MSFS 2020 Auto FPS App v0.4.2

[Fiorentoni 4,306]

20 hours ago, mmcmah said:

Unfortunately, at least in my case, when AutoFPS does decide to start dropping TLOD as you get closer to complex scenery, it enters a vicious and self-perpetuating cycle that causes more stutters and drops in FPS and TLOD.

You have found the reason why Asobo never came around to doing a dynamic LOD, even though it should be quite obvious early in the development cycle that something like this is needed. It just doesn't work out well because of those intertwined factors. As you see it's already hard to get it right on a single personal system, just think about getting it right on each and every possible MSFS user's system. It'd be a true nightmare.

The only thing that works reliably for everyone and does not create those issues is a semi-dynamic LOD based on AGL - not FPS. That's what DynamicLOD does.

[mmcmah 430]

7 hours ago, Reset XPDR said:

I am thinking about disabling TLOD changes below 100 ft for FPS Tolerance in VFR mode, just like it is for FPS Sensitivity in VFR mode, because changing TLOD on the ground just invites texture tearing (DX12) and/or flashing (DX11 and DX12). Not many users will use FPS Tolerance anyway, but I think @mmcmahmay have during testing. If there is no serious objection I will remove TLOD ground changes and below 100ft in FPS Tolerance VFR mode (the FPS tolerance formula will still work the same in the air otherwise) as I strongly believe it is the right way to implement it.

Yes, I like the TLOD changing on the ground, but understand your reasoning for removing it. I'll probably keep the previous version around for a while as a result.

[mmcmah 430]

6 minutes ago, Fiorentoni said:

You have found the reason why Asobo never came around to doing a dynamic LOD, even though it should be quite obvious early in the development cycle that something like this is needed. It just doesn't work out well because of those intertwined factors. As you see it's already hard to get it right on a single personal system, just think about getting it right on each and every possible MSFS user's system. It'd be a true nightmare.

The only thing that works reliably for everyone and does not create those issues is a semi-dynamic LOD based on AGL - not FPS. That's what DynamicLOD does.

That's an good observation and it's good that we have the choice to have either. I think AutoFPS allows you to be more aggressive with target specific performance, though, as you simply don't know enough about the system's performance with AGL alone to know how far you can push it.

[Fiorentoni 4,306]

1 minute ago, mmcmah said:

That's an good observation and it's good that we have the choice to have either. I think AutoFPS allows you to be more aggressive with target specific performance, though, as you simply don't know enough about the system's performance with AGL alone to know how far you can push it.

Yes, I understand the potential advantage of AutoFPS, but the question is -  with all the potential issues in certain situations with an FPS target and constant changes -  if the actual experience is really better. FPS is one thing, but (mini-)stutters cannot be measured so it's quite subjective to compare. I'm just saying: Try both apps and see which one overall makes your experience better.

[Reset XPDR 1,307]

57 minutes ago, Cpt_Piett said:

I would strongly suggest that, as a high TLOD on ground is not needed in most situations. Then delay increases until at least 100ft AGL.

I've gone ahead and changed VFR mode to start with TLOD min, not the default MSFS TLOD setting, just like IFR mode does.

 

59 minutes ago, Cpt_Piett said:

Also, I can’t see why it should matter that much what aircraft you fly in remote areas. The approach speed is of course higher in airliners. But with enough headroom the CPU impact of an airliner shouldn’t matter that much.

The naming of the two main app modes has always been very contentious. It first started out as FPS priority and TLOD Min on ground/landing, which was very functional but not readily understandable to novices. Then VFR and IFR, which we have now. Recently I've had some ask me to call them GA and airliner respectively and others want simple scenery and complex scenery respectively. I think keeping VFR and IFR and the current tooltips using GA regional and Airliner complex terminology respectively is about the best compromise I can come up with.

[Cpt_Piett 4,800]

1 hour ago, Reset XPDR said:

I've gone ahead and changed VFR mode to start with TLOD min, not the default MSFS TLOD setting, just like IFR mode does.

I'm very glad you did - can't wait to try it out!

1 hour ago, Reset XPDR said:

The naming of the two main app modes has always been very contentious. It first started out as FPS priority and TLOD Min on ground/landing, which was very functional but not readily understandable to novices. Then VFR and IFR, which we have now. Recently I've had some ask me to call them GA and airliner respectively and others want simple scenery and complex scenery respectively. I think keeping VFR and IFR and the current tooltips using GA regional and Airliner complex terminology respectively is about the best compromise I can come up with.

I fully understand this and appreciate how difficult it must be to find terminology that will cause the least amount of confusion. And I agree with you that what you've done in the latest build (which I haven't had time to test yet) - is probably as good as it gets. The comprehensive readme is always there should one need to look things up. 

For me, the easiest way to think about it is IFR - complex scenery & VFR - remote areas. 

In my current MSFS session, I've been on quite the EU tour with the Fenix until I had to refuel. LFMN-LFMT-LFBZ-LEBB-LESO-EGLL-EHAM-EBBR-LFPO-EDDK-EHRD-EDDH - not a single full-stop landing until EDDH 😆

All in IFR mode w/ FSLTL AI traffic. Before I went to sleep, I left the aircraft parked at EDDH with the sim still running. Some 11 hours later I returned to the PC, and lo and behold, the sim is still running. Just saw an airliner taking off. FPS is at a constant 80 with almost zero frame time variance. 

During this session, AutoFPS has done a grand job in keeping things smooth. I truly have not experienced any significant stutters (I know, it is a bold claim, and I understand if someone finds it hard to believe). Although flying into some of the largest hubs (EGLL, EHAM), FPS fell well below my target FPS of 80 (probably down to low 60's IIRC). Nothing AutoFPS can do to prevent this - it reduced TLOD to 50 and clouds to medium but my CPU simply couldn't keep up in the most demanding areas. That's with 8 performance-cores (16 threads with HT) overclocked to 5100MHz. 

As I'm very content with the performance in IFR mode, my next crazy project will be in VFR mode using the fastest single prop in my hangar - the Vertigo. I intend to take it to Lofoten and really push the limits as hard as I can. This will include (but not be limited to) flying at very low altitudes at 365kts. I will of course do a video recording of the spectacle. While doing this, Reset will hopefully be asleep, blissfully unaware of my shenanigans. 

By the way, I had to look up the word contentious. I hope you're referring to the first meaning, and not nr 2 😅

Quote

1 : likely to cause disagreement or argument 2 : exhibiting an often perverse and wearisome tendency to quarrels and disputes.

 

Edited March 22 by Cpt_Piett

[John Fields 280]

Hi, 

Reset XPDR,

You're a saint!

Thank you!

 

[FalconAF 213]

5 hours ago, Cpt_Piett said:

my next crazy project will be in VFR mode using the fastest single prop in my hangar - the Vertigo. I intend to take it to Lofoten and really push the limits as hard as I can. This will include (but not be limited to) flying at very low altitudes at 365kts. I will of course do a video recording of the spectacle. While doing this, Reset will hopefully be asleep, blissfully unaware of my shenanigans. 

 

 

But this is one of the "variables" issues that @Restore simply won't be able to make a "one size fits all" app for to make everybody happy.  I could (and do on several occasions just for fun) hop in the F18 Hornet (or the F22 Raptor freeware from Top Mach Studio) and go "VFR Ground Hugging" at Mach 1 with my hair on fire.  Through places like the Grand Canyon, the Swiss Alps (it's fun buzzing LOWI at 100 AGL and 700kts), or even the Mt Everest areas (the Lukla airport canyon area, etc).  Obviously these would be VFR flights and could (would) have a constantly changing AGL value for the airplane.  Which would send the AutoFPS app into spasms if I used unrealistic TLOD values for the hardware I was using.  Heck, even over a flat desert terrain with no OLOD objects to display, at Mach 1 at 100 ft AGL the "terrain" being displayed can get "blurry" simply because the sim may not be able to keep up loading it in front of you fast enough anymore, regardless of the TLOD setting.  So what does "really pushing the limits" mean in our cases?  Would you be pushing them more than me?  Or vice-versa?  

All I'm saying is that anybody could find a way to "break the app" if they tried hard enough.  But that would not be a "negative" against what the app can really do for most people's flying experiences when used the way it was intended by @Reset.  I honestly don't think @Reset intended his VFR mode to be "very low altitudes" at 365 knots (or Mach 1 either).  If I'm wrong about that, I'll stand corrected.

(PS - Testing positive for COVID sucks.  And I can't tase my hot wings anymore for now 🥺)   

Edited March 22 by FalconAF

[Cpt_Piett 4,800]

@FalconAF I’m 100% sure he didn’t intend for VFR mode to be used this way, In fact he has said so explicitly. But then again, ever since I started using AutoFPS, I’ve tried to use it in as many creative ways as I can think of. This is NOT to try to break it, honestly. I know it may seem that way sometimes, but whenever I say that, I’m not being serious. I really hope Reset understands that. For those who have read my many comments and rants, it should be obvious I have nothing but praise for Reset’s work.

And btw, long before AutoFPS existed, I did some crazy aerobatics at low altitude over New Zealand. Also, I've had my share of fun in the F18 blasting 100ft above Himalaya's Kali Gandaki river all the way from Mustang to Pokhara. 

As I couldn't think of flying without AutoFPS (now that I've experienced it’s magic), it makes sense to me to use VFR mode when flying in a GA aircraft in a remote area. Well, the Vertigo might not even classify as a GA aircraft in this sense. But hey, that's what I intend to test. Will it be possible?

By the way, my heart just skipped several beats as I couldn't get AutoFPS to start 😱 Turns out it was blocked by my antivirus software, phew!

And btw I think non-expert, auto-target-fps mode is intended to be the one size fits all alternative. Expert mode however has a myriad of options, and I don’t see why we shouldn’t try to tweak these to get the best simming experience as possible. 

@FalconAF sorry if I came across a bit harsh, that was not my intention. Especially as you're dealing with that pesky Covid virus right now. I hope you get well soon. 

My mood had deteriorated as I just ran into the "perfect storm" of things going wrong at once: Nvidia driver crashed Windows because I was silly enough to render a video with MSFS open, then upon restarting MSFS a new beta update had dropped. After having dealt with that spectacle, I couldn't get AutoFPS to run. And finally I couldn't for the life of me figure out why Nvidia wouldn't display FPS as it had done so in the previous MSFS session... Phew. Sometimes dealing with computers is a test of virtue and patience. Pro tip: don't render a video with Nvidia NVENC encoder with MSFS running...

/rant

EDIT: It's working! VFR mode, 300+ kts, low altitude => stable 80 FPS and TLOD 900+ 😮 

Edited March 22 by Cpt_Piett

[Cpt_Piett 4,800]

I made a little video as a tribute to AutoFPS and the way it has transformed our simming experience. Thanks Reset!

Settings: Expert VFR mode, TLOD max 975, FPS sensitivity 5

Edited March 23 by Cpt_Piett

[Cpt_Piett 4,800]

On 3/22/2024 at 2:31 PM, Reset XPDR said:

I've gone ahead and changed VFR mode to start with TLOD min, not the default MSFS TLOD setting, just like IFR mode does.

This seems to be working well! I'm getting very nice results at ENTC (urban but less dense area):

Thanks for implementing this. I hope others find it useful as well. @mmcmah?

EDIT: Just landed the Fenix at ENST Sandnessjøen. Which must certainly be placed in the remote area group as there’s not much else around than mountains and the North Sea.

No stutters on final approach like on last version. Absolutely stunning views (the Helgeland area is renowned for its natural beauty). 

Btw I reduced target FPS to 65 i.e. sacrificed performance for higher TLODs.

Quote

Expert: True Mode: FG ATgtFPS: False FltType: VFR TgtFPS: 65 TLODAMtd: 0 Tol: 5 TMin: 50 TMax: 975 TMinEx: true CloudQ: True CRecovT: 100 Pause: True TLODBAlt: 1000 MaxDesRate 2000 CustomOLOD: True OLODB: 1000 OLODT: 20 OLODBAlt: 2000 OLODTAlt: 10000 

 

FPS: 65 FGAct: True Pri: FPS TLOD: 613 OLOD: 981 AGL: 2149 FPM: -780 Clouds: Medium 

FPS: 65 FGAct: True Pri: FPS TLOD: 610 OLOD: 1000 AGL: 1655 FPM: -822 Clouds: Medium 

FPS: 65 FGAct: True Pri: FPS TLOD: 620 OLOD: 1000 AGL: 1422 FPM: -756 Clouds: Medium 

FPS: 65 FGAct: True Pri: FPS TLOD: 615 OLOD: 1000 AGL: 1005 FPM: -592 Clouds: Medium 

FPS: 63 FGAct: True Pri: FPS TLOD: 596 OLOD: 1000 AGL: 666 FPM: -669 Clouds: Medium 

FPS: 63 FGAct: True Pri: FPS TLOD: 573 OLOD: 1000 AGL: 413 FPM: -1046 Clouds: Medium 

FPS: 63 FGAct: True Pri: FPS TLOD: 567 OLOD: 1000 AGL: 214 FPM: -967 Clouds: Medium 

FPS: 62 FGAct: True Pri: FPS TLOD: 565 OLOD: 1000 AGL: 105 FPM: -775 Clouds: Medium 

FPS: 62 FGAct: True Pri: TLOD TLOD: 565 OLOD: 1000 AGL: 12 FPM: -294 Clouds: Medium 

 

[go-around after touchdown]

 

FPS: 62 FGAct: True Pri: FPS TLOD: 559 OLOD: 1000 AGL: 385 FPM: 3099 Clouds: Medium 

FPS: 66 FGAct: True Pri: FPS TLOD: 551 OLOD: 1000 AGL: 834 FPM: 2651 Clouds: Medium 

FPS: 67 FGAct: True Pri: FPS TLOD: 567 OLOD: 1000 AGL: 1288 FPM: 3449 Clouds: Medium 

FPS: 68 FGAct: True Pri: FPS TLOD: 591 OLOD: 1000 AGL: 1798 FPM: 3256 Clouds: Medium 

FPS: 68 FGAct: True Pri: FPS TLOD: 619 OLOD: 974 AGL: 2237 FPM: 2464 Clouds: Medium 

Video is coming! 

Edited March 23 by Cpt_Piett

[Old_As_Dirt 160]

My experience is that v0.4.2, using Auto Target FPS, with USE EXPERT OPTIONS (all unchanged from default) provides the smoothest experience of any.  I'm hooked and have no plans to change.  Thanks for all your work Reset XPDR!

[Bobsk8 12,827]

10 minutes ago, Old_As_Dirt said:

My experience is that v0.4.2, using Auto Target FPS, with USE EXPERT OPTIONS (all unchanged from default) provides the smoothest experience of any.  I'm hooked and have no plans to change.  Thanks for all your work Reset XPDR!

Same here, besides I am getting cross eyed reading through tons of  pages of reports every 1/2 hour trying to figure out what works and what doesn't. 4.2 in expert mode works perfectly. I prefer to set my own target FPS. 

[Cpt_Piett 4,800]

41 minutes ago, Bobsk8 said:

Same here, besides I am getting cross eyed reading through tons of  pages of reports every 1/2 hour trying to figure out what works and what doesn't.

Fair point. Already up to 20 pages. The other one reached 70 or so I think. I put it down to how popular this app is, and how many people are testing it.

For the last week I’ve been thinking of writing a guide, but I’m unsure how to make it accessible, as things get buried pretty quickly here on Avsim.

Edited March 23 by Cpt_Piett

[DuckZilla85 17]

On 3/22/2024 at 8:30 AM, Fiorentoni said:

You have found the reason why Asobo never came around to doing a dynamic LOD, even though it should be quite obvious early in the development cycle that something like this is needed. It just doesn't work out well because of those intertwined factors. As you see it's already hard to get it right on a single personal system, just think about getting it right on each and every possible MSFS user's system. It'd be a true nightmare.

The only thing that works reliably for everyone and does not create those issues is a semi-dynamic LOD based on AGL - not FPS. That's what DynamicLOD does.

Hit the nail on the head. 

After my first positive impressions with AutoFPS, I started noticing frame time & stuttering issues. I played with all of the settings to try to mitigate the negative effects but with no avail. Then tried DynamicLOD which honestly give me better results and I find it more straightforward to use.