Hey... guys... come now, they're on holidays...

[GoranM 3,818]

35 minutes ago, yidahoo said:

So did I. However the sad fact is that at the moment, pretty much every decent X-Plane post is getting derailed by these trolls and eventually closed down. It's not a one off, its a constant trend. We all know who the perpetrators are, the mods know who the perpetrators are and yet they are still allowed to continue. I get a little trolling some of the time in any group, it happens. But here, it's constant, unimaginative, repetitive and downright annoying. 
As for childish blocking people, that's your opinion, I would rather not see these trolls comments, and would definitely not want them to see my comments. 

If you block someone, but they don't block you, they still see your comments.  You will also see their comments if they are quoted by someone who is not on your blocked list.  Basically, the block function is extremely limited.

[Pastaiolo 1,690]

To be honest, it's not just the "MSFS does this and that" kind of people who gets boring. It's also the "omg Austin is a genius, they have the best people on it, this is a TRUE simulator and i am a basement 737 plane captain, they are doing everything perfectly". 

Exaggerations are bad either way. If we are here it's because we care about the product and would like to see it improved, because no matter what it is showing its age and there are new technologies introduced by other simulators which are nowadays considered standard. Hopefully we'll get to see quite some of them in XP12. With features which will benefit everyone, and not just the self-called "simmers".

The features coming to XP12, for what we know, are good. I just wish there was more attention to marketing and a faster pace in delivering updates/new information/new articles.

 

Edited August 26, 2021 by Pastaiolo

[GoranM 3,818]

7 minutes ago, Pastaiolo said:

It's also the "omg Austin is a genius, they have the best people on it, this is a TRUE simulator and i am a basement 737 plane captain, they are doing everything perfectly". 

I frequent the MSFS forums.  And I've seen far, far more of this on their side when talking about MSFS, Asobo, WT, Fenix, etc....and how fantastic they are. However, there's nothing really wrong with that.  It's a positive message.  And it's great that they're enjoying their platform, coupled with publicly praising the developers.  Creating a flight sim is not an easy task.  Asobo spent 7 years working on MSFS, and they deserve all the praise they can get.

It's when the trolls come here and get negative is when it gets boring, annoying, and starts to sap the enthusiasm from the regulars who want to post in here.

The sim vs game debate, I just choose to stay away from that.  Personally, I think anything which attempts to replicate a real world scenario IS a simulator.  But that's me.

Even Flight Gear can be considered a "sim".

11 minutes ago, Pastaiolo said:

Exaggerations are bad either way. If we are here it's because we care about the product and would like to see it improved, because no matter what it is showing its age and there are new technologies introduced by other simulators which are nowadays considered standard.

I wouldn't quite call them standard yet.  I was wowed when I saw the first MSFS trailer.  So it's new tech that other developers should be taking advantage of if they want to stay competitive.  That's a given.  Judging from the images and videos, it's all coming to fruition, and competition can thrive again.

13 minutes ago, Pastaiolo said:

The features coming to XP12, for what we know, are good. I just wish there was more attention to marketing and a faster pace in delivering updates/new information/new articles.

When certain areas of the next X-Plane are considered "final" or close to final, they'll start sharing more.  There's always tweaks and adjustments to be made.

 

[jarmstro 2,406]

53 minutes ago, GoranM said:

And I've seen far, far more of this on their side when talking about MSFS, Asobo, WT, Fenix, etc....and how fantastic they are. 

True enough. But it's the obsession with a single individual, Meyer, which is unique to X-Plane. 

[mjrhealth 863]

10 minutes ago, jarmstro said:

True enough. But it's the obsession with a single individual, Meyer, which is unique to X-Plane. 

Whats the obsession, its his baby he has every right to do with it as he pleases, and he has no investors to feed. When people had squares flying around on their 286 they where excited, now all every one does is complain.

[GoranM 3,818]

I don't understand why this is such a big deal.

I think David Copperfield is one of the greatest magicians who ever lived.  I was lucky enough to see him when I went to the Las Vegas FS Expo.

I have almost every TV special of his on VHS and some on DVD.

I think Cristiano Ronaldo is one of the greatest soccer players who ever lived.  Whenever Real Madrid played, while he was with them, I would watch all his games.

I think the word "obsession" is a little exaggerated.  I certainly haven't seen anyone get obsessed over Austin.  Obsession, to me, means getting t-shirts, coffee cups, socks, etc... all with Austins face on them.  I've never seen this.  

I appreciate, respect and admire what Austin has achieved and done.  But I wouldn't, according to 1 other person who has said it in the past, "lick his shoes".  That's just a stupid thing to even think about saying.

I have a great deal of respect for ANYONE who came from nothing and built something successful.  

What's wrong with admiring someone and what they've created?

 

[jcomm 6,093]

Pasta nailed it !  

I myself smile every time someone mentions the realism ( me included when talking about stuff I never even rode as a pax IRL ) and the feel of flight of this or that sim or addon.

I tend to be an "extremes" guy, from the install & I love it  to the uninstall and it's word not allowed at a truly bi-polar rhythm, a characteristic I've been trying to fight because I'm a grown up now, for quite a while :-), but I continue to fall in that very same cycle quite often.

Strangely it all began after a huge disappointment, a Love Disappointment in my simmer life 🙂  Her name was "MS FLIGHT", I did all for her after almost 5 yrs away from flight simulation, the longest hiatus I had ever experienced... MS FLIGHT brought me the expectations of a shining future for flight simulation. I even assembled a rig because I had long given away the one I used with FSX and PS1 before...

I hesitate these days to feel so enthusiastic about any of the mainstream platforms. I don't really put my hands on the fire for any of it, less Aerowinx PSX, but that's a different story... 

My experience with combat flightsims also resulted from that 2012 disappointment, and it was a positive one because it revealed how detailed a flightsim can be and still run flawless and smoothly on a low-mid rig. I also sometimes refer to IL2 or DCS giving me a "feel of flight" I can't experience from XP, FSX, AEFS... but truth is I don't really have the slightest idea about how dealing with a 109 should be IRL. All I can talk about, with 40+ years of hands-on experience, is flying gliders, from the early Bergfalke IV and Rhonlerche II to the "modern" plastic gliders I started flying in the early nineties.... and when it comes to "feel of flight", they're all so so far away in so many aspects from the real thing. A simple takeoff and the way we deal with the stick / rudder / flaps and even spoilers in some cases in RL and in a sim is so so so away from reality 😕

Hey Goran, regarding Ronaldo, if Humpty reads that he'll surely come here defend his "lady"... Messi 🙂

Truth being said, I also like Messi quite a LOT... 

Edited August 26, 2021 by jcomm

[Janov 2,383]

48 minutes ago, GoranM said:

When certain areas of the next X-Plane are considered "final" or close to final, they'll start sharing more.

This.

I know that the team is eager to show what they are working on, but in todays heated environment of social media and lurking ***storms, whatever you show must be perfect or it will get ripped apart.

Showing WIP screenshots or videos is just not acceptable these days, you can see what happened when they released the recent videos, people focused on the old tech shown alongside the new assets and started ripping into them (A330 trailer: "OMG, those ground textures look horrible! I am not getting XP12 for sure!".)

It even happens for MSFS - I think most of the videos and screenshots released could pass for real photos, but a vocal part of the community enjoys ripping into them and freaking out about minuscle details not 110% correct. 🙄

Also keep in mind that the majority of folks following the XP12 vs MSFS competition are still believing that XP12 will "blow MSFS out of the water, visually". There is bound to be a lot of disappointment. XP12 will pull a lot closer...but visually it will not match MSFS. It´s strenghts are in other areas.

[tonywob 4,784]

10 hours ago, mjrhealth said:

Terminal building internal details, as for cabin seating etc how many time in a flights in would one ever go into the back of the plane, or view the cargo load, if there is a door between you and the cabin, that should be where the detail ends, but now we have lifting toilet seats, what a waste of time and effort.

My biggest concern with this is that now it is becoming expected of developers to add silly details like this, e.g. detailed terminal interiors, animated toilets, etc.. Once a few developers start trying to copy each other and better one another, it becomes the new norm by which new products are judged, and now these developers have shot theirselves in the foot by making it much more difficult, expensive and time consuming to make products that contain (IMO) pointless details. I've seen a lot of this craze lately with new MFS airports.

 

[Janov 2,383]

3 minutes ago, tonywob said:

silly details like this, e.g. detailed terminal interiors, animated toilets, etc..

This can be explained by the user experience and how they relate to a "flight simulator". Most users have never been in a cockpit, much less flown an aircraft from it. But the majority of users have taken a trip on a passenger airliner...and this involves arriving at the airport, traversing the terminal (interior) on the way to their passenger seat, then staring out at the countryside passing underneath the wing from their passenger window.

This is what "aviation experience" boils down to for most folks, and this is the only expericene that they can judge a simulator´s fidelity by. So naturally there is jubilation if the fee shown at the ticket machine on the airports parking lot is "just as crazy expensive as it is at the real airport"! 😉

[Humpty 752]

1 hour ago, GoranM said:

 

I think Cristiano Ronaldo is one of the greatest soccer players who ever lived.  Whenever Real Madrid played, while he was with them, I would watch all his games.

 

Hi is not Ronaldo , he is Penaldo , scores only in freekicks and penalties and has no game play  and BTW  he is JCOMM's best friend

 

Edited August 26, 2021 by Humpty

[GoranM 3,818]

8 minutes ago, Humpty said:

Hi is not Ronaldo , he is Penaldo , scores only in freekicks and penalties and has no game play  and BTW  he is JCOMM's best friend

 

Lol. Let’s not go there. Bicycle kick against Buffon. Unforgettable. 

[jcomm 6,093]

Hey Hey !  I'm a Messi fan !!!

[akita 429]

1 hour ago, Janov said:

 There is bound to be a lot of disappointment. XP12 will pull a lot closer...but visually it will not match MSFS. It´s strenghts are in other areas.

The tech they already showed for lighting and trees already surpasses what MSFS has to offer. The new art assets they showed, look much better as well (check how a crane looks like with photogrammetry and then compare to what LR showed...).

1 hour ago, tonywob said:

My biggest concern with this is that now it is becoming expected of developers to add silly details like this, e.g. detailed terminal interiors, animated toilets, etc.. Once a few developers start trying to copy each other and better one another, it becomes the new norm by which new products are judged, and now these developers have shot theirselves in the foot by making it much more difficult, expensive and time consuming to make products that contain (IMO) pointless details. I've seen a lot of this craze lately with new MFS airports.

 

I really don't agree. It is mostly up to the developer and his workflows.

If a developer adds another 6 months to his scenery/aircraft development just to make sure the toilets look good, then yeah it is shooting your self in the foot.

If a developer knows how to handle and organize his assets across multiple projects, it can be not that time consuming as others may think. And Xplane with out a doubt has a great "Lego" and "random" approach to add lots and lots of life to a scenery.

 

Edited August 26, 2021 by akita

[mjrhealth 863]

20 minutes ago, Janov said:

This can be explained by the user experience and how they relate to a "flight simulator". Most users have never been in a cockpit, much less flown an aircraft from it. But the majority of users have taken a trip on a passenger airliner...and this involves arriving at the airport, traversing the terminal (interior) on the way to their passenger seat, then staring out at the countryside passing underneath the wing from their passenger window.

This is what "aviation experience" boils down to for most folks, and this is the only expericene that they can judge a simulator´s fidelity by. So naturally there is jubilation if the fee shown at the ticket machine on the airports parking lot is "just as crazy expensive as it is at the real airport"! 😉

And once you give the children too many lollies they seem to think they deserve more, of course it has to all be for free...