Randazzo from PMDG just made a comment on how the demand for PMDG's P3D products has changed over the last yeah and a half:
 

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Paul- The hard reality is that demand for P3D products has evaporated. We saw a 30% decline in month-over-month revenue that started a week after MSFS was announced. Sales for P3D products have departed downward steadily since then and now muster about 25% of what they did even a year ago. We released the 777-200ER for P3D and the DC-6 for MSFS and the differences are stark and real. 

 

Edited February 8, 20224 yr by abrams_tank

If I knew what I know today I would have bought the 737 from iFly and the numbers would be even worse.

Edited February 8, 20224 yr by Juliet Alpha

It's likely this 30% sales drop was based on P3D users thinking that MSFS would be a better simulation (after all, it looked better in the announcement video, therefore it must be better) and that all P3D developers will follow their customers and shift to MSFS. I'm sure their thinking was: so, why buy expensive addons for P3D when one would have to buy them again for MSFS? Some of those users are seeing that the MSFS eco system isn't ready for them yet. But the developers are seeing many more potential customers on the MSFS side (Xbox, etc.) which motivates them to focus development on that side. 

 

52 minutes ago, abrams_tank said:

Randazzo from PMDG just made a comment on how the demand for PMDG's P3D products has changed over the last yeah and a half:
 

 

I gotta admit.  You have an incredible obsession with all things that pin MSFS against p3d. 

 

One point I will make on RSR's comments.  They haven't released much over the last year to warrant big sales numbers.  I'm not counting things like BBJ and cargo 737.  If they had released the max, numbers would have likely been very large.  

Also many considered the 777 ER to be over priced when the value proposition was taken into account.  

Edited February 8, 20224 yr by micstatic
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Well as I already had a hanger full of PMDG aircraft before MSFS came out and have purchased the 777 since it`s not surprising. But I will not be purchasing any addon aircraft for MSFS, I have what I want in P3D. 

10 minutes ago, micstatic said:

I gotta admit.  You have an incredible obsession with all things that pin MSFS against p3d. 

I'm actually interested in the business outcome of this.  I don't own any Microsoft stock at the moment (and even if I did, MSFS's overall revenue is a very, very, tiny piece of Microsoft's total revenue anyways), so it's Microsoft share holders and Satya Nadella that benefit the most from MSFS's success.

However, since I also like flight simming, MSFS vs P3D vs XP makes for a very interesting business case study. It's very possible that this may become a business case study in future business courses, who knows.

 

Perhaps the P3D sales wouldn't be quite as bad if PMDG didn't charge $77.20 for an add on that has only part the promised features, compared to a fully fledged base package DC-6 for MSFS, currently priced nearly $20 less.

3 minutes ago, abrams_tank said:

I'm actually interested in the business outcome of this. 

 

Everybody in the p3d forum knows you are very interested in this.  Does it warrant a separate thread? I would say probably not. While you may have a huge interest in this topic personally, from the outside it is very clear why you continue to post these things over here. 

I also can't say it would be a very interesting case study at all.  Newer product comes out and generates more sales at the expense of the older product.  That book has been out for a while... 

To me. it's a little bit of "chicken vs egg".

RSR has made commitments in the past for P3D customers. For example, from the simple (make an installer for the DC-6 for P3D v5) to the little more complex (finish the cockpit upgrade and add the rainmaker for the B777).

As can only be surmised, these P3D "upgrades" have been shelved indefinitely in favor of MSFS development. Never mind the X-Plane guys who got duped on the short-lived DC-6 for XP-10.

So, it appears, those customers who've supported PMDG for 20+ years no longer seem to matter...let's jump onto the millennials to squeeze some cash out of MSFS...Daddy needs to fuel up the Cessna Citation! 

8 minutes ago, micstatic said:

I also can't say it would be a very interesting case study at all.  Newer product comes out and generates more sales at the expense of the older product.  That book has been out for a while... 

What's interesting is that XP has maintained it sales so far with XP 11, a year and a half after MSFS's release.  3rd party devs have not reported a significant drop in XP add-on sales.  This, I didn't expect at all. I would have thought MSFS would have taken market share about equally from P3D and XP, but it's not turning out that way.

So it's not as straight forward as you think it is.

Edited February 8, 20224 yr by abrams_tank

What exactly is this mythical upgrade for the 777 VC supposed to add? I fly the 777 in P3Dv4 (a version that is actually too old to be updated), and the VC looks mighty impressive on my 24" 1080p monitor.

Edited February 8, 20224 yr by Christopher Low

2 minutes ago, Christopher Low said:

What exactly is this mythical upgrade for the 777 VC supposed to add? I fly the 777 in P3Dv4 (a version that is actually too old to be updated), and the VC looks mighty impressive on my 24" 1080p monitor.

Looks not so good on my 43" 4k screen.  It needs PBR and dynamic lighting.  Very much the same thing they did going from the NGX to the NGXU.  I also was incredibly underwhelmed with the sounds for the other engine variants.  Also the engine animations are not good.  I admit I'm not as in love with long haul flying as some.  But to me the update felt like a very expensive EFB.  

I have no intention of purchasing the 777-200 ER expansion pack. I really enjoy flying the LR/F, and in fact I prefer it to the 747-400 for quite a few reasons.

5 minutes ago, abrams_tank said:

What's interesting is that XP has maintained it sales so far with XP 11, a year and a half after MSFS's release.  This, I didn't expect at all. I would have thought MSFS would have taken market share about equally from P3D and XP, but it's not turning out that way.

So it's not as straight forward as you think it is.

yes perhaps that is more interesting.  I think XP has a few things going for it right now.  Some very well done new planes that have recently been released or will be released.  More untapped areas (Airports etc) for developers to sell their products.  Excitement over a coming XP12.  I've often maintained that in a few years the diehard airline guys have as much of a chance that XP12 will be their full time sim as MSFS.  P3D still very enjoyable for many with more promise than developers give it credit due to the commercial aspect.  Guess we will see. 

I'm not surprised P3D aircraft sales have stagnated because unlike MSFS there haven't been any new aircraft for P3D for a very long time. The last really big release was the NGXU but that was several years ago and it came off the back of the NGX. Since then we've just had variants but variants tend to only appeal as niche products, far fewer will buy the cargo or BBJ 737.

The 777-200ER was welcome but sales were probably poorer because it wasn't updated to NGXU standards so it appeals far less. It's hard to forget that many people owned the 777 for FSX and PMDG's release to P3D meant we had to effectively pay twice (I was one of them). The full 777 product line still today costs over $200 which is an insane amount of money for a very old product.

This is why I find any 'P3D is dead' argument to just be lazy to be honest. The vast majority of the sim community outside of Xbox will have come from P3D. Many of us follow the aircraft on offer so if something new came out for P3D then we'd all buy it because we've done it for many years. I just added up my spending with PMDG over the last 5 years and it's $605!

Edited February 8, 20224 yr by G MIDY