Considering that one would purchase a monthly licence to use P3D(because for most the full license would not really be an option), would we not, in theory anyway, be at subject to LM's continued use of this application ? What would happen, theoretically, if we started to purchase more and more FSX converted addons for P3D and LM decided to stop developing/supporting it, or just changed direction totally. Where would those with monthly licenses be left? Would your PC still run P3D if the monthly licence has timed out?I know there is no indication whatsoever that this is about to happen, and on balance probably won't, but neither did I think Flight would actually become the fiasco that is has..

Edited January 9, 201214 yr by dukebe60

All I know is that the future of P3D for consumers like us if very uncertain. We are 'allowed' the use P3D but we aren't the main target for it. They can kick you out anytime they want to and you won't be able to moan about it because according to the current EULA, most if us aren't even allowed to use P3D. (Yes, I know what Nicol said about this and I don't want to start THAT discussion all over again, but there is no denying that the current EULA gives you no rights which you can use to fight a block from LM. It's only Nicol's explanation that gives you the right... but that won't hold before a judge if you want to sue LM for blocking you out.)There IS a change that the money you put in P3D will be invested in vain and for nothing... And then you will have to get used to FSX again. Or MS Flight. :wink:I am waiting anyhow for version 2.0 to see what that brings (the current version does nothing for me) but even then I won't invest too much in it until simmers like us are regarded as legitimate users. On paper too.BTW I thought this topic was in the Prepar3D forum (I came here using the View new content option). Maybe some mod can move it there? This doesn't belong in the MS Flight forum.

Edited January 9, 201214 yr by J van E

FSX is working now, and will be for a while. At the moment there is no reason to go over to Prepar3d. I believe the best strategy is to stick with FSX and keep an eye on the other sims, and see what happens. I don't think much will be happening withn the next year or two, so why not enjoy FSX while it lasts?It might be an idea to purchase X-plane, since it is relatively cheap and there are some nice add-ons for it now. You can have some real fun with the Aircraft maker too. It does no harm, and it make make it easier to make the move in the future, if it becomes necessary./Jason

Get the free November/December issue of Computer Pilot and use the coupon code for a one month free use of P3D.Test it out and see how it goes and then think about committing to a monthly subscription. It's not that big of a decision to make.

Edited January 9, 201214 yr by Alex Goff

As P3D is essentially FSX, I don't think many people (well me anyway) will consider it until v2 comes out next year (maybe).

As P3D is essentially FSX, I don't think many people (well me anyway) will consider it until v2 comes out next year (maybe).

Same here, my decision will be based on version 2 improvements and the reliability.

How far does a developer have to alter an engine, or any code-base, before they can call it their own?... thinking of games developers such as Bethesda and Skyrim with their 'Creation' engine, which is obviously still in part 'Gamebryo'... and Modern Warfare's engine which had been build from Quake3 code... even Valve's 'Source' engine has some legacy code from ID's older Quake engine, yet I doubt any of the original engines owners now claim any part, or are no longer licencing the origianl engines or code to them.I was once told by a well respected developer that if a rival takes some of his work and changes by 60% then there is nothing he can do about it... now, I don't want a legal debate, but if someone knows what can and can't be done in this area it would be interesting.You can guess where my thoughts are taking this... could P3D V2.0 have enough code changes to unshackle them from Microsoft and enable to open their market up?

Edited January 9, 201214 yr by Novation

Get the free November/December issue of Computer Pilot and use the coupon code for a one month free use of P3D.Test it out and see how it goes and then think about committing to a monthly subscription. It's not that big of a decision to make.

That's what I did and I decided to forget about P3D until version 2.0 arrives. It isn't worth the 10 bucks a month plus side by side licenses at all right now. We'll see how P3D v2.0 performs in er... 2013... 2014...? But of course by that time we will all be flying in MS Flight that has been transformed in a full blown sim in the meantime... We are all going to love our weekly shot of DLC...!!! :(

could P3D V2.0 have enough code changes to unshackle them from Microsoft and enable to open their market up?

I just wish LM would make clear why the EULA isn't clear. As long as the EULA isn't clear about customers being able to use P3D for fun, it's a vague story... I know Nicol says we are free to use it, but why don't they change the EULA then...? I don't like it... But it's no real problem, because version 2.0 is still lightyears away and by the time it is released we will know a lot more of how flighsimming has evolved.

Edited January 9, 201214 yr by J van E

We also need to know what developpers think of us moving their FSX addons into P3D. Many don't seem to mind or only ask for a small fee (SBSL licence) but some and not the least such as Flight1 or PMDG are against it for EULA reasons.It would be nice if they could chime in.

Edited January 9, 201214 yr by Jean-Paul Mes

I'm not too bothered about the EULA personally, and if I thought it worth the switch I would, without undue concern; like you Jerone I took advantage of the free trail, but had got rid of it in less than a week, as it offered no advantage over my current FSX install... it looked no better (not that I expected it too) and ran no better (which I hoped it might), so at this point there is no reason to run it along side FSX. I will look to V2.0 when the time comes, but in the meantime FSX offers all I need... Flight is now gone and forgotten..

Edited January 9, 201214 yr by Novation

Because of what I read here, I'm going in a different direction. I was not aware of the massive changes made by Intel and others to accommodate the OC market. I did not know that the K on the I7-2600K stood for a new era of simplified overclocking using a simple chip based unlocked multiplier . Then I find that there is the use of the new included Intel Smart Response Technology where a single SSD is set up in a RAID configuration and then acts as an automatic cache (up to 40 gigs) to dramatically speed up entire older hardware style hard drives which have further doubled in output speeds. It caches frequent processor calls for high speed retrieval. And the Z68 motherboards such as some of the ASRock models (ASRock Z68 Extreme4 Gen3 Intel Z68) and others have a newer style and mouse controlled GUI for their bios which even includes specific overclock GUI modules. MSI even has a one button feature on their Z68 motherboard that takes you to a conservative 4.2 ghz OC with no settings changes at all. And there are scads of YouTube videos to both explain all of this in detail, and to actually do it. Intel itself even has as one video titled roughly, "Even Grandma can OC now." which shows her changing the I7-2600K multiplier alone.Add up massive changes in the main chips alone, a fairly simple move (OC) to 4.4 - 4.9 ghz, and newer simplified and mouse driven GUI Bios's, and perhaps FSX is coming into being the simulator of choice. That is the direction I am leaning towards right now on my currently unused copy of FSX.Bob - Las Cruces, NM

Edited January 9, 201214 yr by Toys_R_Us

Get the free November/December issue of Computer Pilot and use the coupon code for a one month free use of P3D.Test it out and see how it goes and then think about committing to a monthly subscription. It's not that big of a decision to make.

The free trial offer if anything should put a nail in the coffin of the EULA dispute, how many airlines look for simulator news in Computer Pilot, how many professional contractors are interested in Virtual Airline articles?My only gripe is the $120/year, not as bad as a straight license, but right now 'FSX SP3' isn't worth it in my opinion. If version 2 lives up to the hype then it'll be worthwhile.Don't get me wrong, I like what Lock-Mart has done with Prepar3D (better menus, nightvision, submarine simulation) but I have too much invested in FSX right now and a significant performance improvement will be needed for me to jump ship.

You can guess where my thoughts are taking this... could P3D V2.0 have enough code changes to unshackle them from Microsoft and enable to open their market up?

You're assuming that the only thing that is holding LM back is the contract with Microsoft, whereas I doubt that they have any interest in entering the consumer software market, regardless of the legalities.

I just don't think Microsoft will ever be concerned about the amount of consumers that are likely to use P3D. There just isn't enough money involved which is why we're here talking about alternatives to Flight.

Hi,As long as you maintain your monthly license the product will continue to work. If P3D goes in a direction that is not compatible with all my addons, I will treat P3D as I did FSX (final version) I just won't upgrade anymore, I'll keep the latest compatible version of P3D that works with all my addons. As P3D is today, its superior to FSX on my system, I'm already ahead of the game.Everyone keeps talking about tomorrow, keep in mind everything comes to an end, FS9, FSX, and I'm sure P3D. However, P3D is still in development and has evolved from the numerous advancements made by LM, P3D is available to the flightsim community today and most of the addons I've purchased for FSX work with P3D, that's a big plus in converting to Prepar3D. This is my new sim of choice, I hope PMDG changes their mind and comes along for the ride, but if they don't, I'll have to do without PMDG.I also hope that third party developers go the route of FSDT, with dual license (FSX/P3D) capability, so if P3D does disappear one day, all the additional addons purchased for P3D use will still work with FSX. I ask for this so all users will have an opportunity to fall back to FSX if and/or when P3D is no longer available to the flight sim community.That's a Win,Win,Win.Win #1: The consumer wins because the addon software will work with both FSX and P3D.Win #2: The addon software manufacturer wins due to a possible increase in sales, their software now supports both FSX and P3D platforms.Win #3: The consumer wins (reduced risk) because if P3D disappears in the future, no big deal, all addon software purchased for P3D use will still be compatible with FSX.

Edited January 9, 201214 yr by Mike_CFII_MEL