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styggron

Learjet 35A - What does AIR IGN L/R do ?

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Hello everyone,

I'm new to the Flysimware Learjet 35A.

 

I've read the manual but sadly there is little detail in there, I have a few questions.

 

1. What does the AIR IGN L and AIR IGN R switches do ? The manual just releats their name without saying anything :(

2. Is there no APR button for the Auto pilot ? Do we just put it to NAV for ILS landing ?

3. How do I activate reversers ? I arm them but how do I make them deploy ? Sure I can use F2 but I was wondering how to deploy them once armed.

 

Thank you everyone

 

:)

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1. I don't know much about the AIR IGN (Air Ignition) switches except they would be used to restart an engine in flight.

2. For an ILS approach, you have to have both NAV and GS on, and GS won't arm unless NAV is on. There is no APR button.

3. For the thrust reversers, I use the switch which is at the very bottom end of my Saitek throttle quadrant throttle lever range. I use FSUIPC to activate the control Throttle Decr (with Repeat) when the switch is activated (throttle lever all the 'back'), and Throttle Cut when the switch is 'released' (throttle lever move up a bit out of the switch activation position).

 

Welcome to the Flysimware L35A -- a superb a/c.

 

Al

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Frem the FlightSafety Training Manual:

 

SELECTIVE MODE
Selective ignition is controlled by two-position
switch.es labeled "AIR tGN L" and "AtR IGN
R" (Figure 7-11) located on the center switch
panel. When the switch is at AIR IGN position,
the igniters wm operate continuously. lgnition
power is supplied by the L and R AIR lGN circuit
breakers on the left and right essential
buses, respectively.

 

Selective use of air ignition is required for all
takeoffs and landings, and also for windmilling
airstarts. It may be used continuously when flying
in heavy precipitation, icing conditions, or turbulent
air. There is no duty cycle established on
the system; however, it should be used only when
necessary to avoid excessive igniter plug erosion.

 

INDICATION

 

An amber light (Figure 7-11 and Appendix
located above each AIR IGN switch will be on
whenever power is being supplied to the associated
jgnition exciter. The ignjtion lights (if on)
will dim if the NAV LTS switch, located on the
right switch panel, is on.

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1. I don't know much about the AIR IGN (Air Ignition) switches except they would be used to restart an engine in flight.

2. For an ILS approach, you have to have both NAV and GS on, and GS won't arm unless NAV is on. There is no APR button.

3. For the thrust reversers, I use the switch which is at the very bottom end of my Saitek throttle quadrant throttle lever range. I use FSUIPC to activate the control Throttle Decr (with Repeat) when the switch is activated (throttle lever all the 'back'), and Throttle Cut when the switch is 'released' (throttle lever move up a bit out of the switch activation position).

 

Welcome to the Flysimware L35A -- a superb a/c.

 

Al

 

Hello AI

Thank you for that. I will test out the AP suggestions thank you that's brilliant. I really wish it had a better manual, I fear it is little help :( :(

 

Ummmm as I don't use Saitek or FSUIPC, is there anything else you can suggest for reversers ? How is it actually done in the virtual cockpit ? I would have thought you just pull back the throttle but it would goes to idle and then if I move it back more it cuts off fuel so how should we do the reversers ?

Frem the FlightSafety Training Manual:

 

SELECTIVE MODE

Selective ignition is controlled by two-position

switch.es labeled "AIR tGN L" and "AtR IGN

R" (Figure 7-11) located on the center switch

panel. When the switch is at AIR IGN position,

the igniters wm operate continuously. lgnition

power is supplied by the L and R AIR lGN circuit

breakers on the left and right essential

buses, respectively.

 

Selective use of air ignition is required for all

takeoffs and landings, and also for windmilling

airstarts. It may be used continuously when flying

in heavy precipitation, icing conditions, or turbulent

air. There is no duty cycle established on

the system; however, it should be used only when

necessary to avoid excessive igniter plug erosion.

 

INDICATION

 

An amber light (Figure 7-11 and Appendix

located above each AIR IGN switch will be on

whenever power is being supplied to the associated

jgnition exciter. The ignjtion lights (if on)

will dim if the NAV LTS switch, located on the

right switch panel, is on.

 

Thank you for that.

I fear I still don't really understand

a) how it should be used

b ) why it should be used

c) If it should be used in the sim

and

d) when it should be used.

 

I read what you wrote several times, I'm still confused sorry. 

 

Their use is not on the manual, nor are they in the start up procedure and nor on youtube videos where people are starting the plane up. However from the information you did here, they should be on take off and landing and "windmilling" whatever that is.

 

Thank you in advance.

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Hi...

 

The full AFM (manual) for the real aircraft is here in the forum somewhere... I'm actually trying to put together some better checklists for myself - based on the AFM - for my own use... I'll gladly share if/when done...

 

I'd ask Al for his fantastic LUA scripts - as they will provide full "button" control of the autopilot - and - other essential features (providing you have a paid FSUIPC)... They have to be setup in your FSUIPC... Very much needed as things happen FAST in this beautiful plane...

 

Best of luck...

 

Regards,

Scott

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I read what you wrote several times, I'm still confused sorry. 

 

Their use is not on the manual, nor are they in the start up procedure and nor on youtube videos where people are starting the plane up. However from the information you did here, they should be on take off and landing and "windmilling" whatever that is.

 

 

Thank you in advance.

Technical manuals can be a little obtuse... :Big Grin: 

 

Selective use of air ignition is required for all:

  • takeoffs
  • landings

and also for:

  • windmilling airstarts (to attempt an engine restart in flight if there is a flameout but the fan is still turning due to airflow).

It may also be used continuously when flying in

  • heavy precipitation
  • icing conditions
  • turbulent air.

It should be used only when necessary to avoid excessive igniter plug erosion so shut it of in normal flight.

 

The igniter is analogous to the spark plug in a car except that in a jet engine it can be shut off as fuel combustion is continuous once started. So switch it on whenever their is a chance for a flameout (water ingestion, ice ingestion, heavy turbulence) or when a flameout would be a really bad thing (takeoff and landing) or when you have a flameout in flight.

 

These are the general conditions for use. Google "Lear 35A checklist" and you should find some more procedural detail until Scott sorts out a better one. I believe there are operating manuals available as well if you have trouble sleeping. I use one from Avialogs.

 

That being said I am no pilot (just play one on the computer) so hopefully someone more knowledgeable might chime in with better info. 

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Quote:  

 

"Thank you for that.
I fear I still don't really understand
a) how it should be used
b ) why it should be used
c) If it should be used in the sim
and
d) when it should be used."

 

 

Not much to it really,

 

A. - Manually move the ignition switch to the on position, the ignition light will illuminate indicating igniter plugs are active. In reality you can hear them spark in a headset.

B. - It is a preventative measure for a condition that could cause an engine to flame out

C. - Good practice as that is what one would do in real world operation

D. - Take off and landing for standing water or slush on the runway, possible bird or foreign object ingestion on takeoff, approach and landing or anytime during heavy precipitation or severe turbulence.Your use it as a safety measure, it is just good operating procedure unless you like to gamble. Always use it for takeoff and landing.

 

If an in flight engine restart is required with an inoperative fuel computer then manual ignition would be required.The automatic on and off ignition is a function of an operational fuel computer such as a normal engine start.

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Hi...

 

The full AFM (manual) for the real aircraft is here in the forum somewhere... I'm actually trying to put together some better checklists for myself - based on the AFM - for my own use... I'll gladly share if/when done...

 

I'd ask Al for his fantastic LUA scripts - as they will provide full "button" control of the autopilot - and - other essential features (providing you have a paid FSUIPC)... They have to be setup in your FSUIPC... Very much needed as things happen FAST in this beautiful plane...

 

Best of luck...

 

Regards,

Scott

 

Thank you for that Scott. As I said above though I don't use FSUIPC I fear.

Technical manuals can be a little obtuse... :Big Grin:

 

Selective use of air ignition is required for all:

  • takeoffs
  • landings

and also for:

  • windmilling airstarts (to attempt an engine restart in flight if there is a flameout but the fan is still turning due to airflow).

It may also be used continuously when flying in

  • heavy precipitation
  • icing conditions
  • turbulent air.

It should be used only when necessary to avoid excessive igniter plug erosion so shut it of in normal flight.

 

The igniter is analogous to the spark plug in a car except that in a jet engine it can be shut off as fuel combustion is continuous once started. So switch it on whenever their is a chance for a flameout (water ingestion, ice ingestion, heavy turbulence) or when a flameout would be a really bad thing (takeoff and landing) or when you have a flameout in flight.

 

These are the general conditions for use. Google "Lear 35A checklist" and you should find some more procedural detail until Scott sorts out a better one. I believe there are operating manuals available as well if you have trouble sleeping. I use one from Avialogs.

 

That being said I am no pilot (just play one on the computer) so hopefully someone more knowledgeable might chime in with better info. 

 

THank you for that.

If they are necessary for take off and landing how come they are not on the checklist in the manual or even on the ingame one ? Does it even matter if I flick those buttons at all ?

 

Sounds like there are things that are not modelled that don't say they are not modelled :(

Hi again everyone,

I just wanted to thank everyone for their replies but there is still one question unanswred.

 

How do you use reverse thrusters ? Many said they map it to their saitek etc, I don't use a Saitek, surely it can be done in the virtual cockpit ? How would it be done in the real Lear35A surely this is modelled rather than pressing F2 ?

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I don't know if they are modeled, but it is procedure in all turbine aircraft to have igniters firing during takeoff/landing or heavy precipitation/icing/turbulence conditions. Although the jet engine doesn't require external ignition while running, in the event of flame blowout, you need some source to restart the combustion chamber. If you are flying at cruise altitude and experience a flameout, you have ample time to hit the switch and restart, but during takeoff and approach, a flameout can put you in a dangerous situation. So you basically use it every time an engine flameout would bring you into serious trouble, I usually turn them off at about 5000 agl and turn them on when I extend flaps to first position or when I turn on anti ice in all turbine powered airplanes, unless explicitly stated otherwise in the flight manual.

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Hi...

 

The full AFM (manual) for the real aircraft is here in the forum somewhere... I'm actually trying to put together some better checklists for myself - based on the AFM - for my own use... I'll gladly share if/when done...

 

I'd ask Al for his fantastic LUA scripts - as they will provide full "button" control of the autopilot - and - other essential features (providing you have a paid FSUIPC)... They have to be setup in your FSUIPC... Very much needed as things happen FAST in this beautiful plane...

 

Best of luck...

 

Regards,

Scott

There are a couple of Martinair rw checklists for the 35 available on the web. Maybe at Magoo.

 

Ray

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Hello everyone,

I'm new to the Flysimware Learjet 35A.

 

I've read the manual but sadly there is little detail in there, I have a few questions.

 

1. What does the AIR IGN L and AIR IGN R switches do ? The manual just releats their name without saying anything :(

2. Is there no APR button for the Auto pilot ? Do we just put it to NAV for ILS landing ?

3. How do I activate reversers ? I arm them but how do I make them deploy ? Sure I can use F2 but I was wondering how to deploy them once armed.

 

Thank you everyone

 

:)

I think the guys have answered these. However I would say;

 

1. They are similar to "continuous ignition" on our Boeing. On at take off and landing and foul weather.

 

2. No approach switch. Nav which goes to "Arm" mode until localiser capture. Then after capture and your near glideslope, press arm GS. That will then capture, and you should have a nice ride down the needles. Just be sure to intercept the GS from below.

 

3. If you are on the latest P3dv3.4, there is additional help to map your stick and throttles. I don't know what you use, but I have the F2 mapped to the slider on my Saitek X55 throttle. The F2 repeats until it's pulled back, so its similar to the reverser levers in the Learjet. The only problem with my solution is that F2 is repeating until I exit out of reverse. Since its only 5 seconds or so its not really a big problem! Just make sure those two "Arm" switches on the glareshield are armed, or nothing will happen.

 

Regards

 

David

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I think the guys have answered these. However I would say;

 

1. They are similar to "continuous ignition" on our Boeing. On at take off and landing and foul weather.

 

2. No approach switch. Nav which goes to "Arm" mode until localiser capture. Then after capture and your near glideslope, press arm GS. That will then capture, and you should have a nice ride down the needles. Just be sure to intercept the GS from below.

 

3. If you are on the latest P3dv3.4, there is additional help to map your stick and throttles. I don't know what you use, but I have the F2 mapped to the slider on my Saitek X55 throttle. The F2 repeats until it's pulled back, so its similar to the reverser levers in the Learjet. The only problem with my solution is that F2 is repeating until I exit out of reverse. Since its only 5 seconds or so its not really a big problem! Just make sure those two "Arm" switches on the glareshield are armed, or nothing will happen.

 

Regards

 

David

 

Thank you for that.

I am on FSX. But I would like to know where on the virtual cockpit the reversers engage as. I would find it highly surprising they would not be modelled as it is a vital thing. As I mentioned sure I can press F2 after arming but surely there has to be a virtual coclpit control for it.

 

The question remains unanswered really until somone says "you use <insert picture> to use the reversers in the VC" or "Flysimware amazingly did not model that"

 

:)

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I am on FSX. But I would like to know where on the virtual cockpit the reversers engage as.

 

OK. On the top glareshield panel arm the two reverser switches.

 

Then...

 

To use the reverser levers in the simulators virtual cockpit, place your mouse pointer over the reverser handles, left click and drag! That's how you would do it in the virtual cockpit .

 

Cheers

 

David

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OK. On the top glareshield panel arm the two reverser switches.

 

 

Some find it convenient to set up a controller button or keyboard key to arm both reversers at the same time using a Lua script.

 

 

To use the reverser levers in the simulators virtual cockpit, place your mouse pointer over the reverser handles, left click and drag! That's how you would do it in the virtual cockpit .

 

 

I use a Saitek throttle quadrant and at the bottom end of the throttle lever's range (below idle) there is a switch which is activated by pulling the lever all the way down (back). I use this switch to activate (deploy) the armed reversers upon landing.

 

Al

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OK. On the top glareshield panel arm the two reverser switches.

 

Then...

 

To use the reverser levers in the simulators virtual cockpit, place your mouse pointer over the reverser handles, left click and drag! That's how you would do it in the virtual cockpit .

 

Cheers

 

David

 

Perfect thank you so much David.

Do I need to be careful I don't pull them back to fuel cut off ? I think I should practice moving those.

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Perfect thank you so much David.

Do I need to be careful I don't pull them back to fuel cut off ? I think I should practice moving those.

The reverser handles are those two smaller levers in front of the thrust levers. Don't touch the Thrust Levers themselves, just the small levers at the front!

 

 

 

 

Some find it convenient to set up a controller button or keyboard key to arm both reversers at the same time using a Lua script.

 

The way to go! Fiddleing with the mouse over those two "arm" switches is not good!

 

 

I use a Saitek throttle quadrant and at the bottom end of the throttle lever's range (below idle) there is a switch which is activated by pulling the lever all the way down (back). I use this switch to activate (deploy) the armed reversers upon landing.

Ideal! My X55 doesn't have a reverser detent, but I get around it by assigning the "slider" on the throttle.

 

Happy simming!

 

David

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Hi Folks,

 

Yeah - map that function to something - it's pure suicide to try and mouse click reversers on the roll out...

:wink:

 

Regards,
Scott

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Hi Folks,

 

Yeah - map that function to something - it's pure suicide to try and mouse click reversers on the roll out...

:wink:

 

Regards,

Scott

Understood.

 

Well, I can use FSX's default F2 I guess then. This seems the best way forward, I wanted to use the virtual cockput but if using those two little levers are a problem I better heed people's advice and keep away from it.

I don't know if they are modeled, but it is procedure in all turbine aircraft to have igniters firing during takeoff/landing or heavy precipitation/icing/turbulence conditions. Although the jet engine doesn't require external ignition while running, in the event of flame blowout, you need some source to restart the combustion chamber. If you are flying at cruise altitude and experience a flameout, you have ample time to hit the switch and restart, but during takeoff and approach, a flameout can put you in a dangerous situation. So you basically use it every time an engine flameout would bring you into serious trouble, I usually turn them off at about 5000 agl and turn them on when I extend flaps to first position or when I turn on anti ice in all turbine powered airplanes, unless explicitly stated otherwise in the flight manual.

 

Hello,

The manual tends to label things not modelled but with these AIR IGNs, because their own start up procedure does not mention it, it certainly seems like they are not modelled and they just forgot to tell us perhaps which is a little disappointing really.

 

Would be nice too if the cockpit was rendered a little more realistically, sorry I'm just used to A2A quality :) Don't get me wrong this is an amazing product. The only reason I purchased it was because it did not have online activation which is intrusive DRM IMHO. I love how you can go into the cabin to :)

 

I also don't like the fact how it installed everything twice, the GNS and the GTN versions. I would like to remove the GTN versions from the list because I don't have and will never have that GPS.  :sad:

 

Also anyone know how to load passengers ? The load passengers never does anything. I click but nothing hapens. It's like the passenger loading system does not work.  :(

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Also anyone know how to load passengers ? The load passengers never does anything. I click but nothing hapens. It's like the passenger loading system does not work. :sad:

I'm not sure what you're looking for with this feature, but it does work. Load Passengers adds Payload Weight distributed throughout the aircraft according to which seats you fill. Once you've set them, you can see that the aircraft weight has increased accordingly. If this is not working, then you failed to install XMLTools, in which case you'll need to RTFM :-) ('cuz I don't recall off the top of my head where they put the XMLTools installer)

 

 

I also don't like the fact how it installed everything twice, the GNS and the GTN versions. I would like to remove the GTN versions from the list because I don't have and will never have that GPS. :sad:

 

Just blow away the ones you don't use (that's what I did anyway)

 

 

AIR IGNs, ... it certainly seems like they are not modelled

 

Agreed - I can find no evidence that they do anything. I can't get engines to re-fire without using the starter. Air start with 'windmilling' fans does work for me (since the turbines don't windmill AFAIK)

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