How much does an airline pilot make?

[machine2035 176]

 Another program on offer here is through Cathay Pacific also mentioned earlier in the thread; they take candidates from all nationalities so I imagine the competition would be even fiercer.

Unless you have 200+ hours and hold a CPL, cross out the Cathay cadetship. HK immigration recently changed their rules and the ab-initio program for Cathay was scrubbed for anyone who doesn't have permanent residency/citizenship in HK.

 

Best bet is either the Rex, Virgin and Jetstar cadetships, although they are all very competetive to get through to the interview/testing stage, let alone into the cadetship itself.

[Lawyer+Pilot 126]

Hahaha. The hidden dirty secret in the US. Pilots make GREAT money--when they finally get to the left seat on an international route. The ugly truth is that pilots start at regionals. They make a pretty respectable hourly rate. The problem is that they have to beg and plead to get the hours. The average annual salary when I was exploring this myself (circa 2002) was $14,000 per year. And that was BEFORE all of the union crushing bankruptcies.

[FlyBoyMike 38]

 

 

Unless you have 200+ hours and hold a CPL, cross out the Cathay cadetship. HK immigration recently changed their rules and the ab-initio program for Cathay was scrubbed for anyone who doesn't have permanent residency/citizenship in HK.

 

That's a shame. That was actually the program with the best perks on offer for people here as they would fund all of your training then you would eventually qualify to fly one of their big bad 777-300ER's  B)

 

 

 

Best bet is either the Rex, Virgin and Jetstar cadetships, although they are all very competetive to get through to the interview/testing stage, let alone into the cadetship itself.

 

Do you know if Virgin now offer ab-initio entry? When they first started their cadet program it was only available to CPL holders with 500+ hours. What's your take on the cadet programs in general? I've heard mixed reports with some of the instructors in my GA school saying that the quality of the Rex program in particular is quite bad and that you're actually better off getting a PPL and follow the traditional route.

[machine2035 176]

That's a shame. That was actually the program with the best perks on offer for people here as they would fund all of your training then you would eventually qualify to fly one of their big bad 777-300ER's  B)

 

 

 

 

Do you know if Virgin now offer ab-initio entry? When they first started their cadet program it was only available to CPL holders with 500+ hours. What's your take on the cadet programs in general? I've heard mixed reports with some of the instructors in my GA school saying that the quality of the Rex program in particular is quite bad and that you're actually better off getting a PPL and follow the traditional route.

Yeah, if you went through the CX program they would usually chuck you on as a SO (or Cruise Relief FO in some companies) on a large bird like the T7.

 

Virgin's program (now based at FTA) is solely ab-intio. They are looking for people with PPL or lower, with minimum hours. This allows the student to learn their way of things and not lean back on habits learnt at other training organisations/schools.

 

...and in regards to your instructors comment.  All I have to say it's easy for him to say that when he is where he is. It's not rocket science that doing your training privately is not cheap, and the REX cadetship provides a job at the end of it aswell. While some may call it a con, it is what is - a Cadetship.

 

IMO, I would get your PPL and then go do a VET FEE-HELP course at an ATO like Flight Training Adelaide. That will get you a frozen ATPL with 250-300 hours... Then you can try and get a job doing charter work, scenic flights out in the country (QLD, NA etc). Once you earn enough money so your above the threshold, start paying back your loan to the government. Better option then being in debt to a company.

[z06z33 781]

Here's my brief scope, being that I'm going through that process now. Pilots in the US can do a lot worse and a lot better. It is awful at the bottom, but the view from the top isn't bad either. As has been said regional F/Os making ~20,000 a year isn't unheard of. The top captain at FedEx last year made over $500,000. So needless to say the gap is wide. At 37 the ship to fly long haul has pretty much sailed unfortunately. Your flight training is going to take ~4 years to get to commercial pilot/flight instructor/multi/instrument, so if you started now you'd be 41 by then (rough numbers). This part is where the real problem is. You have to build that time in order to get your ATP. The way it stands currently is that if you go up through part 61 flight schools (mom & pop shops) you need 1500 hours total time to get your ATP. That is a LOT when you aren't being paid to fly jets 8 hours a day. This process typically takes at LEAST 3 years, depending on how dedicated you are. Once that's out of the way, you have to get hired by a regional. Most majors (the only guys who long haul) require many more hours (to the tune of 3,500) before you can get hired. So you fly the regionals and build your time. This may take 4 years, depending on where you are. Keep in mind these are extremely rough numbers and can vary heavily. Lets just say by this point in the process you're 49-52 years old. You've still got in the neighborhood of 15 years until your mandatory retirement at 65, but the problem is depending on your seniority status and hiring class number, you may need 20 to start flying big jets long distances. So assuming you shoot straight through the system and start NOW, you may not get the seniority to fly long haul by the end anyway. If you're willing and can find a way to get hired by a carrier like Emirates or Cathay Pacific, you're going to fly big jets much sooner, but you have to be willing to live a significant portion of your life in Dubai or Hong Kong respectively. This is a lot of talking and I don't want to deter you from getting your licenses, but know that the road to US based carriers is long and arduous and your clock has been ticking all your life. I wish it were better news, but it's something you've gotta be completely committed to here in the states.

He'd be better off flying in the mideast for Emirates they have nothing but heavys but he'll still need at least 2k total time

 

Wow, I didn't know pilots make that much! How does one become a FO or Captain for a major airline? What steps are involved, and being 37 years old, is it too late to become one?

If I were you I'd talk to the guys over at PPrune they will tell you everything you need to know! and no your not too old I know a guy with grandkids that just started as an FO at Comair. Be warned don't do this job for the money I'm not! After all the BS my dad went through with Uniteds bankruptcy it pushed me away from it for awhile but honestly the only place I can picture myself working is a cockpit! If you really want to do this do it!!! but do it for the love of flying not for the love of money. Also try getting your PPL, IFR,Muti, and commerical and get a job flying charters and build time that way. I saw an ad from ATP that for 65k you get all your ratings and a job as an instuctor to build time and then an interview with an airline. I know it sounds like alot of money but this is avation so get used to it ha. They allow you to finance the 65k aswell.

[Airbusman330 300]

 

 

Pilots can be home every night if they do short haul. You're only away when things go wrong, you're scheduled for the most part to return home every night.

 

That's not the vibe I got from Sullnberger's book (AWE 1549 Captain) but then again many domestic flights in the US last over 3 hours so layovers here seem to be pretty common. 

[KevinAu 441]

He'd be better off flying in the mideast for Emirates they have nothing but heavys but he'll still need at least 2k total time

 

If I were you I'd talk to the guys over at PPrune they will tell you everything you need to know! and no your not too old I know a guy with grandkids that just started as an FO at Comair. Be warned don't do this job for the money I'm not! After all the BS my dad went through with Uniteds bankruptcy it pushed me away from it for awhile but honestly the only place I can picture myself working is a cockpit! If you really want to do this do it!!! but do it for the love of flying not for the love of money. Also try getting your PPL, IFR,Muti, and commerical and get a job flying charters and build time that way. I saw an ad from ATP that for 65k you get all your ratings and a job as an instuctor to build time and then an interview with an airline. I know it sounds like alot of money but this is avation so get used to it ha. They allow you to finance the 65k aswell.

Comair in the US? They went out of business last year.

[Dillon 2,208]

Comair in the US? They went out of business last year.

 

Maybe he meant flying for them virtually...

[Cessnaflyer 56]

Most reputable cargo airlines like UPS or FedEx want experienced pilots and their pay rivals passenger carriers.

Or you can fly for all their feeders and get PIC time right off the bat.

[Airbus Commander 563]

That's not the vibe I got from Sullnberger's book (AWE 1549 Captain) but then again many domestic flights in the US last over 3 hours so layovers here seem to be pretty common. 

America is probably slightly different, but in Europe for 95% of all SH flights you return home to your own bed at night. There's never really any domestic flights here over 30 minutes, but there are plenty of our flights that last upwards of 4 hours that we do in a day.

 

Regards,

Ró.

[japascoe 98]

America is probably slightly different, but in Europe for 95% of all SH flights you return home to your own bed at night. There's never really any domestic flights here over 30 minutes, but there are plenty of our flights that last upwards of 4 hours that we do in a day.

 

Regards,

Ró.

In Europe most short haul flights are there-and-back, which I don't think is true for the US. I get the impression that in the US it's far more common to fly a 'cycle' where it might be a couple of days before you get back to your base.

[FlyBoyMike 38]

 

 

...and in regards to your instructors comment.  All I have to say it's easy for him to say that when he is where he is. It's not rocket science that doing your training privately is not cheap, and the REX cadetship provides a job at the end of it aswell. While some may call it a con, it is what is - a Cadetship.

 

Yeah I think he mentioned that he did apply for the REX cadetship and got in but then got kicked out of it due to some disagreement with staff there. His exact reasons for that were a bit vague so probably some bitterness on his part there.

 

 

 

IMO, I would get your PPL and then go do a VET FEE-HELP course at an ATO like Flight Training Adelaide. That will get you a frozen ATPL with 250-300 hours... Then you can try and get a job doing charter work, scenic flights out in the country (QLD, NA etc). Once you earn enough money so your above the threshold, start paying back your loan to the government. Better option then being in debt to a company.

 

That sounds like an idea. I'll make it my primary goal to get a PPL which I can do here in Brisbane then look at those options. Just have to jump a few hoops first now to get this 'medical' issue sorted out.

[byork 2,260]

 

 

Unless you have 200+ hours and hold a CPL, cross out the Cathay cadetship. HK immigration recently changed their rules and the ab-initio program for Cathay was scrubbed for anyone who doesn't have permanent residency/citizenship in HK.

 

Yeah, to become a HK permanent resident you need to live in HK for 7 years.  Not easy.  If the humidity and outrageous real estate prices don't kill you, then Wan Chai will  B)

 

This thread is interesting because it shows you how 'local' aviation is in terms of culture and hiring practices.

 

Each country is totally different with respect to hiring practices and mentality.

[Airbusman330 300]

Qatar airways has a academy program but you must be a Qataris national or your mother must be Qatari.

[Sticky 282]

heres my brief story:

 

Hired into a regional airline in US starting at $23,000 a year...after five years i was making $32,000.  On year six, I was able to upgrade to captain and started making $72,000.  Some people were lucker than me and got hired a year before me. They upgraded to captain within two years of being hired.  Others we're less lucky and got hired elsewhere spending five years making $32,000 and never upgraded to captain because their company went out of business.  Now they're new hires with us and starting all over again at $23,000 and have to wait another five years to upgrade to captain.