>To me, not having a public beta program is a warning sign.>Why would anybody, in this day and age, not have a public beta>program? I might understand for totally new and secret>products or technologies...but for a service pack?The reasons for a "closed beta" are legion, but have less to do with "secrecy" and a LOT more to do with rigorous, controlled, detailed and repetitive testing.Any "beta tester" who cannot devote at least five to ten HOURS every day to the process simply isn't worth having onboard. To be perfectly blunt, "beta testing" isn't a walk in the park. In many ways, it's the intellectual equivalent of digging ditches! :-bang

now in 2D cockpit my shift+backspace and cntl+enter keys for view up/down dont work anymore. Can someone verify please?

There is no cost associated with having an open beta program, other than the bandwidth fees. Clearly they already have people who put rigorous testing hours in. What does it matter if there are additional folk who put in less hours each day, but can discover other issues with their unorthodox methods? What do you care if they do not?You make it sound like the moment the beta program is made open, people will stop doing any kind of official testing on it, just because its an open beta; and that's an unjustified assertion.Also Phil said on his blog that an open beta would "fracture" the community, which is also an exaggeration at best. A beta is a beta and people know its not ready yet. But a beta is a good way for you to show progress being made and raise the spirits of the community. Its also a way to ease in acceptance of changes, and buy more time for a mature release.Finally, there was a reply on Phil's blog post, trying to "educate" the general public about why its "so hard" to test software, and how "proper training" etc. is required. That is basically a bunch of bovine excrement, if you'll pardon the expression. Look at all the beta's Microsoft has run - yes the same company that makes FSX - Vista, for one. Gobs and gobs of Microsoft software have had open beta programs for extensive periods of time, accessible to all sorts of qualified *and* unqualified individuals. An operating system is as complex as it gets, so if they were able to open Vista up, there is absolutely no rational justification to keep FSX locked down.

The standard keys in FSX are shift-Q and ctrl-shift-Q... hold them down until the view changes.Shift-enter and shift-backspace were FS9 conventions. I assume you can change the assignments on the alt/options/settings/controls page.

Hi Dick! I have done what you precise, but I haven't this new view and also, now the key "w" is not functionning. Can you help me please? Many thanks

This is completely wrong. In an open beta, you will have no control over how people submit problems (how many people do you know who can follow directions to the letter), no control over what computer configurations people have and a million other variables. Given this, the data you get back will be largely junk.Not only that, then you need to hire more people to sift through and interpret all the reports that come back, adding a huge cost to the program.Then you also get people testing the problem who are clueless on how to use it/make it work. You'll get tons of reports of "bugs" that are working as designed.I could think of a million other problems with the concept.I just don't see how an open beta could work effectively.Thomas[a href=http://www.flyingscool.com] http://www.flyingscool.com/images/Signature.jpg [/a]I like using VC's :-)N15802 KASH '73 Piper Cherokee Challenger 180

Nope, these still work by default in all my installations. While it may be clear to you, it sounds to me like you are talking about different things. The keys you describe change the view Angle on my system. He's changing the eye Position (up/down, angle stays the same). Thomas[a href=http://www.flyingscool.com] http://www.flyingscool.com/images/Signature.jpg [/a]I like using VC's :-)N15802 KASH '73 Piper Cherokee Challenger 180

5-10...for MS beta you mean?I assume you don't mean addon beta testing right?5-10...that's a full time job hahah!

Is there a way to manually delete the cockpit textures that appear in 2D mode?That could be a temporary solution in giving us back the unobstructed view in all directions in 2D view when the panel is toggled off. That could be a slightly better solution than moving the viewpoint to remove the obstruction. And that's temporary, until ACES fixes this problem.

I believe you are looking at the VC cockpit textures, so removing them is not really an option... unless you do not want a virtual cockpit at all..

"5-10...that's a full time job hahah!"YepThomas[a href=http://www.flyingscool.com] http://www.flyingscool.com/images/Signature.jpg [/a]I like using VC's :-)N15802 KASH '73 Piper Cherokee Challenger 180

>5-10...for MS beta you mean?I am referring to beta testing of FS. Most of the folks testing either work full-time in add-on development already or are retired. In both cases investing the requisite time in rigorous testing is achievable.Testing is really rather boring for the most part, since it typically involves flying the same scenerio over and over and over... ...until one is quite sick of the experience. :-erks

Phil,This problem was introduced only with SP1. Can we have it fixed please.Gary

Hi All,OK, here's the scoop: Something was broke in FSX, it was fixed in SP1 and this is the result of the fix. You were never supposed to see what you did see in FSX: the SP1 view should have been there all along.So you can:1. Go back to FSX pre SP1.2. Change the 3rd eyepoint value in each aircraft.cfg.3. Raise your view with Shift/Enter for UP and Shift/Backspace for DOWN until you are happy with the side views.Thanks, Jimhttp://www.hifisim.com/banners/hifi-community-sigbanner.jpghttp://www.hifisim.com/

I'm sorry, but I have to disagree. If my memory serves me correctly all versions from at least FS98 forward worked the way they FSX did pre SP1 with the "W" key eliminating side and rear obstruction as well as the instrument panel. I just can't beleive that after almost 10 years someone suddenly decided that it had been wrong all that time. That doesn't make sense to me. It's not logical as Mr Spock would say.