Citation II S550 - The (potential) bugs thread

[~Craig~ 10]

I'm not sure what exactly is missing in the autopilot, but I find that I can turn on FD, dial in a target altitude, climb with ALT SEL and adjust VS with the Pitch wheel.  All that works.

 

Also, the autopilot will follow a GPS course in NAV mode ( I use the GTN750 ) and also follow an LPV approach in APR mode.

 

Have not tried IAS mode yet..

 

Agree Bert - I have no problems with the AP now either.    (IAS mode is the same deal as with the PC-12 - it "seeks" 500 FPS first, then returns to, and holds, the speed quite well).

[raymar 969]

For what it is worth, there is much to like here IMHO..

Thanks Bert. Well said.

 

Regards,

 

Ray

Edited January 22, 2015 by n4gix
Removed excessive quote, again!

[Bert Pieke 7,585]

But there lies the issue Bert, It's more expensive than the Realair Duke T v2 and the same price as the PMDG J41, If Carenado are pitching their prices in that league they really need to step up to the plate and deliver a solid product.

 

As I said:  "Liberace is not ever going to be a Rubinstein.."

 

..and according my calculation, the TDuke and the Citation are priced about the same.

 

So yes, they need to fix the bugs.. and after two service packs, we'll see where we are..

[Guest BeaverDriver]

Can any of you who buy these things from Carenado explain to me why you put yourselves through this time and time again, I am struggling to understand why you do it.

 

I can understand folks new to the hobby being swayed by the nice graphics but there are experienced simmers in this thread that willingly buy everything Carenado put out.

 

Help me here.

 

The "$64,000 Question" Glynn ^_^ . I ask myself the same question (with me in mind, not everyone else) everytime I buy one of these. The truth is, some systems aside, the Saratoga and PC 12 were actually very good releases. As I really wanted a Citation, I was hoping that trend would continue. Now Bert did make some good points, and perhaps I tend to see the bad over the good a little too much, but there are some things to like here. It's not ALL bad, certainly. But as many have pointed out here and in other forums, we keep seeing the same things crop up and incomplete releases coming out time after time, and were it not for the "local talent" (as Bob650 put it) here, most of these would be write-off's. As Bob650 put it too, it's the only game in town at the moment. That part really is a shame, and I have heard of more than one top end developer say that since "that airplane" were already being done, there was little point with them going ahead with their version. THAT part is wrong. If Carenado kept their prices in line with what they were actually producing, then nobody would have a squawk. They aren't though. These are now top dollar for a mid-weight release (the graphics making up most of the positive side). I think what bothers me most of all though, is they don't seem to care. Tell me that if they even once turned the Avionics switch on they wouldn't see the EADI numbers as unreadable! Of course they turned the Avionics switch on, and yes, they did see that issue. Did they correct it before release? Nope. THAT disdain for the customer is what gets my dander up far more so than a bug that makes it out the door. ALL releases have bugs. They just usually aren't ones that are right in everyone's face right off the bat.

 

Thanks again for your help Bert. More appreciated than you know.

[Guest BeaverDriver]

Oh, just one other point that I forgot to address, then I'll "give it a rest" :wink: . Someone mentioned that they believed I/we are trying to put Carenado out of business. Nothing could be further from the truth. Just the opposite in fact! If Carenado were to up their quality in areas other than the graphics, think of how much more value we'd be getting. If they would only live up to their potential, think of how many more sales they would have! That's a win-win. I'd be buying pretty much every release they sent out. I'm seeing more and more people saying "enough already - won't buy again until they start releasing a better product." That HAS to be hurting their bottom line (and maybe why the prices are going up and up??). Show the customer a little respect by fixing obvious bugs before releasing the airplane, and fix the bugs that the customers report that are not so obvious and are legitimately missed on release. Case in point - they have been told on every release that I buy which has a certain type of altitude preselector that you should get the aural warning at 1000 feet before, and again at 300 feet before the target altitude. Instead, they have it (erroneously) at 300 feet before and again AT the target altitude (that's not do-able IRL by the by - alert would go off everytime you strayed 20 ft either side of the target, which would be every couple of minutes or so on a normal flight). Have they done anything about it? Nope. If they can code -300 and at the target altitude, surely they could code at -1000 and -300 instead. My point is, if your capabilities don't include good coding, get someone who can! There are LOTS of people on these forums even, who could help you out. They are making enough from these airplanes now that they can afford to pay someone to help them code gauges. Once you have that done once, you don't have to do it again, so it's not like you have to reinvent the wheel constantly. Man, think of the quality we'd have then! Everybody would be clamouring for new releases from them. Just a little respect for the customer, and admit when you're in over your head on some things and get someone in who does know and/or who can teach you. That's all I'm asking.

[~Craig~ 10]

/\ /\ good points Glenn.

[texerrn 0]

A new issue with pop up auto pilot display. With P3d I now have a border around the auto pilot . The other pop ups are fine. It was working alright until I moved it with the mouse. Now it looks funny, with a border and says autopilot. Can,t get it back to the way it was.

[raymar 969]

A new issue with pop up auto pilot display. With P3d I now have a border around the auto pilot . The other pop ups are fine. It was working alright until I moved it with the mouse. Now it looks funny, with a border and says autopilot. Can,t get it back to the way it was.

Sounds like you undocked the window. Right click on the window and select close or undock.

 

Regards,

Ray

[texerrn 0]

Concerning my problem with the autopilot pop-up. Just reloaded the aircraft, now looks fine. That solved it, Nevermind

[KenG 492]

 

 

While I understand the need to vent from time to time, IMHO it would be more helpful to have a listing of potential bugs and which of those bugs people have already reported to Carenado.

 

I have been going over this airplane with my typical fine tooth comb giving it the old acceptance test flight review. I have found a number of things that just don't seem right. Some of which I admit is expectation of features as opposed to actual bugs.

 

Here is my list so far:

1. EADI click spot for 2D popup is too small
2. Radar Altitude Test - unable to perform R ALT TEST on ground
3. Altimeter - Unable to switch between inches and Hpa
4. Standby Altimeter - No Hpa readout
5. ADC1 advisory light is always on on the copilot side
6. NAV Source display - GPS when this aircraft is equipped with an FMS
7. Clipping of text on EHSI
8. GPS is magenta regardless if it is coupled to FD or not. (Does not seem to follow Universal's color scheme for the EFI-550)
9. Magenta "FD" in middle of EADI
10. No Heading bug on MFD
11. EHSI when displaying Navaids the display shows Waypoints
12. Turn knob on AP seems INOP, should deselect lateral mode and put the airplane into a bank relative to the deflection of the turn knob
13. Cannot change Cabin Altitude (OK I know some can change this, but I cannot find the click spot. Make it the center of the knob.)
14. MM displays Red, the standard color for a middle marker is amber
15. EHSI when coupled to FMS/GPS source should display on the right outer most dot of the HSI the LNAV scale (0.3 for terminal, 1.0 for approach and 5.0 for enroute.)
16. Pilot and copilot EHSI linked as one gauge. Should be independent systems.

Again I may be discussing features here as opposed to actual bugs, and I have not reported anything to Carenado. Please let me know your opinions.

 

Thank you,

 

[~Craig~ 10]

/\ /\  excellent list.  I've observed most of those too (I too cannot set cabin alt).

 

I think if Carenado worked their way through those, and addressed them, we'd have one heck of an airplane!  I think you've done the most comprehensive systems testing there, and I wouldn't hold back from sending that list straight to Carenado.

[Guest BeaverDriver]

Good point Ken. I've been compiling my list over the past couple of days. Found most things you have, and am adding:

 

1) Oxygen pressure indicates low for what it should be (Copilot's panel)

2) Gyro "pressure" gauge reads zero constantly. Pretty sure that should be "Gyro Suction" not pressure, and it should be in the green.

3) Avionics will work without the Inverter or AC on

4) ASI's Left & Right do not agree - Mach meter seems broken on the right side.

5) Pitch adjust thumbwheel on autopilot panel works in reverse

 

That's all I can remember off the top of my head, but as I say, that's in addition to the things you have found.

[raymar 969]

You can add to the list . . . .

 

Airspeed Adjustable Bug - INOP, Set Index Knob does nothing.

 

Target Box above Fan Speed INOP

 

Altitude Select mislabeled by Vertical Speed Hold Selector

 

Fuel Quantity vertical gauges need x100 Lbs for correct indicated FUEL QTY L/R

 

Ray

[CAPFlyer 2]

Add to that the Sperry Multi-window not working at all.  Yes, right now it shows the "Altitude Alert", but it's a mutli-mode window and I find it sad that Bill & the team at Eaglesoft were able to program it to work right on their 5+ year old plane but Carenado can't even get it to work right in a single mode.  If you're going to include the gauge and show videos of it, then you need to make it work right.

[Guest BeaverDriver]

Oh yeah, speaking of the Altitude Alert feature - it should sound at 1000 ft before and 300 ft before the target altitude, not AT the target altitude (has been incorrect is pretty much every release including this, but maybe worth another try). It should also sound at 300 to 400 ft above the target altitude if you go through the target.