Banning babies from flights?

[Mickel 42]

I had a reality check in a bar a few weeks ago when grumbling about an adult that got on a plane sick and was vomiting before we got to the hold point. One hour delay returning to the gate... One of the guys I was drinking with was booked on MH-17. Only a phone call kept him off it. It rather put things in perspective.

[sascha 314]

 

 

I don't understand most of the people on this poll as it's not really about banning babies completely, but about to introduce childfree areas and certain childfree flights for adults who would like to pay extra for their sleep.

 

Well, maybe you should have called the poll "Should there be child-free areas in planes" instead of calling it "Banning babies from flights". Banning is very restrictive you know.

 

But then I guess it wouldn't have attracted so much interest.

[pete_auau 1,163]

I bet smokers hated them as much as parents hate childfree areas. I will never understand.

 

One big difference here is  that smoking  is  a health hazard  and I take  crying babies over  smokers any day of  the year, same with drunks you don't know  when they become aggressive or  what they do if provoked

[Tushka 0]

Well, maybe you should have called the poll "Should there be child-free areas in planes" instead of calling it "Banning babies from flights". Banning is very restrictive you know.

 

But then I guess it wouldn't have attracted so much interest.

It was just the headline, maybe some people only read the headline instead of the description and answers that were put here... I'm surprised the thread just got to 5 pages though.

One big difference here is  that smoking  is  a health hazard  and I take  crying babies over  smokers any day of  the year, same with drunks you don't know  when they become aggressive or  what they do if provoked

I do agree with your difference, also drunks can be a health hazard once they spiral out of control.

 

But there is still nothing wrong with people paying extra to sit in a small section of the plane (either in the back or in the front) where babies aren't allowed to sit. Some airlines do this practice and it has actually gotten popular amongst air travellers.

[max2770 75]

Babies scream in planes because the slightest change in cabin pressure hurts their ears, and they don't have any way of adjusting.  There's a simple solution - feed them on climb and descent, and use pacifiers.  Everytime I'm on a flight with a screaming infant, I teach the parents what to do, it works a good 90% of the time.

[User72 28]

For the record I'm talking about long haul flights here,not simply a few hours but 10+ to 15+ hours. If you have a meeting next morning whether it's personal or business you simply do not want to miss such event only because you couldn't sleep for the entire long haul flight. Also it is common that you have long transit hours in airports and have to change flights etc etc it's not uncommon for me to spend over 36 hours in airports... aircrafts, waiting, transit, lounges... hence I really need my sleep. Flying isn't fun, especially not with long hauls or long hauls with connecting flights. That just makes it a nightmare and do not tell me that I'm not entitled to a few hours sleep at least.

 

From where I live now if I want to get somewhere far, I must take a connecting flight or two. I can tolerate a constant screaming baby for 8 hours but no single way anything longer than that and I am not the only one in the flight that it goes on our nerves.

 

I do not understand parents and me and my sister will have kids one day but I would perfectly understand if other passengers prefer to fly in childfree areas. Only because I have a kid I'm not entitled to say other people shouldn't have the right to fly on a childfree section of an aircraft with 350 other passengers. And also wouldn't bring it on an airplane until 2-3 years old.

 

Only because you're a parent it doesn't mean you can restrict whether a person wants to fly childfree or not. Other people do not think your baby is as cute as you do.

 

Do I prefer drunks over babies? Yes, because they always pass out at some point while the baby somehow have the energy to  scream for 10 hours.

 

Jeez parents, neither me or others want to ban you from taking a flight. We just want a few rows on the plane where kids aren't allowed. You don't own the plane and aren't entitled to say such areas shouldn't exist. Remember smokefree areas? I bet smokers hated them as much as parents hate childfree areas. I will never understand.

 

Should I ask Aeroflot to introduce a drunkfree area too and then all the alcoholics will protest?

 

You are only entitled to what you've paid for which is a seat on a plane essentially. You take your chances after that just like the rest of us. If you need your sleep as much as you say then perhaps you should factor a rest day into your trips.

When you and your sister have kids you'll likely think differently.

I don't think anyone has actually said areas shouldn't exist on aircraft where kids are not allowed though if they have they are essentially right. I imagine being denied a seat on an aircraft because one has children would lead to a tasty lawsuit. What's being said is that you simply cannot ban children or babies on a flight. If that flight was the only flight that would allow you and your kids to see a dying parent/grandparent and you were denied a seat because you had a baby how would you react then? Would you care that someone might miss their beauty sleep? Would you sue if the person died and that flight would have gotten you there to say goodbye? If you were the one missing their beauty sleep in that case would you insist on your assumed entitlement? That's just an example but you see where I'm going with it. It's discriminatory.

The simple point here is that the reality of air travel is that hundreds of people, all with the same entitlement to be aboard, are crowded into a fast moving tube for as long as it takes to get where they are going. Seating is largely a matter of luck. Babies cry, it's what they do. You have to learn to suck it up a bit or make changes to your travelling to mitigate your loss of sleep and apparent inability to then function up to par.

[Mike_CFII_MEL 789]

Hi Guys,

 

I don't have a problem with babies on board, yeah they can be a pain sometimes but it don't happen that often. Individuals who refuse to bath regularly should be banned!!!, they are more of a irritant to my sensors than crying babies and I experience that smelly stench at a 80% higher rate than crying babies.

[1mikel151 71]

Yes, I got this explanation from another member of this thread. Hence it's possible the disease was caught up in our earlier IL-62 flight or even in Petersburg. How the other passengers got it, who knows. Maybe we were an unlucky bunch who sat next to the constantly screaming baby.

 

But if kids annoy young people so much that they suddeny use phsysical violence something is clearly wrong with the practice. My half sister is not the only one because I asked on a Russian and Bulgarian travel forum and apparently this happens a lot. People don't have as much patience as they used to. A western flight would be diverted, the rest of the world doesn't care. The relatively rare but not so uncommon accidents as the above however is not the only reason as there is perfectly calm people who get annoyed by the 10 hour constant screaming as well. Why else would certain airlines such as Air Asia introduce childfree flights? I read the news and some US airlines are beginning with this practice as well.

 

I don't understand most of the people on this poll as it's not really about banning babies completely, but about to introduce childfree areas and certain childfree flights for adults who would like to pay extra for their sleep.

 

I'm not bringing my bottle of vodka with me to a public flight, then please do not bring your baby into my sleep.

 

 

first off, hitting a child, especially one that isn't yours is totally wrong here in the U.S. and if you are not stable enough mentally to know this (in the U.S.), then you probably should be in a facility, away from the public. That is unstable behavior, regardless of the issues in your life.

 

i am guess the reason you run into so many drunk flyers is because of where you live, here, not as much, especially unruly ones and authorities deal with those for the most part since being drunk in public isn't as common or taboo (illegal yes) here, but being unruly when drunk is an issue.

 

I voted yes to your poll and yes, I have a child. I work in retail management and see way to often parents that are oblivious to the results their crying children have on others and when confronted, I get the usual, "they are babies, it's not my fault, deal with it" crap. That is when i suggest they take their child outside and calm them down before coming back into the building. On a plane, you can't take your child outside to calm them down, so unless airlines can install a small soundproof room, or parents can guarantee that their child will be quiet the whole flight, they should be not allowed on the plane. I see way to often people with kids thinking that no matter what their kid does, they can do no wrong. If adults have to abide by certain rules, children should also.

 

better yet, have all parents invest in....the baby muzzle, LOL

http://www.dudeiwantthat.com/omg/fools/the-baby-muzzle.asp

.

 

I have a guy in the apt next to me who brings his kid and cell phone out on the deck we share and talks really loud and lets his kid scream at the top of her lungs with no concern for anyone else in the building. I talked to him about it once and tried to reason with him politely, but he was a jerk about it, so I called the police and now I have peace and quiet.

[TurboTomato 90]

And also wouldn't bring it on an airplane until 2-3 years old.

 

Hello?! This is the real world calling. You may not have a child at the moment and you may not be able to think about what it would be like to have one but the reality is that there are plenty of people who will have no choice but to take small/children babies on flights (long or short-haul). Think out of the box a little as you can make statements like the above and then laugh at how naive you were when you look back.

 

User72 summed it up well. You pay for your seat, you take your chances. Behaviour of small children is a different question really. For what it's worth we took my 2.5 year old away in June for the first time on a short haul flight and he was no bother to anyone.

[Tushka 0]

You are only entitled to what you've paid for which is a seat on a plane essentially. You take your chances after that just like the rest of us. If you need your sleep as much as you say then perhaps you should factor a rest day into your trips.

When you and your sister have kids you'll likely think differently.

I don't think anyone has actually said areas shouldn't exist on aircraft where kids are not allowed though if they have they are essentially right. I imagine being denied a seat on an aircraft because one has children would lead to a tasty lawsuit. What's being said is that you simply cannot ban children or babies on a flight. If that flight was the only flight that would allow you and your kids to see a dying parent/grandparent and you were denied a seat because you had a baby how would you react then? Would you care that someone might miss their beauty sleep? Would you sue if the person died and that flight would have gotten you there to say goodbye? If you were the one missing their beauty sleep in that case would you insist on your assumed entitlement? That's just an example but you see where I'm going with it. It's discriminatory.

The simple point here is that the reality of air travel is that hundreds of people, all with the same entitlement to be aboard, are crowded into a fast moving tube for as long as it takes to get where they are going. Seating is largely a matter of luck. Babies cry, it's what they do. You have to learn to suck it up a bit or make changes to your travelling to mitigate your loss of sleep and apparent inability to then function up to par.

I know how I think and how I act, since I do not believe in changing personality. Even when I get a kid I will simply not take it to businessclass, and especially not childfree areas of the plane.

 

Having an area of the aircraft where children aren't allowed isn't discrimination. In fact "discrimination" as a word exists everywhere. Women pay more for their hairstyles, men pay more for their drink, kids aren't allowed to the bar (thank god) and people without education are unable to get a job. Even if you don't speak the language right or have problems you will be discriminated. Also old people get discriminated against in favor for youngsters. I had bad things going on when I was younger with especially discrimination due to family issue, but it was worse than today and I just learned how to deal with it. There is childfree wagons on many trains and we do not get a bashfest for that.

 

There is people being denied boarding for all sorts of stupider reasons, in fact I have witnessed a black guy being denied for no reason (he was the only black person that was going to board our flight) and also many chechenians being denied boarding. This is racism but it's accepted there. Also there is people being denied boarding because they did something wrong, or the former, for no reason at all. And if there is only childfree seats left on that particular flight you can't have booked that flight in the first place as it's not possible to check in a toddler for it. And if you ask on the counter if they have flights they certainly won't tell you as the child cannot come along. However on outside polls the result is that two thirds would pay more to sit in such area hence I believe they will never be empty. It's more of bad luck when flying and not discrimination as the examples above.

 

 

 

first off, hitting a child, especially one that isn't yours is totally wrong here in the U.S. and if you are not stable enough mentally to know this (in the U.S.), then you probably should be in a facility, away from the public. That is unstable behavior, regardless of the issues in your life.

 

i am guess the reason you run into so many drunk flyers is because of where you live, here, not as much, especially unruly ones and authorities deal with those for the most part since being drunk in public isn't as common or taboo (illegal yes) here, but being unruly when drunk is an issue.

 

I voted yes to your poll and yes, I have a child. I work in retail management and see way to often parents that are oblivious to the results their crying children have on others and when confronted, I get the usual, "they are babies, it's not my fault, deal with it" crap. That is when i suggest they take their child outside and calm them down before coming back into the building. On a plane, you can't take your child outside to calm them down, so unless airlines can install a small soundproof room, or parents can guarantee that their child will be quiet the whole flight, they should be not allowed on the plane. I see way to often people with kids thinking that no matter what their kid does, they can do no wrong. If adults have to abide by certain rules, children should also.

 

better yet, have all parents invest in....the baby muzzle, LOL

http://www.dudeiwantthat.com/omg/fools/the-baby-muzzle.asp

.

 

I have a guy in the apt next to me who brings his kid and cell phone out on the deck we share and talks really loud and lets his kid scream at the top of her lungs with no concern for anyone else in the building. I talked to him about it once and tried to reason with him politely, but he was a jerk about it, so I called the police and now I have peace and quiet.

 

I believe hitting kids is wrong everywhere and I wasn't the one that did this as I was not on that flight or any other flights where a kid has been punched. But I have stumbled upon many fights when I'm out drinking with friends and this is not because I'm "mentally insane" but because some drunk decides to hit us for no reason. I don't think it's a strictly eastern european issue as this can happen in the west too.

 

My sister isn't mentally insane, and simply freaked out. I won't tell the exact reasons or the triggers as this is a public forum, but trust me. Life without parents in Belarus makes you pretty angry on everyone, and will be hardened but also scared somehow of life. Guys usually end up in crime, but in the case of my sister as shes a girl, she will be fine with me. But if you were in her shoes, and lived her life, believe me, you would think differently. Even I would.

 

Drunk fliers is common here, yes, but also on many international flights... It's not a strictly issue with the CIS. Being public drunk is illegal in the US might be, also some western European countries and the arab ones I guess. But still very common in the world.  I like to drink vodka because it's one of lives greatest pleasures. But I always do it either at home or in the bar as being in a public area is just asking for trouble.

 

There is many good reasons children should get banned, and other reasons why they shouldn't. Its complex and I believe it depends on who you are and how you think. But I, like you have met some extremely rude parents that absolutely do not care about it and does absolutely nothing. Many parents even take the kids to businessclass once the economy class passengers have become ###### enough to act. But if the parent actually try to do their best then passengers usually have some empathy for them.

 

About neighbors like that you solved it nicely by calling the police... In my previous apartment I had a neighbor with two kids (kids were fine) but he played such loud music every early morning it eventually escalated to a phsysical level. I know it might sound strange to you as you are in the US, but here it's a very normal (and unfortunate) thing to happen.

 

Hello?! This is the real world calling. You may not have a child at the moment and you may not be able to think about what it would be like to have one but the reality is that there are plenty of people who will have no choice but to take small/children babies on flights (long or short-haul). Think out of the box a little as you can make statements like the above and then laugh at how naive you were when you look back.

 

User72 summed it up well. You pay for your seat, you take your chances. Behaviour of small children is a different question really. For what it's worth we took my 2.5 year old away in June for the first time on a short haul flight and he was no bother to anyone.

Realworkd calling? My previous statement was pretty real worldwise. I'm talking reality, not flight simulator. I have mentioned earlier that there are people who really must take their kids on flights and I have stated that is why there is many possible solutions about that. If you haven't bothered to read earlier answers in the thread and accusing me of thinking in a "box" that's not my problem.

 

If I prefer not to bring my children onto flights until they're 2-3 year olds then that's my decision.

[TurboTomato 90]

Realworkd calling? My previous statement was pretty real worldwise. I'm talking reality, not flight simulator. I have mentioned earlier that there are people who really must take their kids on flights and I have stated that is why there is many possible solutions about that. If you haven't bothered to read earlier answers in the thread and accusing me of thinking in a "box" that's not my problem.

 

If I prefer not to bring my children onto flights until they're 2-3 year olds then that's my decision.

 

That is indeed your decision. At the moment. Without any children (presumably). Can you not envisage a situation where when the time came and you have children, you may have little (or no) choice about taking your child on a plane? You say you've addressed the fact that there are people who must take their children on flights - what makes you think you'll never be one of them?

[User72 28]

Tushka, at this stage of the conversation I'm of the opinion that you are perhaps not quite as worldly wise as you like to consider yourself based on the very limited evidence from this thread alone, which is all I have to go on. I don't imagine I or others could influence your thinking on the matter at hand in any way here, so all I can say now is best of luck to you Sir.

[Tushka 0]

That is indeed your decision. At the moment. Without any children (presumably). Can you not envisage a situation where when the time came and you have children, you may have little (or no) choice about taking your child on a plane? You say you've addressed the fact that there are people who must take their children on flights - what makes you think you'll never be one of them?

One day I might be one of them, who knows. What I'm mainly talking about is certain childfree areas in the aircraft as this would also get a chance for regular fliers to pay more.

Tushka, at this stage of the conversation I'm of the opinion that you are perhaps not quite as worldly wise as you like to consider yourself based on the very limited evidence from this thread alone, which is all I have to go on. I don't imagine I or others could influence your thinking on the matter at hand in any way here, so all I can say now is best of luck to you Sir.

It has nothing about being wise or anything. If you want to complain my grammar I do not care.

 

I simply shared my experiences on aircraft and discrimination, nothing more. We're all different people, different mindsets, different culture and different past. We don't think alike and applying "common sence" won't work if it's an international forum.

[Holdit 551]

 

 

But if kids annoy young people so much that they suddeny use phsysical violence something is clearly wrong with the practice

 

Er...no. Something is clearly wrong with the person using physical violence.

[Tushka 0]

Er...no. Something is clearly wrong with the person using physical violence.

Wrong on both ways.

 

However there is something wrong with my grammar on that above quote. But just to not escalate further I will refrain from giving the full story.