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Q_flyer

The thing with P3D2 and OOMs is .......

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.......every time someone get's a OOM with P3D2, they post about it.   :smile:   That not's a criticism; just an observation that because P3D2 is so new, and because the user base is currently so small, we get to hear about almost every single OOM.

 

Have we forgotten how many people are experiencing OOMs with FSX all around the world!? :lol:  ........ there is probably an OOM happening in FSX at any given time, somewhere in the world.

 

My point is not to pick on FSX, but simply to put some context to OOMs:   either platform can OOM because of the 32 bit limitations that we know so well.  P3D2 will, I believe, prove to OOM a lot less than FSX does, but as ever, that depends on settings in the sim.   Anyone can bring on an OOM, and anyone can avoid an OOM.        

 

An OOM is not even a fault! ........ It is simply the limits of FSX's architecture being reached by too many memory demands.

 

:smile:

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An OOM is not even a fault! ........

But it still crashes the simulation.

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And most are still playing with defaultish scenery.. 

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.......every time someone get's a OOM with P3D2, they post about it. :smile: That not's a criticism; just an observation that because P3D2 is so new, and because the user base is currently so small, we get to hear about almost every single OOM.

 

Have we forgotten how many people are experiencing OOMs with FSX all around the world!? :lol: ........ there is probably an OOM happening in FSX at any given time, somewhere in the world.

 

My point is not to pick on FSX, but simply to put some context to OOMs: either platform can OOM because of the 32 bit limitations that we know so well. P3D2 will, I believe, prove to OOM a lot less than FSX does, but as ever, that depends on settings in the sim. Anyone can bring on an OOM, and anyone can avoid an OOM.

 

An OOM is not even a fault! ........ It is simply the limits of FSX's architecture being reached by too many memory demands.

 

:smile:

I feel, that if it was me, trying to induce the limit. I would be trying to prove I can, because I can. This is not me trying to deride those that have, by the way.

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Perhaps, but, there may yet be an opportunity to get better behaved add-ons as devs circumvent the need to work around fsx shortcomings.

Just with the new lighting and shadow model, some of the tricks to using multiple textures to produce those effects in the sim are no longer needed. Plus, now with the access to dx11 shader effects to use, those would be a plus to decrease texture loading and who knows what else . Sure 64bit would be nice, but I for one can hardly wait for devs to fully support p3d right now much less if we had to wait for 64bit compatability.

 

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk

 

 

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The bottom line is the sooner the conversion to 64 bit happens the better.

 

Could well be but that's going to take a few years at least... Making P3D 64 bit seems to be a bigger job than getting 1.4 to 2.0 and that already took ages. Add to that the fact that all addons will have to be rewritten... I am still in doubt if 64 bit is THE answer to all our simming problems but the coming years this will be it... So I also hope LM will fix certain things.

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.......every time someone get's a OOM with P3D2, they post about it.   :smile:   That not's a criticism; just an observation that because P3D2 is so new, and because the user base is currently so small, we get to hear about almost every single OOM.

 

Have we forgotten how many people are experiencing OOMs with FSX all around the world!? :lol:  ........ there is probably an OOM happening in FSX at any given time, somewhere in the world.

 

My point is not to pick on FSX, but simply to put some context to OOMs:   either platform can OOM because of the 32 bit limitations that we know so well.  P3D2 will, I believe, prove to OOM a lot less than FSX does, but as ever, that depends on settings in the sim.   Anyone can bring on an OOM, and anyone can avoid an OOM.        

 

An OOM is not even a fault! ........ It is simply the limits of FSX's architecture being reached by too many memory demands.

 

:smile:

 

 

Is anyone even thinking about applying the 'largeaddressaware' patch on P3D's .exe file.  Is that possible or is it already applied seeing as 90% of users are using this sim on a 64bit OS.

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Dillon, that was already there in either Sp1 or Sp2 of FSX, I forget which.  So FSX and it's successors have been able to use 4 gb address space for a long time.

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Dillon, that was already there in either Sp1 or Sp2 of FSX, I forget which.  So FSX and it's successors have been able to use 4 gb address space for a long time.

 

 

But we're talking about P3D v2 here...

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We're talking about P3D v2 here...

 

I know.   Again, FSX had that flag set in SP1 allowing it to address the full 4 gb.  Although I don't have the executable myself to check the flag, you can bet that that hasn't changed in P3D.

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Never had OOMs in FSX, even on long PMDG flights ( T7 ).

 

I only use default scenery, and had FTX Global for a while and it even made my ride smoother!

 

I believe the case with P3D v2 has more to do with the hardware you're using. As most already identified, and LM made clear, having a good GPU, with at least 2GB GDDR is very important, specially if you want to enable tesselation and free your CPU from some hard work....

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Your sitting round a table and the future of your baby is in your hands. You have two choices.

 

Choice one, is ensure backwards compatability, raise cash and buy time. It will take 3PD's time too code all the new features and release stunning add-ons. This will ensure that when the OOM issue is resolved the future is self sustaining.

 

Choice two, will eliminate OOM's, alienate the user base apart from a tiny few. Risk future development to achieve point 1. All this, knowing that the user base has lived with the exact same issue for 7 years.

 

If I were given these choices, I'd go for 1 every time.

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Its just my observation that a 2gb card and DX11 does make a difference and keeps the VAS a little more behaved. That and the tightened up memory management help. Of course if you go all crazy out with your settings the of course your going to OOM. 

 

My 2gb VRAM gets pretty full and kept there and as a result the VAS has a bigger buffer. This is at CYVR in the PNW region known to test your VAS limits quite well. Even when 777 and NGX comes there is still room for it. 

When I use fsx and dx10 the VRAM doesnt get used as efficiently. 

Now with V2 it appears it is swapped out and used alot better. Time will tell, but its just about settings management. If you OOM then back off your settings. Simple. 

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Its just my observation that a 2gb card and DX11 does make a difference and keeps the VAS a little more behaved. That and the tightened up memory management help. Of course if you go all crazy out with your settings the of course your going to OOM. 

 

My 2gb VRAM gets pretty full and kept there and as a result the VAS has a bigger buffer. This is at CYVR in the PNW region known to test your VAS limits quite well. Even when 777 and NGX comes there is still room for it. 

When I use fsx and dx10 the VRAM doesnt get used as efficiently. 

Now with V2 it appears it is swapped out and used alot better. Time will tell, but its just about settings management. If you OOM then back off your settings. Simple. 

 

That would make sense because in DX11, that vram doesn't have to share in P3D's own memory space

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That would make sense because in DX11, that vram doesn't have to share in P3D's own memory space

VRAM didn't share memory space previously. People are using 4GB graphics cards with FSX.

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VRAM didn't share memory space previously. People are using 4GB graphics cards with FSX.

 

This is complex stuff, and there is no guarantee I'm not mistaken, but I'm fairly sure that in DX9, the vram is included in that 4 gb vas limit of the 32 bit application using it.  Obviously that is a concern for FSX users on DX9, but not applicable to the DX11 P3D, so when High Tower reports that a "2GB card and DX11 makes a difference, I would say yes, that is very expected due to that limitation on the Vram no longer being there.

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But people are using 4 Gb graphics cards with FSX on 64-bit Windows. If that counted against the available 4Gb VAS there's be no VAS left to run FSX.

 

 

Yes...I use a 4GB GTX680 in Win7 x64...no OOM issues here.

 

Cheers

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Is anyone even thinking about applying the 'largeaddressaware' patch on P3D's .exe file.  Is that possible or is it already applied seeing as 90% of users are using this sim on a 64bit OS.

 

 

Dillon, that was already there in either Sp1 or Sp2 of FSX, I forget which.  So FSX and it's successors have been able to use 4 gb address space for a long time.

 

 

But we're talking about P3D v2 here...

 

 

I know.   Again, FSX had that flag set in SP1 allowing it to address the full 4 gb.  Although I don't have the executable myself to check the flag, you can bet that that hasn't changed in P3D.

 

 

I've just checked this, using CFF Explorer suite, and yes, as KingGhidorah said, the large address is already flagged, so no further mileage with this one I'm afraid.

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Fixes for OOM's are available and have been for some time for FSX and P3D is not that much different, just some better programming.  The problem with the "fixes" is that they do not work for everyone as everybody has a different setup (system and P3D/display driver configuration).  The max LOD_Radius setting in the P3D settings page will show 6.5 in the P3D.cfg.  A 6.5 brought down some FSX systems and this setting is known to cause OOM's if set too high and P3D is no different.  So, if one is having problems with OOM's, that would be the first "fix" I would try.  I would suspect some might have pumped that up to 7.5 or 8.5 by now!!! :Just Kidding: Pushing your display driver settings might cause problems too.  Make sure NI is set to P3D as well as inside the NVidia Display Driver page.  Tweaks have been known to cause OOM's too.  The Bufferpools tweak is just one of the main ones that causes OOM's if not employed properly.

 

But people are using 4 Gb graphics cards with FSX on 64-bit Windows. If that counted against the available 4Gb VAS there's be no VAS left to run FSX.

 

I understand that P3D was programmed to use more of the video memory so those with huge video cards with tons of memory will see some improvements. 

 

Best regards,

 

 

 

 

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But people are using 4 Gb graphics cards with FSX on 64-bit Windows. If that counted against the available 4Gb VAS there's be no VAS left to run FSX.

 

 

 

 

Used VRAM is mirrored in DX9, not the entire available buffer.

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Used VRAM is mirrored in DX9, not the entire available buffer.

That implies all the VRAM can't be used in FSX?

 

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FSX really doesn't have any reason to, but no, it couldn't.

 

You can certainly balloon VRAM usage in FSX, or anything really, by using high SSAA levels/extremely high resolutions, but FSX itself isn't doing anything that would require that much to begin with on it's own. DX10 changes things a bit of course, but still nowhere near the degree that DX11 does.

 

P3D2 is very different, much more VRAM is reserved for the tasks that are actually being performed on the GPU, contrasted with FSX where most of these tasks were done by the CPU/in system RAM (terrain generation), or not at all (tessellation).

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I am no computer guru... but the way I see it is that it is not a hardware issue for me... it is the fact that we are trying to push the envelope on a 32 bit application.  I have a GTX 780 and i7 4770K. When I get OOM's it is not as if my computer is struggling... I was getting 40+ fps when it happened to me.  It seems to me the hardware is actually being held back by the software, not the other way around.

 

What is the use of fancy graphics if one cannot even use them?  Again, it is not a hardware limitation... the limitation is 32 bit, and that needs to change.  I get why LM wanted to fix the code first.  That being said, so many on here keep ignoring the obvious solution to the problem.  We should not have to spend more time tweaking than we do flying.  Just calling it like I see it.

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Its the shadows and the waves. I wish I could just get my rex water textures from fsx working in p3d once I installed rex the water looked even worse than stock.

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