they could pretty easily upgrade the 757 with new engines, improved aerodynamics, updated avionics, and perhaps some composite sections and make it a real competitor to the A321LR and XLR.

Afaik, Boeing did evaluate this some years ago and did not find a proper business case.

The B757 was produced alongside the 737 in Renton, but due to its larger dimensions, it required different tooling and the assembly process is outdated which makes it far more expensive to build compared to a 737.


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Posted (edited)
15 hours ago, Captain Kevin said:

I don't know if I would call the upgrade easily, considering the 757 has been out of production since 2004 and the tooling for it is most likely gone.

I'm thinking "easy" compared to creating a brand new aircraft.  I did read that Boeing considered re-engineering the 757 but couldn't make a good business case for it.  I'm skeptical of this considering just how much demand there is for long range narrow body aircraft like the A321 LR/XLR, plus the fact that over a 1000 757s are still in service.  I don't have much faith in Boeing's executives making good decisions especially considering the 737 MAX fiasco.

The 757 is a popular, proven design and with some upgrades/re-engineering I believe it could be a very capable and profitable aircraft.  I like the idea of the 797, but why reinvent the wheel when you already have a great design? 

Just my 2c FWIW.

Dave

Edited by dave2013

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Let's just hope that Boeing don't make any more kneejerk reactions after hearing this.

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BA are taking 200 of the 737MAX I suspect they will get a good deal.


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A smaller jet would help in terms of customs and baggage pickup, as the bigger jets mean longer waits in the the customs lines, one reason why I preferred flying into Canada on smaller, single aisle jets.  When I Eurailed thru Europe back in 87,89 and 91 I only had carry on luggage in the latter two trips after using a suitcase in the first one, just so I could clear customs on the inbound widebody ahead of the throng of passengers behind me waiting for their bags.  It proved quite helpful, for clothes for the two week period I packed seven shirts, three pairs of slacks, the rest of my clothes I would launder in mid trip with the detergent I had, hanging them to dry by my hotel departure date two or three nights later. 

I liked Canadian outbound customs to the US, because you clear US customs in Canada, at least the six major airports I flew into, Vancouver, Ottawa, Toronto, Montreal, Winnipeg and Edmonton over several years of teaching business systems up there for my employers Best Western, Hotel Info Systems, and Holiday Inn.  Again I usually flew in on single aisle jets or in the case of Ottawa, a puddle jumper after changing aircraft in Detroit.  Using such aircraft made it easier for me to clear customs and deal with NAFTA law since I carried emergency network cable, a crimper, a breakout box and Cat 5 ends in case my office did not send the cable to my training room.  I used the breakout box to deal with system interface vendors, as I could check if they were sending me a signal across the proper pins--that was before USB made that moot.

Only problem with all that junk I carried is it did not look so hot as it went thru Xrays, and my suitcase would be opened as it looked like the wiring was for explosives, I wouldn't even wait for security to ask, I'd just say "I think you want to look inside my suitcase now" to their amusement, since others who worked for my company were told not to be so cooperative, and some were banned from entering Canada for life, which is why I was sent there so often.  I finally had to chastise my boss not to tell our employees to lie, they were told to do so so they would not be charged fees that were allowed under NAFTA. 

In Ottawa I finally lost it when I was asked to pay the 100 dollar fee a third time, I finally told Canadian customs that I came there often, provided a service that their citizens could not perform, since they were not trained in our software, and it was 3AM after I had an eight hour inbound delay from a typical Detroit Blizzard.  I still have what they gave me in my old passport, a lifetime work Visa form that listed my occupation as "Professor".  This amused my boss who then had our few employees not banned from Canada do the same, they carried a photocopy of my work Visa, which proved to the Canadians their "bona fides" as "professors" as well.   These things are the joy of air travel, surmounting challenges with humor, and especially, honesty in the case of airport security or foreign customs.

John

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Posted (edited)

AA wasn't left with much option to replace the 757 so no surprise:
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-06-19/american-air-orders-50-of-airbus-s-longest-range-a321-aircraft

The BA order is a letter of intent so nothing confirmed yet, but a nice order for the MAX if they do proceed

Edited by Matthew Kane

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15 hours ago, Matthew Kane said:

AA wasn't left with much option to replace the 757 so no surprise:
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-06-19/american-air-orders-50-of-airbus-s-longest-range-a321-aircraft

The BA order is a letter of intent so nothing confirmed yet, but a nice order for the MAX if they do proceed

AA is furious with Boeing at the moment. But, I'll miss jump-seating in some of the 757's, I still love seeing the old steam gauges and plastic speed bugs mixed with the gen1 glass.

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Busdriver (Bill)

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22 hours ago, busdriver said:

AA is furious with Boeing at the moment. But, I'll miss jump-seating in some of the 757's, I still love seeing the old steam gauges and plastic speed bugs mixed with the gen1 glass.

I am told the 757 was enjoyed by pilots because of its power....  My first 757 flight was a Delta flight non-stop from SFO to Orlando in 1992.  I loved both the 757 and the 767 because they could get more pax off the ground, easing congestion at airports, than the smaller jets do. 

Just like the bigger tprops, the ATR's, and the Dash's, and the Saab's did for the puddle jumper airlines.  But the flip side I remember was more empty seats on those aircraft, I rarely remember a wide body flight ever being full, at least in the US, but outbound to Europe or Japan they were.  Me and my fellow business travelers who flew in the 757 often after my first flight in '92 called it "the flying pencil" and we joked when you walked in, you saw this tunnel of seats and drop down movie screens that seemingly went on forever. 

My fav single aisle jets were the C700/900, MD80/90, and 727 in that order, with sadly the 73X and A3x being last.  Reason I liked the first set of jets I mentioned was the rear engines, which allowed most pax except those in the very back of the aircraft a very quiet ride.  On a 727 once, seated in the front row, we hit full thrust and I could barely hear the engine behind me, it was the wind noise that grew louder.  That is why the old Ford commercials "quieter than a glider" were so fake, because even in the slower three place Schweizer, I found the wind noise as loud as a jet...  Of course slower moving cars would be quieter, gliders move faster than cars in most of their flight envelope at altitude.

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