ORBX Textures to Replace UTX Custom Ones

[pilotjohn 19]

Now that the community found a solution to the UTX vector lights incompatibility, has anyone looked at which textures could be used to replace the non-matching custom UTX ones with stock ORBX ones?

 

I would imagine it should be as simple as copying existing ORBX textures over UTX customs ones (industrial, parking lots etc.) so that they would not stand out so much. You would obviously loose some of the representation that UTX was going for but I would rather lose that then live with the stark contrast.

[Orbx 123]

Any tools or files that modify or manipulate Orbx textures or files contravenes the Orbx FTX EULA. Please do not go down the path of modifying or moving Orbx texture assets or we will take swift legal action.

[pilotjohn 19]

Any tools or files that modify or manipulate Orbx textures or files contravenes the Orbx FTX EULA. Please do not go down the path of modifying or moving Orbx texture assets or we will take swift legal action.

 

Maybe if you don't want the community to find solutions for the incompatibilities with UTX, FTXG should not have advertised full compatibility with UTX in the first place. There seems to be a double standard of allowing light fixes as long as it doesn't involve modifying ORBX stuff but UTX stuff. Just a thought... 

[alainneedle1 97]

Hummm, is this the same kind of swift actions LM would take if a user is doing what he want in the privacy of his own home with the product he paid for (read P3D/add on tools or files that modify or manipulate)....?

 

As I do NOT believe ANY EULA breach should be posted on Avsim's forum I am also aware that NOTHING can be done if a user decide to modify or move a add on texture assets in the privacy of his own home, PM or e-mail should be used to exchange idea or to fix a problem(s) if you are not sure about the legal aspect of an action and not the forum.

 

Maybe if you don't want the community to find solutions for the incompatibilities with UTX, FTXG should not have advertised full compatibility with UTX in the first place. There seems to be a double standard of allowing light fixes as long as it doesn't involve modifying ORBX stuff but UTX stuff. Just a thought... 

 

+1, now let the fan boys tell you (us) why it is the way it is and why it's ok for them to get away with this kind of advertisement, don't forget about DX10 advertisement also.

[sascha 314]

@Pilotjohn: You might consider doing this just for yourself, and then not talking about it or making it available for anyone else.

 

A pity that ORBX is quashing the spirit of exchanging information which has contributed so much to FS over the past years in this heavyhanded fashion. Your fix was after all supposed to make THEIR product more enjoyable for their customers.

 

Now I wonder why ORBX is not fixing those issues themselves?

 

This is exactly what Nick warned about - increasingly modifying FSX including core files while make life difficult for other developers.

 

ORBX is topping this now by threatening people providing community fixes for problems ORBX causes with other products with legal action.

 

I am actually quite horrified about this now I come to think about it - our community is going down a road I never would have believed possible a couple of years ago. I can only hope that this business will not go to far. ORBX already seems to have caused some splits in the FS community judging from the increasingly bitter debates raging along several forums.

 

This does not seem to have anything to do with their products which seem to be of very high quality but of the business model and promotion. Of course I am no expert but this is my feeling.

 

Now everyone can protect their business interests in a legalway and everyone can buy whatever addons they please.

 

But the mail above is to me an example of how to create bad feelings in the community (well I feel bad) and increasing fear of ORBX customers to do a quite traditional thing in the comunity - sharing information about fixes.

 

Now I understand why ORBX responds publicly and not by PM but heck, there is not even a "Dear Pilotjohn ..."  in that mail, or a "I appreciate what you are trying to do but ..." which I think is decidedly rude behaviour to a paying customer! On a public forum, no less. Well they seem to be making enough money to be able to afford annoying their customers and scaring off potential buyers.

 

This is one of the reasons I will be sticking with FS2004 for some time to come, because the payware focus has shifted to FSX and P3D, there is more of the old community feeling I believe.

 

A big thank you also to developers that still produce addons for FS2004!

 

Best regards,

Sascha

[billn53 12]

Well posted, Sascha.

 

I don't have a dog in this fight but my reaction in reading Mr. Venema's post is that it has not one iota of "we (Orbx) want to be  helpful" and, instead, reeks with an attitude of "we are here to make money and we're going to throw our lawyers at anyone who does anything we don't like, even if it's to get around a problem in our own product."

 

Please!

 

If I were a newbie to this community who read Mr. Venema's post, I wouldn't want anything to do with Orbx.

[EngineRoom 205]

Any tools or files that modify or manipulate Orbx textures or files contravenes the Orbx FTX EULA. Please do not go down the path of modifying or moving Orbx texture assets or we will take swift legal action.

 

John, this is a bit rich considering your promotion and sale of products for use in P3D to customers who are using the sim for hobby or home entertainment purposes.

 

Secondly, I believe pilotjohn is advocating something along the lines of substituting existing UTX textures for Orbx ones so they fit better when FTXG textures are used with UTX. Basically he is trying to improve his enjoyment of your product with UTX - just like the guys who managed to get your lights working properly with UTX, something which you appeared to condone.

 

Of course let's not forget that the issues FTXG has with both UTX and DX10 compatibility were kept very quiet until after release. Perhaps, just maybe, if you had ensured full compatibility with UTX - as Orbx claimed in its pre-release publicity and marketing - customers wouldn't need to start dissecting your product to make it work with stuff you told them it would.

 

 

 

Hummm, is this the same kind of swift actions LM would take if a user is doing what he want in the privacy of his own home with the product he paid for (read P3D/add on tools or files that modify or manipulate)....?

 

As I do NOT believe ANY EULA breach should be posted on Avsim's forum I am also aware that NOTHING can be done if a user decide to modify or move a add on texture assets in the privacy of his own home, PM or e-mail should be used to exchange idea if you are not sure about the legal aspect of an action and not the forum.

 

Alain, my old mucker - for someone who has been quite proudly "Orbx free" for such a long time you do spend a lot of time in Orbx threads....

 

Still, credit where it's due - you do make a very good point....

 

But then you went and ruined it with this remark:

 

 

 

now let the fan boys tell you (us) why it is the way it is and why it's ok for them to get away with this kind of advertisement

 

Just as you are apparently very happy to be "Orbx free", please do the rest of us a favour and let us have some Orbx threads that are "alainneedle1 free".

 

 

 

This is one of the reasons I will be sticking with FS2004 for some time to come, because the payware focus has shifted to FSX and P3D, there is more of the old community feeling I believe.

 

Sascha you've hit the nail on the head. The notion of "community" in the FSX world is hanging on by its fingernails. It's all but gone from many places and when I read threads like this - a customer asking a legitimate question, then getting stomped on by a bolshy developer, then the trolls drop in to grind their axes...... I feel like just uninstalling FSX and moving on to something else.

 

 

 

 

@OP:

 

I think what you're asking is very possible. If you look in the UTX setup tool there is a function something like "adjust texture mapping of UT features" which allows you to change textures for the vector elements of UTX scenery. If you're talking about the custom landclass UTX introduces for industrial areas, I'd guess that my well involve finding the relevant entry in the lclookup.bgl and pointing it at whatever Orbx texture you want to use instead.

[alainneedle1 97]

 

Alain, my old mucker - for someone who has been quite proudly "Orbx free" for such a long time you do spend a lot of time in Orbx threads....

 

Still, credit where it's due - you do make a very good point....

 

But then you went and ruined it with this remark:

 

 

 

 

Just as you are apparently very happy to be "Orbx free", please do the rest of us a favour and let us have some Orbx threads that are "alainneedle1 free".

 

 

 

 

 

 

EngineRoom,

 

I love what you wrote (in red)...lol.

 

I am NOT Orbx free, I have a lot of their add on, I quit buying from them, so having some (a lot) of their sceneries does not qualify me as "Orbx free" right?

 

Owning a Orbx product does not make you a Orbx fan boys, I should have been more specific about that, but you know as well as I do that NO MATTER WHAT Orbx does or will do (good or bad) there will be some Orbx sceneries owner that will praise them for that and that's what I call a Orbx fan boys, I think you know that.

 

Thank you very much for your understanding,

 

Alain

[cvearl 60]

+1, now let the fan boys tell you (us) why it is the way it is and why it's ok for them to get away with this kind of advertisement, don't forget about DX10 advertisement also.

Well... I think this... "ORBX you promised UTX was compatible but it's not" thing is getting out of hand. Bottom line for me is that UTX lighting looks FANF'ING-TASTIC and works 100% flawless in FTXG! Breathtaking in fact and I get no "performance issue" so I don't need the Vector Road Lights to work inside of UTX coverage areas. So what if the ORBX Vector Road Lights don't work on UTX Vector you don't need them in UTX areas. Do the mod if you care and shut up. Once the ORBX Vector product is released for the Americas, bye bye to UTX for me. I will buy it (ORBX Vector for FTXG). Same goes for OpenLC when it comes out!

 

Also... UTX custom land class works 100% in UTX and can be turned on and off if it "stands out" and a person does not like it (read - the parking lots at night). That's not incompatible.

 

Bottom line from me is this. If it had not been for ORBX a few years ago, I would have stopped using FSX. If people don't like it, don't buy it. I don't go to KIA car forums and impartial automotive forums bashing the product even though I feel they are garbage. I just don't buy the product.

 

If the FTXG lights don't work in DX10, should people get a refund? Meh. They would have waited for Steve Parsons DX10 fixer anyway. Should JV had said sorry and posted a comment in the documentation to this effect? Ya they should. That's up to them I guess. Oops, while they did not appologize, they actually did put in writing that the lights part of FTXG are not DX10... http://www.fullterrain.com/product_ftxglobal.html

 

Note that originally, it was not an advertised feature. It was a comment in a forum post where John said FTXG would be DX10 compatible. Which ended up being a mistake only so far as thee lights were concerned. Find me the "official advertising" you keep waving around in the forums that states DX10 as a feature of FTXG. You produce it and I will be the first to publicly apologize to you.

 

Charles.

An ORBX "Product" fan. (And DX10 tester/user)

[TheDanger 182]

Yep indeed this going to be another thread to check for some entertainment every few hours with a coffee :lol:

[EngineRoom 205]

My apologies Alain, I seem to recall a post you made some time ago proudly proclaiming yourself to be "Orbx free".

 

Still, my point stands: If tomorrow John Venema found a cure for cancer, Orbx put a man on Mars and ended world hunger you'd still find a way to turn it around and bash them.

 

You have a problem with JV and Orbx. We get it. We got it a long time ago. It's not necessary to continually throw yourself and your agenda into discussions about products you don't own produced by a developer you no longer purchase from. You do neither yourself nor the wider community any favours by continuing to pursue this agenda - in fact you are very rapidly becoming something of a caricature. Surely there must be more important and pressing matters in your life than travelling the Internet stirring the Orbx pot at every opportunity and trying to drag other personalities such as Nick Needham and Word Not Allowed into your campaign? It can't be good for you.

 

Let it go.

 

Yes there are some legitimate questions about how Orbx handled the release of FTXG - specifically about how certain issues were kept quiet until the customers discovered them. Getting satisfactory answers to those questions isn't going to happen when you keep muddying the water.

[dave2013 1,123]

Any tools or files that modify or manipulate Orbx textures or files contravenes the Orbx FTX EULA. Please do not go down the path of modifying or moving Orbx texture assets or we will take swift legal action.

 

First, I want to premise my remarks by stating that I'm a fan of ORBX and I'm extremely excited about FTX Global and the upcoming OpenVector and OpenLC products.

 

That being said, you have no legal right to tell anyone that they are prohibited from moving files that they purchased from you from one directory to another on their own computer.  Just because your EULA states that something is forbidden doesn't mean that it is illegal or that the violation can be successfully prosecuted in court.

 

There is absolutely nothing wrong with copying specific FTXG textures to another directory contained within the FSX directory as long as it is done on only the product license holder's personal computer.

[Shane_Strong 6]

See they just want you to buy their new global vector product, they dont want you fixing other peoples products to work, That just limits the sale of their products espeically new ones, They are just annoucing its all marketing you can always call their bluff on taking swift legal action sure they can send you letters but i am sure for the amount of money it would cost and the amount of court time in what ever country your in it would not be worth it. I am sure if microsoft was still interested in FSX they would be getting notice of the same if they are editing core files which is a grey Mircosoft eula thing.

Points:

They Are Making Money Selling Products as a Company.

They want to make the most money they can

They dont have to be friendly, anyone can be a bulley on the internet and they dont have to care the people that are going to buy will still buy.

Remeber they had modified fsx with their product original fsx textures and such to take you to court they would have had to get written premission from microsoft to own the original textures theres is a modifacation  that they are selling. but you can find many lawyers out there that will tell you anything you want to hear. I am not one of them.

A mod of a original product is a mod

The reason  the community is falling apart is that lot of different people want to make money off a original product that is not even theirs.  Look at how much the original product cost and see what all the mod makers are charging because that is what they all are. You label it a addon new plane, new textures, it is being placed in a product owned by microsoft not them. Most of these so called online compaines are just running out of someones home office. Paywear vs Freeware  there was alot of arguments over the years for that.

I am not a orbx supporter or non supporter, but remeber  everyone is trying to sell you something these days. They can claim ownership but they have to prove that in court if taken there.

dont be bullied.

Shane

[sascha 314]

 

 

dont be bullied.

Shane

 

Well said - I think that about sums the legal implications up ... A shame that ORBX are throwing their weight about these day like this, I had a lot of respect for them initially from things like people flow and their beautiful rendition of all those little airports.

 

But these days seem gone now ...

Sascha

[Brigowski 10]

Any tools or files that modify or manipulate Orbx textures or files contravenes the Orbx FTX EULA. Please do not go down the path of modifying or moving Orbx texture assets or we will take swift legal action.

 

I am so tired of seeing John Venema treat customers with such disregard and such disrespect. I will be calling Redmond on Monday and will speak to Microsoft's intellectual property team that is part of legal and corporate affairs there. I wonder how Orbx will hold up in court for having modified and moved key FSX assets belonging to Microsoft.