I have to agree with others that it isn't bashing. If you don't like it then don't read it. Comments from folks here have saved others from spending their hard-earned money on a buggy product. If we all kept our mouths shut how would others know what the problems are? Go ahead and stumble blindly into a bug-ridden POS. I am sure glad I didn't thanks to others here. Also, let's not forget this isn't the first biz-jet they released in recent months that has big problems.

 

 

No, it isn't. Developer shapes up, criticism stops.  
Developer has NOT shaped up, criticism continues.
 
Simple. Not boring.

 

Carenado does what Carenado does,  and they do it very well indeed,  they produce fantastic and beautiful exterior and interior models, light systems and yes some bugs in there as well.  Carenado's market is not Study simulation enthusiasts,  its for people who love and don't mind.........   

 

 "fantastic and beautiful exterior and interior model, light systems and yes some bugs in there as well"    this is common knowledge 

 

In fairness they don't claim to be study or acusim products.  If you want a complete product that will suit your hardcore needs (as i did, A2A :wub: ) well then you know who to buy from,  But if you want..........

 

 "fantastic and beautiful exterior and interior models, light systems and yes some bugs in there as well"    then you buy Carenado.  

 

Now comes along the Titan and Navajo and yes i will without dought purchase one of these as i think there beautiful planes but i'm buying on the bases that the product i'm getting is.........

 

"fantastic and beautiful exterior and interior models, light systems and yes some bugs in there as well"   but i don't mind because i know what i'm getting.  

 

The Carenado science wont change because there market is not aimed at the hardcore,  yes yes plenty of the hardcore purchase Carenado but there main revenue stream comes from folks who want and love these products and more then likely don't see the bugs (or it doesn't bother them)  so why would they change.  

 

Banging the Carenado drum will only result in sore hands and a headache       

I'm not into study sims. At my older age, I've lost patience. Flight simming is one of three hobbies, in addition to full time work.  I spent decades learning everything possible about construction and maintenance of GA class airplanes, for real life purposes. I owned, built, and flew high performance GA.  I no longer care about sim maintenance, and just want to fly beautifully rendered airplanes in beautiful scenery. I also fly them in a realistic way, but will probably never learn to use a full function FMS. Note:, I was heavily into glass GPS systems for real life GA cross country. Carenado, which I do buy for X-Plane, while buying RealAir and A2A for FSX, fits the bill.  I know what they are. They are a notch above most, when it comes to exterior & interior graphics. That's what I'm paying for. 

 

 

 I no longer care about sim maintenance, and just want to fly beautifully rendered airplanes in beautiful scenery

 

 I know what they are. They are a notch above most, when it comes to exterior & interior graphics. That's what I'm paying for. 

 

Bingo, i Completely agree 

Everytime I read certain posts I can't help asking myself why do people who don't have anything of substance to add to the conversation feel the need to let us all know about it like they are some preachers of the "other side".

 

With all due respect. I can't see anything of substance nor anything new in this discussion, just the same arguments repeated ad libitum. As a buyer of the Hawker since day 1, I know perfectly well which the bugs and the limitations of this model are. Despite such bugs and - especially - thanks to the hard work by some users like Bert Pieké, Ryan, autogyro, Richard, Jim Barrett and, more recently, FSMaNiA and C525B, the Hawker is a very nice and enjoyable aircraft. No, this is not my opinion, this is the opinion of most of Hawker buyers on AVSIM, if you only bother to read all the threads in this section and to measure the effort they produced so far to optimize it to the maximum possible extent. We are perfectly aware about what we can expect from Carenado. In spite of all his bugs, we like the Hawker. Deal with it.

 

FYI he paid $50 for a product that has more bugs then a stray dog. It's called customer dissatisfaction and in Carenado case VERY justified.

 

I am sorry to hear from the OP that he regrets his investment, but, again, there was plenty of information in this section about all pros and cons of this model. There is hardly one single bug in the Hawker that was overlooked and was not entirely discussed here. In most cases, issues have been solved with some modifications to the panel and aircraft file and/or using the GTN 750 (again, mostly thanks to that brilliant mind named Bert Pieké), although other bugs were not corrected nor will probably ever be. Nobody ever suggested that the Hawker is bug free or at the same level as A2A. In my opinion, the OP had all the information he needed to make an informed purchase.

 

Anyway it's refreshing to have someone who really cares about how we express our dissatisfaction with a product on a PRODUCT SPECIFIC subforum...

 

You are obviously entitled to express your dissatisfaction and to fight your holy war against Carenado as much as you want. I think I am entitled as well to say that I find this daily bashing of Carenado really boring. I have several products from other vendors in my hangar that I regret I bought, in spite of this I don't spend my time in their forums "warning" other people. Quite the contrary, I respect people who like and enjoy those products.

 

As Poppet pointed out: Carenado is Carenado. If you like it, you buy it, if don't like it, you don't buy it. Period.

 

 

As a buyer of the Hawker since day 1, I know perfectly well which the bugs and the limitations of this model are. Despite such bugs and - especially - thanks to the hard work by some users like Bert Pieké, Ryan, autogyro, Richard, Jim Barrett and, more recently, FSMaNiA and C525B, the Hawker is a very nice and enjoyable aircraft.

 

Barrel owl, don't you see something just a tiny bit wrong with a company whose buisiness model revolves around pushing out buggy products and expecting other paying customers to improve said buggy products for those of us who don't have the technical skill/time to do it ourselves?

Barrel owl, don't you see something just a tiny bit wrong with a company whose buisiness model revolves around pushing out buggy products and expecting other paying customers to improve said buggy products for those of us who don't have the technical skill/time to do it ourselves?

 

Hi Neil,

no, honestly I don't. For reasons others and I explained ad nauseam in the last two months and that I will not repeat again. But I obviously respect yours and others' opinions to the contrary.

 

Hugs

Hi Neil,

no, honestly I don't. For reasons others and I explained ad nauseam in the last two months and that I will not repeat again. But I obviously respect yours and others' opinions to the contrary.

 

Hugs

So you won't repeat what you think yet you have no issue writing half page of why I'm wrong...

 

I got the hawker too and I like it ONLY beacause some people take their time to fix carenados ###### product for free (!!!) which you would know if you only would bother to read what I wrote about it in one of the posts.

 

So how about you send all those people that fix those carenado planes for you lets say $5 x 500 (lets assume carenado sold each plane to 500 people) and multiply all x10 since people fix more then one. Oh right. They do it for free so why enforce/shame/bash/complain about shady practicing company that makes money out of it if In the end somebody will fix the plane for you anyway... great attitude.

 

You work for them that you don't see anything wrong with it?

Use LINDA also

Bingo, i Completely agree 

 

Really ? The only way you know that is because of the posts.

 

Bingo, i Completely agree 

 

And the only way you get to agree is because of the posts. Including the negative posts.

If they weren't here how would you know their pretty textures have systemic and endemic flaws ? I'm sure you have about as many hours PIC in Hawker 850XP's as me.

 

If the community appears to have far less positive to say than negative when it comes to Carenado, that can only be Carenado's fault.

If they could fix VS to capture altitudes and stay there that would be great as Their older aircraft do such as Kingair - i just tried it works fine also the Alabeo Titan I just picked up works a treat also - have to load up hawker again and see if it works like aircraft stated as I just did new install of P3D on windows 10 - see what happens

Hi Neil,

no, honestly I don't. For reasons others and I explained ad nauseam in the last two months and that I will not repeat again. But I obviously respect yours and others' opinions to the contrary.

 

Hugs

 

Fair enough, I'm not going to go seeking those explanations out though.

 

Big sloppy kisses,

Neil.

Fair enough, I'm not going to go seeking those explanations out though.

 

Neil, don't waste time listening to me or listening to proven haters. Instead, do yourself a favour a read this:

http://forum.avsim.net/page/index.html/_/reviews/aircraft/review-hawker-850xp-for-fsxp3d-by-carenado-r3063

 

It's a quite balanced review, which, in my opinion, pretty much sums up the consensus among most of us Hawker owners.

Regards

I have to agree with others that it isn't bashing. If you don't like it then don't read it. Comments from folks here have saved others from spending their hard-earned money on a buggy product. If we all kept our mouths shut how would others know what the problems are? 

 

+1

 

Dirk.

Neil, don't waste time listening to me or listening to proven haters. Instead, do yourself a favour a read this:

http://forum.avsim.n...-carenado-r3063

 

I've read through the review and I'll agree it is quite balanced. When you get to the 'conclusion' section however, the opinion of the author mirrors the 'constant Carenado bashing' that you've seen in this thread and elsewhere on AVSIM.

 

The aircraft is a 99% perfect replica of its real world counterpart from a visual standpoint and few would argue otherwise. When it comes to the systems however, the 850XP could have been better. The autopilot functionality is somewhat limited and some features that have been modeled (VNAV especially!) do not work the way it should in the real world. While Carenado did a good job at trying to replicate the Proline21 in its basic form, it resulted in some features not working correctly or being difficult to use. 

The fact that another developer has produced a Proline21 equipped aircraft in all its glory for just $0.04 more isn’t very encouraging and at the price of $49.95, Carenado should have offered a product that features more functionality. Carenado customers have always desired greater functionality in their products and I think it’s time for Carenado to listen.

Nonetheless, I honestly believe that Carenado has the capability to produce some of the best aircraft add-ons the FS world has ever seen if only they focus more time on the systems of the aircraft and rely on the feedback of a wider range of beta testers. By doing this, future products will be of a higher standard right out of the gate and customers will see little need to find tweaks or integrations to improve the product.

I guess the ultimate question about is would I recommend the 850XP? Well I would be lying if I said yes and I would be lying if I said no.

 

 

I think a lot of people see the awesome screenshots and automatically assume the systems will be of a similar level. Some might say it's kind of a sneaky bait-and-switch on Carenado's part. Like I said, I haven't so much seen needless bashing of Carenado, I just see a fair few disappointed customers who expected a little more for their hard earned cash and are quite rightfully vocal about it.

 

If another developer released a buggy product, do you think we should all just keep quiet and let them get on with it?