In general, I think most of us use our computer for other software and games than MSFS, so I think it's best to keep the monitor itself at 100 Hz. Like others have suggested.

3 hours ago, Republic3D said:

In general, I think most of us use our computer for other software and games than MSFS, so I think it's best to keep the monitor itself at 100 Hz. Like others have suggested.

keep 48" ultra wide @ 120hz for this reason... Always forget/lazy to change it....

10 hours ago, cchiozza said:

Ok thanks, I am running an older 1080TI, I have vsync on and 60. I If I go to 30 it gets choppy. Also do I have run inspector and force gsync/freesync on? 

With regards to this and your original post, much depends on various factors...

What settings are you running at? Ultra? High? Custom settings with some at ultra, some high, etc.? That will affect your maximum FPS.

Okay, so you have a GTX1080Ti. On full ultra settings, for example, you might be hitting 40FPS max. If you have your monitor refresh rate at 60hz, and your GPU is never exceeding 60FPS output, the first thing you want to do is turn Vsync off, because it's doing nothing other than eating up resources, which can cause stuttering. Vsync is software based, takes processing resources, and only works when the GPU is trying to output more frames than the display's refresh rate, e.g. generating 75FPS on a 60hz display, which is when screen tearing occurs.

So don't bother with Vsync unless you know your GPU, at your current game settings, is frequently pushing more than 60FPS to the display.

Ah! But you have a display capable of 100hz. So, unless you're running on all lowest of the low settings, your GPU is not going to be putting out in excess of 100FPS, although on some lower settings it could exceed 60FPS, so, again, don't use Vsync, just set the refresh rate at 100hz.

Now, the next thing you want to do is make your FPS as consistent as possible, to eliminate as much juddering as possible, so if your GPU can consistently output in excess of 60FPS because you're running lower game settings, set a FPS limit of 60FPS to fix it. Likewise, if you're running on full ultra settings, your FPS might barely touch 40, so I would try capping it at 30.

As for Freesync, it might not even be compatible, or not fully compatible, with your NVIDIA GPU. And you need to be connected via Display Port or at least a HDMI 2.1 or above cable. As already stated, there is probably a cut-off (cut-in?) frequency, but it's hard to say what that would be, because there isn't really a standard for Freesync monitors (especially for a 100hz model). It could be around 40hz cut-off point. Freesync (like G-Sync) works by dynamically syncing your refresh rate to the frame rate that the GPU is putting out, so as your FPS is fluctuating, your refresh rate will be fluctuating with it (therefore, it doesn't matter if you set 100 or 60hz, because Freesync ignores that), e.g 50FPS = 50hz, jumps to 60FPS = 60hz, drops to 38FPS, the refresh rate drops to 38hz -- but, ah, therein is the dilemma with Freesync! The question becomes, does the refresh rate change to match FPS if it drops to 38, or does Freesync simply deactivate at that low an FPS? It all depends on your particular monitor.

So, you might be better off disabling Freesync in your monitor settings and looking at the first options regarding setting a constant refresh rate (either 100 or 60) and FPS depending on your sim settings and what the GPU is doing.

Perhaps start by turning Vsync off, don't limit/cap your FPS, and use a FPS monitor to see what kind of FPS your GPU is outputting when unfettered on the graphics settings you want to use in the sim, and start making decisions based on that.

 

Edited November 7, 20214 yr by March Hare

Wow that is ton of great info, thank you for explaining that to me. I never did get it and now it is much clearer.

22 hours ago, Nyxx said:

I think you would fine it a lot smoother still if you ran the in sim V-Sync on and at 30 or 20 and droped you Hz down to 120 or 100. John.

Yes, Nyxx. I'm told that that way is ok, but I tried it and the frame limiter in game does not work in my case neither with NVidia Control Panel. I don't know why!

Anyway, I can go down to 30 with MSI Afeterburner and also lower the Hz.

Thank you!

 

1 hour ago, cchiozza said:

Wow that is ton of great info, thank you for explaining that to me. I never did get it and now it is much clearer.

You're welcome.

3 hours ago, John Fields said:

Yes, Nyxx. I'm told that that way is ok, but I tried it and the frame limiter in game does not work in my case neither with NVidia Control Panel. I don't know why!

Anyway, I can go down to 30 with MSI Afeterburner and also lower the Hz.

Thank you!

 

Vsync doesn't always work, as in it simply doesn't work with some drivers, especially when they're bugged...

Anyway, it might be worth you reading my post above. Vsync is only useful (if it even works) when the frames exceed the refresh rate, but even then it can be problematic, as it eats into resources that can cause stuttering.

I don't know what GPU you have, what resolution you're outputting at, or what simulator settings you're trying to run at. All are a factor. If you leave your monitor at the highest refresh rate you want (144hz?) and you have high/ultra settings across the board, especially with a high resolution such as 4K (again, I don't know your setup), your GPU is unlikely to exceed 144FPS at any time. Vsync becomes active when frames exceed the refresh rate, as I said. So leave the monitor at 144hz -- and you can check whether the FPS of your GPU ever does exceed 144FPS using a frame monitor. If you never get more than 144FPS, turn Vsync off.

Having a higher refresh rate than FPS isn't an issue. However, if you are able to lower your refresh rate to, say, 120hz and your GPU consistently outputs at more than 120FPS, lower the refresh rate to 120 and limit frames to 120FPS, then your refresh rate and FPS will be completely in sync.

These are just examples. What you're looking for is to achieve frame stability. If, on your preferred graphics settings and resolution, for another example, you always get at least 60FPS and never lower, but the upper frame rate fluctuates greatly, limit your FPS to 60 so that it remains at a constant 60. You can then lower your refresh rate to match it (the ideal scenario), but there'll be no harm leaving refresh rate at 144hz either, and in fact you may reduce some motion blurring effects, as well as getting better mouse input response.

All examples, but hopefully you can see the principles I'm getting at. Combine this with my other post above.

Summary: you want stability of frame rates by finding the lowest frame rate the GPU outputs at and limit it around that lower amount, so that frames don't keep dipping excessively below that, causing juddering. It doesn't matter if refresh rate is higher than FPS. You do run into screen tearing, however, if FPS exceeds refresh rate (where Vsync is used).

 

2 hours ago, March Hare said:

Summary: you want stability of frame rates by finding the lowest frame rate the GPU outputs at and limit it around that lower amount,

If I turn off V-Sync under General Options>Graphics, I can no longer set the Frame Rate Limit under General Options>Graphics. So if the recommendation is to not use V-Sync but also limit FPS, how should I do that - via Nvidia Control Panel?

I use a standard 60Hz monitor/TV for display and FPS is never above 60. I have been using V-Sync on and FPS limited to 30 under General Options>Graphics, but apparently V-Sync On is not doing anything since the FPS does not exceed 60.

I also use TrackIR5.

Thx,

Al

Edited November 7, 20214 yr by ark

52 minutes ago, ark said:

If I turn off V-Sync under General Options>Graphics, I can no longer set the Frame Rate Limit under General Options>Graphics. So if the recommendation is to not use V-Sync but also limit FPS, how should I do that - via Nvidia Control Panel?

I use a standard 60Hz monitor/TV for display and FPS is never above 60. I have been using V-Sync on and FPS limited to 30 under General Options>Graphics, but apparently V-Sync On is not doing anything since the FPS does not exceed 60.

I also use TrackIR5.

Thx,

Al

Yes, set it to 30 under the max frame rate option in Nvidia control panel. Ignore (set to off) the Vsync option in the sim.

On 11/6/2021 at 2:59 PM, cchiozza said:

I can run at 100 60 mhz

nice problem to have. I wish my 4K monitor ran at least @ 1 mhz 😊

16 hours ago, March Hare said:

Vsync doesn't always work, as in it simply doesn't work with some drivers, especially when they're bugged...

 

Anyway, it might be worth you reading my post above. Vsync is only useful (if it even works) when the frames exceed the refresh rate, but even then it can be problematic, as it eats into resources that can cause stuttering.

 

I don't know what GPU you have, what resolution you're outputting at, or what simulator settings you're trying to run at. All are a factor. If you leave your monitor at the highest refresh rate you want (144hz?) and you have high/ultra settings across the board, especially with a high resolution such as 4K (again, I don't know your setup), your GPU is unlikely to exceed 144FPS at any time. Vsync becomes active when frames exceed the refresh rate, as I said. So leave the monitor at 144hz -- and you can check whether the FPS of your GPU ever does exceed 144FPS using a frame monitor. If you never get more than 144FPS, turn Vsync off.

 

Having a higher refresh rate than FPS isn't an issue. However, if you are able to lower your refresh rate to, say, 120hz and your GPU consistently outputs at more than 120FPS, lower the refresh rate to 120 and limit frames to 120FPS, then your refresh rate and FPS will be completely in sync.

 

These are just examples. What you're looking for is to achieve frame stability. If, on your preferred graphics settings and resolution, for another example, you always get at least 60FPS and never lower, but the upper frame rate fluctuates greatly, limit your FPS to 60 so that it remains at a constant 60. You can then lower your refresh rate to match it (the ideal scenario), but there'll be no harm leaving refresh rate at 144hz either, and in fact you may reduce some motion blurring effects, as well as getting better mouse input response.

 

All examples, but hopefully you can see the principles I'm getting at. Combine this with my other post above.

 

Summary: you want stability of frame rates by finding the lowest frame rate the GPU outputs at and limit it around that lower amount, so that frames don't keep dipping excessively below that, causing juddering. It doesn't matter if refresh rate is higher than FPS. You do run into screen tearing, however, if FPS exceeds refresh rate (where Vsync is used).

 

 

 

 

 

Hi,

Thank you for your advice!

I'll try some changes!

 

If you use RTSS or NCP to set FPS to 30 and look around and see screen tearing you know why. And when/if you do then use the in sim V-Sync and see how smooth and no tearing things are.

Sorry, I forgot one important detail when suggesting Vsync off, and locking for a stable lower frame rate, which Nyxx has rightly made me realise: you need to have triple buffering enabled in Control Panel.

Edited November 8, 20214 yr by March Hare