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Nvidia performance article

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I spoke to soon problem again but not all the time when it does load it runs great full on, I have posted on LM P3D forum see if they come up with something.


 

Raymond Fry.

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Just my 2 cents:

D3D12onWin7 is meant to supporting running DX12 on Win7 OS.

you can read some of the details why there is this subfolder in the P3D5 main folder, and why you'd copy the D3D12 related DLL there is needed:
https://microsoft.github.io/DirectX-Specs/d3d/D3D12onWin7.html#load-dlls-properly

@Ray Proudfoot

As for the DXGI_### error, if you're on Win10, I don't have more clues right now, but further down the page I've linked there is a specific DXGI related problem when using 12on7:

Quote

 

Add new Present code path for Windows 7

D3D12 on Windows 7 requires different Present APIs. Specifically, attempting to create a DXGI swapchain on a D3D12 device or queue will fail on Windows 7, because DXGI is not updated as part of this package.

 

I don't know if this could be related but if you're using P3D5 on Win10 but you also put some of the D3D12 DLL in the D3D12onWin7 folder like you're doing, it is possible P3D5 is not sure which code path to run, depending on how they've coded the detection, and therefore you might be just encountering this specific DXGI error, or any other.


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24 minutes ago, RXP said:

 

@Ray Proudfoot

As for the DXGI_### error, if you're on Win10, I don't have more clues right now, but further down the page I've linked there is a specific DXGI related problem when using 12on7:

I don't know if this could be related but if you're using P3D5 on Win10 but you also put some of the D3D12 DLL in the D3D12onWin7 folder like you're doing, it is possible P3D5 is not sure which code path to run, depending on how they've coded the detection, and therefore you might be just encountering this specific DXGI error, or any other.

The article is beyond my comprehension I’m afraid but I appreciate your input. Why my install differs from so many others is baffling. Hopefully Simbol can spot the problem next week.

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Ray (Cheshire, England).
System: P3D v5.3HF2 & v3.4, Intel i7-8086K o/c to 5.0Ghz, Nvidia GTX 1080 Ti 11Gb, Samsung 970 EVO M.2 SSD, 1Tb Samsung 860 EVO SSD, Asus Prime Z370-A mobo, 32Gb G.Skill DDR4 3000Mhz RAM, Win 10 Pro 64-bit, BenQ PD3200U 32” monitor, Fulcrum One yoke.
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4 hours ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

I'm attaching a screenshot of my GPU as seen by Afterburner. To m untrained eye it doesn't appear to be overclocked.

Those MSI Afterburner sliders show deviations from the baseline values coded into the firmware in the graphics card, not deviations from the nVidia spec.  So if your GPU is factory overclocked to 1650 MHz, that will be the 0 value you see on the slider.  Something like GPU-Z or nVidia Inspector should answer that question more definitively.


Bob Scott | President and CEO, AVSIM Inc
ATP Gulfstream II-III-IV-V

System: i9-10900K @ 5.2GHz on custom water loop, ASUS Maximus XII Hero, 32GB GSkill 3600MHz CAS15, EVGA RTX3090 XC3 Ultra
Samsung 55" JS8500 4K TV@30Hz,
3x NVME 2x SATA Samsung SSD, EVGA 1KW PSU, 1.2Gbps internet
SoundBlaster XFi Titanium, TOSLINK to Yamaha RX-V467 HT Rcvr, Polk/Klipsch 6" bookshelf spkrs, Polk 12" subwoofer, 12.9" iPad Pro
PFC yoke/throttle quad/pedals with custom Hall sensors, Coolermaster HAF932 case, Stream Deck XL button box

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@w6kd, thanks Bob, I'll check it tomorrow with GPU-Z.

LATER: Didn't take long to fire the PC up. Does this help?

Ray_1080Ti_1.jpg

Edited by Ray Proudfoot
Additional info

Ray (Cheshire, England).
System: P3D v5.3HF2 & v3.4, Intel i7-8086K o/c to 5.0Ghz, Nvidia GTX 1080 Ti 11Gb, Samsung 970 EVO M.2 SSD, 1Tb Samsung 860 EVO SSD, Asus Prime Z370-A mobo, 32Gb G.Skill DDR4 3000Mhz RAM, Win 10 Pro 64-bit, BenQ PD3200U 32” monitor, Fulcrum One yoke.
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21 hours ago, w6kd said:

Many, probably most, high-end GPUs come out of the box already factory-overclocked.  If your 1080Ti runs a clock/boost speed over 1481/1582 MHz or a memory clock faster than 5504 MHz, then it has been overclocked at the factory beyond the nVidia specs for a 1080Ti. 

Bob,

My screenshot above shows Memory Boost of 1620MHz. Have I read that right and if so, could that be the cause of the DXGI ACCESS DENIED problem?


Ray (Cheshire, England).
System: P3D v5.3HF2 & v3.4, Intel i7-8086K o/c to 5.0Ghz, Nvidia GTX 1080 Ti 11Gb, Samsung 970 EVO M.2 SSD, 1Tb Samsung 860 EVO SSD, Asus Prime Z370-A mobo, 32Gb G.Skill DDR4 3000Mhz RAM, Win 10 Pro 64-bit, BenQ PD3200U 32” monitor, Fulcrum One yoke.
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23 minutes ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

My screenshot above shows Memory Boost of 1620MHz. Have I read that right and if so, could that be the cause of the DXGI ACCESS DENIED problem?

No, it says that your GPU is running at 1506/1620, which is a pretty mild overclock.  My EVGA 1080Ti boards run at 1569/1683 MHz.  Your memory is running at stock speeds (1376 x 4 = 5504MHz).

The only way to tell for sure is to use a utility like nVidia Inspector or Afterburner to downclock the card, and/or to reduce the GPU workload (e.g. use RTSS+VSync to limit frame rate to 30 or 25 fps, lower AA settings, etc).  See if that eliminates the crashes.

 


Bob Scott | President and CEO, AVSIM Inc
ATP Gulfstream II-III-IV-V

System: i9-10900K @ 5.2GHz on custom water loop, ASUS Maximus XII Hero, 32GB GSkill 3600MHz CAS15, EVGA RTX3090 XC3 Ultra
Samsung 55" JS8500 4K TV@30Hz,
3x NVME 2x SATA Samsung SSD, EVGA 1KW PSU, 1.2Gbps internet
SoundBlaster XFi Titanium, TOSLINK to Yamaha RX-V467 HT Rcvr, Polk/Klipsch 6" bookshelf spkrs, Polk 12" subwoofer, 12.9" iPad Pro
PFC yoke/throttle quad/pedals with custom Hall sensors, Coolermaster HAF932 case, Stream Deck XL button box

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5 minutes ago, w6kd said:

No, it says that your GPU is running at 1506/1620, which is a pretty mild overclock.  My EVGA 1080Ti boards run at 1569/1683 MHz.  Your memory is running at stock speeds (1376 x 4 = 5504MHz).

The only way to tell for sure is to use a utility like nVidia Inspector or Afterburner to downclock the card, and/or to reduce the GPU workload (e.g. use RTSS+VSync to limit frame rate to 30 or 25 fps, lower AA settings, etc).  See if that eliminates the crashes.

At least that eliminates the possibility the card was being overclocked beyond what it was happy with. I didn’t think Chillblast would take things to the extreme.

I already run at 30Hz as my monitor supports that frequency and I enable VSync.  It’s hard to imagine the card is being overworked. I think I’ll leave it until next week when Simbol has kindly volunteered to help. Thanks for your help Bob. 👍


Ray (Cheshire, England).
System: P3D v5.3HF2 & v3.4, Intel i7-8086K o/c to 5.0Ghz, Nvidia GTX 1080 Ti 11Gb, Samsung 970 EVO M.2 SSD, 1Tb Samsung 860 EVO SSD, Asus Prime Z370-A mobo, 32Gb G.Skill DDR4 3000Mhz RAM, Win 10 Pro 64-bit, BenQ PD3200U 32” monitor, Fulcrum One yoke.
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One last thing...the fact that the overclock is mild can be looked at a couple ways.  First instinct is probably to discount the possibility of it being the problem, since it isn't a very big overclock.  The way I'd look at it is to consider that the OEMs bin the cards post-production, and that cards with less-aggressive overclocks are likely sold that way because the card failed to bin at a higher speed.  So the stability margins may be similar or even narrower than the more heavily overclocked cards.

Good luck...hope you find the burr under the saddle.

 

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Bob Scott | President and CEO, AVSIM Inc
ATP Gulfstream II-III-IV-V

System: i9-10900K @ 5.2GHz on custom water loop, ASUS Maximus XII Hero, 32GB GSkill 3600MHz CAS15, EVGA RTX3090 XC3 Ultra
Samsung 55" JS8500 4K TV@30Hz,
3x NVME 2x SATA Samsung SSD, EVGA 1KW PSU, 1.2Gbps internet
SoundBlaster XFi Titanium, TOSLINK to Yamaha RX-V467 HT Rcvr, Polk/Klipsch 6" bookshelf spkrs, Polk 12" subwoofer, 12.9" iPad Pro
PFC yoke/throttle quad/pedals with custom Hall sensors, Coolermaster HAF932 case, Stream Deck XL button box

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16 hours ago, RXP said:

I don't know if this could be related but if you're using P3D5 on Win10 but you also put some of the D3D12 DLL in the D3D12onWin7 folder like you're doing, it is possible P3D5 is not sure which code path to run, depending on how they've coded the detection

My install of P3D5 on a fully updated Win10 system runs quite happily without that D3D12onWin7 folder. I think that folder is only used if you do attempt to run P3D5 on a Win7 system. P3D5 will be detecting the Windows version on loading. it is quite simple, just one API call. It does need to 'try' different D3D DLLs.

Pete

 

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Win10: 21H1 19043.1865
CPU: 9900KS at 5.5GHz
Memory: 32Gb at 3800 MHz.
GPU:  RTX 24Gb Titan
2 x 2160p projectors at 25Hz onto 200 FOV curved screen

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25 minutes ago, Pete Dowson said:

My install of P3D5 on a fully updated Win10 system runs quite happily without that D3D12onWin7 folder. I think that folder is only used if you do attempt to run P3D5 on a Win7 system. P3D5 will be detecting the Windows version on loading. it is quite simple, just one API call. It does need to 'try' different D3D DLLs.

Pete

Pete, that was going to be a test for me today. Rename that folder so it couldn't be accessed and see if it changes anything. It would appear from its name it won't be accessed by my P3Dv5. If I continue to get the ACCESS_DENIED warning when switching default aircraft in the sim that will be definitive proof it isn't required for W10.


Ray (Cheshire, England).
System: P3D v5.3HF2 & v3.4, Intel i7-8086K o/c to 5.0Ghz, Nvidia GTX 1080 Ti 11Gb, Samsung 970 EVO M.2 SSD, 1Tb Samsung 860 EVO SSD, Asus Prime Z370-A mobo, 32Gb G.Skill DDR4 3000Mhz RAM, Win 10 Pro 64-bit, BenQ PD3200U 32” monitor, Fulcrum One yoke.
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Renaming D3D12onWin7 and firing up P3Dv5 I selected an avatar from the scenario menu. Loaded into the sim and then selected another avatar from the Vehicle menu. Still get the DXGI_ACCESS_DENIED message.

Proof if any was needed that folder is not required for W10 users.


Ray (Cheshire, England).
System: P3D v5.3HF2 & v3.4, Intel i7-8086K o/c to 5.0Ghz, Nvidia GTX 1080 Ti 11Gb, Samsung 970 EVO M.2 SSD, 1Tb Samsung 860 EVO SSD, Asus Prime Z370-A mobo, 32Gb G.Skill DDR4 3000Mhz RAM, Win 10 Pro 64-bit, BenQ PD3200U 32” monitor, Fulcrum One yoke.
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@Ray Proudfoot I am still giving the good fight but some light at end of the tunnel is visible.

In the meantime I want you do to this:

Open your prepard3d.cfg and find the GRAPHIC section:

[GRAPHICS]
GPUCrashReporting=0 // default
GPUCrashReporting=1 // Enable Nvidia Aftermath (Nvidia 10-series or above on Windows 1903 or newer.)
GPUCrashReporting=2 // Enable DRED (Windows 1903 and above. Not sure if this is supported by all GPUs)

There will be some performance impact to having these enabled. 

Replicate your access denied issues, and then look into Documents/Prepa3D V5 Folder, For DREED a text file is written in this folder: GPUCrashInfo_CURRENT_DATA_AND_TIME.txt

For Aftermath, two files will be added to Documents\Prepar3D v5 Files\Aftermath\. One is a plain text json file. The other is a .gpudump file.

Upload the files to a google drive or something so I can download and inspect them, if I cannot see something obvious I will pass this on to P3D and see if they can advice what can be the cause.

These setting basically enable GPU crash dumps for P3D.

Regards,

S.

 

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@simbol, thanks for that. Will try it now. Keep up the fight against the hackers. 👍

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Ray (Cheshire, England).
System: P3D v5.3HF2 & v3.4, Intel i7-8086K o/c to 5.0Ghz, Nvidia GTX 1080 Ti 11Gb, Samsung 970 EVO M.2 SSD, 1Tb Samsung 860 EVO SSD, Asus Prime Z370-A mobo, 32Gb G.Skill DDR4 3000Mhz RAM, Win 10 Pro 64-bit, BenQ PD3200U 32” monitor, Fulcrum One yoke.
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@simbol, I ran it with those 3 lines pasted into my cfg but no reports have been generated. I chose Yes when the DXGI_ACCESS_DENIED message appeared. I then tried Cancel to continue but the display remained black.

This is my windows and P3D version as reported by FSUIPC6...

Windows 10 Pro 64 Bit reported as Build 19041, Release ID: 2004 (OS 10.0)
Prepar3D.exe version = 5.1.12.26829

Nvidia drivers are 461.72

Baffling why the logs aren't being generated.


Ray (Cheshire, England).
System: P3D v5.3HF2 & v3.4, Intel i7-8086K o/c to 5.0Ghz, Nvidia GTX 1080 Ti 11Gb, Samsung 970 EVO M.2 SSD, 1Tb Samsung 860 EVO SSD, Asus Prime Z370-A mobo, 32Gb G.Skill DDR4 3000Mhz RAM, Win 10 Pro 64-bit, BenQ PD3200U 32” monitor, Fulcrum One yoke.
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