Whatever RSR. I have spent enough money on your past products. I won’t spend another cent on your planes in MSFS. 

12 minutes ago, Christopher Low said:

What exactly is this mythical upgrade for the 777 VC supposed to add? I fly the 777 in P3Dv4 (a version that is actually too old to be updated), and the VC looks mighty impressive on my 24" 1080p monitor.

The non-PBR VC looks very dated compared to much cheaper airliners from other devs. On a larger screen it's noticeable how much better even the Aerosoft Airbuses VCs are.

Also, it's the much lauded improvements to LNAV logic that were promised, now seemingly limited to only the 747v3.

29 minutes ago, abrams_tank said:

'm actually interested in the business outcome of this.  I don't own any Microsoft stock at the moment (and even if I did, MSFS's overall revenue is a very, very, tiny piece of Microsoft's total revenue anyways),

If Phil Spencer never brought MSFS back trust me it would not have any effect on MS stock, why do flight simmers think they are so important to the industry if that were true MS would have had no problem selling flight sim commercial rights to someone but they had no takers. 

19 minutes ago, F737NG said:

The non-PBR VC looks very dated compared to much cheaper airliners from other devs. On a larger screen it's noticeable how much better even the Aerosoft Airbuses VCs are.

Also, it's the much lauded improvements to LNAV logic that were promised, now seemingly limited to only the 747v3.

I still do not understand it. The textures (2048) and detail of the 777 VC on my monitor are top notch. I am extremely fussy when it comes to graphical quality (particularly texture resolution), so I am struggling to see the problem. I guess this is another good reason to stick with 1080p

56 minutes ago, abrams_tank said:

IHowever, since I also like flight simming, MSFS vs P3D vs XP makes for a very interesting business case study. It's very possible that this may become a business case study in future business courses, who knows.

 

From what I've read I think you meant "flaming MSFS vs P3D vs XP" instead of "flight simming, MSFS vs P3D vs XP".🤣

What makes you think that any reputable business school would be interested in minor video game producers?  Head-shaking mode. 

Edited February 8, 20224 yr by BlueStar

37 minutes ago, micstatic said:

yes perhaps that is more interesting.  I think XP has a few things going for it right now.  Some very well done new planes that have recently been released or will be released.  More untapped areas (Airports etc) for developers to sell their products.  Excitement over a coming XP12.  I've often maintained that in a few years the diehard airline guys have as much of a chance that XP12 will be their full time sim as MSFS.  P3D still very enjoyable for many with more promise than developers give it credit due to the commercial aspect.  Guess we will see. 

Maybe.  There is certainly some difference between P3D and XP, such that XP has maintained its market for 3rd party add-ons.  Perhaps XP has more brand loyalty from its customers than P3D, and this might be partially attributed to Austin.  Perhaps there is also enough product differentiation between MSFS and XP, to allow XP to maintain its customer base, whereas P3D users don't see as much of a product differentiation between P3D and MSFS.

Whatever it is, it has allowed XP to keep its add-on market stable and 3rd party devs continue to report their add-on sales on XP still haven't had a dramatic drop yet.

1 hour ago, micstatic said:

Everybody in the p3d forum knows you are very interested in this.  Does it warrant a separate thread? I would say probably not. While you may have a huge interest in this topic personally, from the outside it is very clear why you continue to post these things over here. 

I also can't say it would be a very interesting case study at all.  Newer product comes out and generates more sales at the expense of the older product.  That book has been out for a while... 

@abrams_tank more to @micstatic point, wouldn't this topic generate more "business" interest in MSFS forum? It does seem a bit inflammatory, or at least inviting to controversy, to post in P3D forum. Why not put the "business" model topic in XPlane forum?  Or better yet, Hangar Chat.

Edited February 8, 20224 yr by hs118

6 minutes ago, abrams_tank said:

Maybe.  There is certainly some difference between P3D and XP, such that XP has maintained its market for 3rd party add-ons.  Perhaps XP has more brand loyalty from its customers than P3D, and this might be partially attributed to Austin.  Perhaps there is also enough product differentiation between MSFS and XP, to allow XP to maintain its customer base, whereas P3D users don't see as much of a product differentiation between P3D and MSFS.

Whatever it is, it has allowed XP to keep its add-on market stable and 3rd party devs continue to report their add-on sales on XP still haven't had a dramatic drop yet.

p3d already had great versions of some of the airports XP is just getting now for the first time.  So not sure that's it. In terms of airline flying I see huge differentiation between MSFS and P3D/XP.  I think each of these two sims both have huge advantages over MSFS in many respects for airliner flying.  The most interesting part of this "case study" to me will be when one or a few in depth airliners finally come out.  If not up to the standard we know and love now due to sim limitations, it's possible xp could see some decent growth.  possibly p3d also.  Cheaper airplanes and port over scenery sell in massive numbers right now in msfs.  But will expensive airliners?  guess we shall see. 

7 minutes ago, micstatic said:

p3d already had great versions of some of the airports XP is just getting now for the first time.  So not sure that's it. In terms of airline flying I see huge differentiation between MSFS and P3D/XP.  I think each of these two sims both have huge advantages over MSFS in many respects for airliner flying.  The most interesting part of this "case study" to me will be when one or a few in depth airliners finally come out.  If not up to the standard we know and love now due to sim limitations, it's possible xp could see some decent growth.  possibly p3d also.  Cheaper airplanes and port over scenery sell in massive numbers right now in msfs.  But will expensive airliners?  guess we shall see. 

Oh, for sure. One of the biggest product differentiators between MSFS vs XP/P3D is the study level airliners.  So it will be very interesting to see what happens when they start making their way into MSFS, how the market reacts.

1 hour ago, micstatic said:

Everybody in the p3d forum knows you are very interested in this.  Does it warrant a separate thread? I would say probably not

lol have you seen some of the threads posted in this not-very-active forum lately? One dude uses it as his personal blog whenever he thinks he sees a .0000005% increase in FPS from the latest hot fix. Plenty of room for this thread, and at two pages, it seems like others are also interested in the topic. 

20 minutes ago, abrams_tank said:

Oh, for sure. One of the biggest product differentiators between MSFS vs XP/P3D is the study level airliners.  So it will be very interesting to see what happens when they start making their way into MSFS, how the market reacts.

MSFS will still have to contend with real world weather and the API, forced updates, home cockpit support etc.  Still a hill to walk up for them.  

 

21 minutes ago, Chapstick said:

lol have you seen some of the threads posted in this not-very-active forum lately? One dude uses it as his personal blog whenever he thinks he sees a .0000005% increase in FPS from the latest hot fix. Plenty of room for this thread, and at two pages, it seems like others are also interested in the topic. 

Not very active forum lately?  Are you kidding.  The last month the forum has been very active over here.  Not as much as MSFS if that's what you mean.  

I have purchased only one PMDG product since MSFS released…the -200ER.

..but that’s because I already own the NGXu, 747-400/-8, 777-200LR/-300ER

Slow sales? Nothing has really been released in the last 18 months except an expansion for a nearly 10 year old product. 
 

What does RR want me to do? Buy more of the aircraft I already have?

2 hours ago, David Vega said:

It's likely this 30% sales drop was based on P3D users thinking that MSFS would be a better simulation (after all, it looked better in the announcement video, therefore it must be better) and that all P3D developers will follow their customers and shift to MSFS. I'm sure their thinking was: so, why buy expensive addons for P3D when one would have to buy them again for MSFS? Some of those users are seeing that the MSFS eco system isn't ready for them yet. But the developers are seeing many more potential customers on the MSFS side (Xbox, etc.) which motivates them to focus development on that side. 

 

MSFS2020 is a 10 year plan,and will be ready in 7 years.......

I realize this is the P3D forum and for many many many years P3D has served me well. However, If you believe that P3D has a future in the causal simmer market then you are kidding yourselves. 

You can shout at PMDG all you like, the market dictates development and they are a business. The tech in other simulators is already miles ahead and development continues at breakneck speed. LM does not care as we are not their bread and butter. 

You can embrace the future and enjoy the amazing advances/experiences new sims give you or stick with the familiar and go the way of FSX. At least now Microsoft has given you a choice. 

1 minute ago, rocketlaunch said:

You can embrace the future and enjoy the amazing advances/experiences new sims give you

Really?