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oliver1234

What does the Flight Sim Community really need?

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As stated above!

 

Don't be saying things like, a 64-bit sim... We know!

 

More things like applications for the sim to increase realism, tools etc. What would you like to see?

 

Oliver Mitchell

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Either cheaper addon prices or cheaper hardware because right now it is just a hobby for people with a large amount of disposable income. The 64it and DX11+ helps because you can run cheaper hardware and get good performance.

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IMO, we need a sim that in its default state can provide us a highly detailed and stable simulation environment. By environment I mean, high-quality sceneries, high-quality weather depiction, fully formed modern ATC with real world procedures and a realistic traffic environment -- all in a default version.

 

The add-on world can then provide us better aircrafts and airports, but the default sim should be self-sufficient in giving us a highly-detailed environment.

 

The user can then customize the settings according to their computer to achieve a stable performance scenario but the sim shouldn't make us reach out for more add-ons. Reducing our dependency on add-ons can go a long way in freeing up computer resources. Currently we treat most sims as a base layer but then look to supplement almost everything on top of it. IMO, only aircrafts and airports should be really add-ons we should be craving for, because the rest of it should be provided to us by the default simulator.

 

IMO, both P3D and XP11 fall short on these. 

 

And yes, I am probably asking for too much :)

 

P.S. Another thing I have always thought we could use was a true multiplayer setup where we can interact with other simmers while flying a "live" version of the sim so to speak where we interact with other pilots at our departing airport, chat with them, hear their ATC chatter, hear about weather en-route etc. Just to lessen the "solitary" feeling of the whole thing.. perhaps VATSIM already does this?

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I'm going to set my sights lower...

  • obstruction lights on towers...steady red, flashing red and white strobes.
  • improved night lighting in general both on and off the airport.
  • realistic looking rotating beacon.

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I think that the Simmers that Really Need the Super Detail, Step by Step, Just like the Real Planes, and want to spend $70 to $100 Dollars for them, Great. I also think that Developers should also offer the same Aircraft in a Much Simpler Detail and Complexity, and a Considerably Lower Price, for us Low and Slow, Low budget Hobby Fun Flyers ! Remember all the Freeware available for FSX ?? How often do You get close enough to an Airplane to Count the Rivets, and Who's looking at the Airplane anyhow ?? - Johnman B)

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I'm going to set my sights lower...

  • obstruction lights on towers...steady red, flashing red and white strobes.
  • improved night lighting in general both on and off the airport.
  • realistic looking rotating beacon.

 

 

 

These can all be found to varying degrees (and depending on the scenery authors implementation) in XP.

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One sim - to unite simmers again. Too many of us are splitting off

 

Developers are leaving (market was tiny enough to begin with).... not good.

 

DTG, FSX:SE, P3D, XP10/11, Aerofly

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Less time tweaking and more time flying, or maybe just more time for flying.

We have it pretty sweet now compared to when we first heard the news that Microsoft was dropping support for FSX.

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Need?  Young, smart, creative minds and people to fill some big shoes.  I'd like to see a slew of new talent come on to the flight sim scene.  The pioneers of the flight sim and add-on community answered the call and created some of the most innovative and useful items, making our hobby better and keeping it as real as possible.  It appears we will have what we have for some time, so how can we continue to create add-ons that carry on the tradition?  New ideas and most importantly, new talent that can take our hobby to the next level.  

 

I often see questions that could be answered with a little effort, like, "Is there a freeware _____? (fill in the blank)," or "What is the best GA aircraft?"  "Best" is such a subjective word because best to you and me are different.  Besides, looking for items yourself lets you see the tens of thousands add-ons already out there.  The people in this forum are fantastic and have provided so much help and assistance over the years.  What I'm hoping for are people who wish to step in as the "experienced" ones fly off into their retirement years.  Searching, playing, and tweaking are the ways I've learned what I need to know to make my hobby enjoyable and keep it relevant.  

 

This is certainly not a slam on anyone.  Thank you to those before us for making remarkable add-ons, to those who have spent countless hours learning the SDK and how to tweak for max performance, to those who have answered the silly questions many of us have had, and to those stepping up to take over.  We have more accurate airports thanks to the efforts of Ray, Craig, and many others.  We have sim activity on the waterways thanks to the genius of Henrik.  And we have many users simming better because Zippy was there to help out on a level I could understand.  

 

Happy New Year to everyone, and happy flying.

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Honestly hardware. The jump from the ~$160 yoke to the ~$500 is steep. There has to be a middle ground to appeal to everyone. I am happy I found the Crosswind pedals, and I think the price point is spot on with the quality.

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Honestly hardware. The jump from the ~$160 yoke to the ~$500 is steep. There has to be a middle ground to appeal to everyone. I am happy I found the Crosswind pedals, and I think the price point is spot on with the quality.

 

 

I'll go one step further than that: a reasonably priced (<$250) force feedback yoke. The two most difficult things about hand flying in a home flight sim have almost always been the visuals and the "feel" of the controls.

 

Visuals made a huge jump with tools like TrackIR, which made changing views much more natural. And now with VR, it's a quantum leap with things like depth perception, etc. In other words, while not everyone has it yet, the visual problem is pretty much "solved."

 

But control feel... If you've ever flown a plane in real life, you know what the forces feel like. Maintaining straight and level is way easier in a real Cessna 172 than in the sim. Trimming out the controls, a constant exercise in frustration in the sim, couldn't be easier in real life. Get the plane pointed where you want it, and then trim until you don't have to exert any force on the controls. Simple!

 

More than anything FS-related, I want a good force feedback yoke for hand flying.

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I'll go one step further than that: a reasonably priced (<$250) force feedback yoke. The two most difficult things about hand flying in a home flight sim have almost always been the visuals and the "feel" of the controls.

 

Visuals made a huge jump with tools like TrackIR, which made changing views much more natural. And now with VR, it's a quantum leap with things like depth perception, etc. In other words, while not everyone has it yet, the visual problem is pretty much "solved."

 

But control feel... If you've ever flown a plane in real life, you know what the forces feel like. Maintaining straight and level is way easier in a real Cessna 172 than in the sim. Trimming out the controls, a constant exercise in frustration in the sim, couldn't be easier in real life. Get the plane pointed where you want it, and then trim until you don't have to exert any force on the controls. Simple!

 

More than anything FS-related, I want a good force feedback yoke for hand flying.

I agree. You won't realize how easy it is to actually fly a plane straight and level until you actually do it in an aircraft. You can feel the controls fighting you when the plane is not trimmed.

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With the coming of a number of changes, at least in the U.S., such as ADS-B, the decommissioning of VOR's and the changes to the airspace system and IFR approaches that will bring and changes to airports, such as changing runway headings with the shift in magnetic north (slow change I know) or there outright closure, someone, or more likely group, should be looking into modifications of FSX to attempt to keep it relevant into the future. I know these would be massive changes, but unless someone other than X-Plane is developing a whole new sim then what we have now will be not much more than a pretty play thing in the not to distant future. 

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Either cheaper addon prices or cheaper hardware because right now it is just a hobby for people with a large amount of disposable income. The 64it and DX11+ helps because you can run cheaper hardware and get good performance.

 

It's almost becoming an elitist hobby.

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It's almost becoming an elitist hobby.

But only when you go adding the latest, greatest add-ons and hardware. It's easy to forget that FSX straight out-of-the-box is actually a pretty good introduction to flying which doesn't need expensive hardware. It's also inexpensive if you buy it in a Steam sale.

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I'd say we need beer wenches to hand me a beer while I'm flying but I would never say that because its a little sexist.  :Shame On You:

 

So I'd say we need promo girls to hand us beer while we fly.  :dance:

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But only when you go adding the latest, greatest add-ons and hardware. It's easy to forget that FSX straight out-of-the-box is actually a pretty good introduction to flying which doesn't need expensive hardware. It's also inexpensive if you buy it in a Steam sale.

 

But then you come to enthusiast forums and find that you aren't really simming unless you have the latest $200 plane (after all, default planes are disgusting toys for children) and of course you need the hardware to support that...... and off you go, into the ratrace to find a respectable place in the community hierarchy.

 

$3000 later..........   :rolleyes:

 

Congrats now you're a real simmer......

 

But you should still probably buy the....... (place name of numerous things here) for full enjoyment.

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And then they come out with their brand new 64 bit Simm's, Another $3000 Please ! - Johnman

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I think we could do with a bit more of the feeling of being there. Anyone who flies aeroplanes for real knows there's a bit of skulking around hangars, sorting out oxygen bottles, adjusting seats and ballast, drinking brews whilst waiting for stuff, sorting paperwork, kicking tires, towing things about and doing walk around checks. One or two FS add-ons have some of that as elements, such as Aerosoft's Dimona and A2A stuff has a lot of maintenance modeled, but one sim I really liked which went one step further with all that was Take on Helicopters, which actually has you walking about in a manner similar to a first person shooter game, where you can literally do the walk around and stroll to the offices and hangars. Personally, like most flyers, I like being around aeroplanes even when they are in the hangar. Perhaps a sim where you could get some oil on your hands might make things more immersive.

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FSX can be very enjoyable on a budget if you can get over the idiotic mindset that it has to be as good as a Level D sim or some real flying.

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That's the thing I suppose, flying a sim is such a lot of different things to different people, some people just want to dive in, others want to adjust every dial to within a millimetre. The diversity of it keeps it interesting, but I guess it also means what one person thinks we need, another might not want at all. :-)

 

Over and above everything, one thing we do need for sure is to not have the main sim people use be based on a sim that came out a decade ago (FSx). Yes P3D and FSxSE are tweaked up, but they are still based on a ten year old sim engine. The graphics are okay and they do the job, but they are really unsophisticated compared to where many computer simulations are these days.

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Lots of thing that we want to have, the developers out there would probably already think about it. But in fact is restricted by the simulator(s) in different ways, especially the 32-bit platform. They can put more functions into the product, but because need to keep the low VAS, they have to think it twice. And of course, if the sim itself doesn't support, they can not do it.

 

So if we can get a better simulator, I believed many things can be done.

 

Being a real world pilot myself, I am still addicted to the simulator that lots of time I want to fly in the sim more than get into the real cockpit. FSX:SE still satisfy me.

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How about an understanding that if you want the ultimate product with ultimate realism in all respects then you have to pay for it.

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Working with a number of leading developers, speaking with even more, and understanding their financial and business investment to product flight sim software leads me to be very, in fact EXTREMELY supportive of their efforts.  In fact I can save without qualification that third party developers are responsible for the level of fidelity, immersion and realism that we are each able to enjoy.  I am an extremely qualified and experienced technical project manager (which includes business and business planning, contracting, life cycle (cradle to grave) product/system support.

 

So when I say that prices are too high, it should carry at least a little weight.

 

Hardware prices have been so high that I'm confident the prices strangle sales (in other words, sales would be higher if prices dropped).

 

The cost of some third party aircraft, and most all airport scenery may not be at levels that strangle sales, but I believe that they are about 20% to 30% too high and such a price reduction would result in increased sales and exposure for additional scenery sales.  After all, many quality airport scenery sell for a price that rivals what many people pay for the flight simulation software itself.

 

Over my 30+ years in flight simulation, it's been an exceedingly rare thing to see any type of package deals when purchasing different airport scenery produced by the same developer or sold by a distributor.  If price reductions are in the future, then this might be a way to get prices at least a little lower.  When one considers how many times an individual will fly in/out of an airport, the cost basis for the average airport scenery becomes even higher.

 

While the cost of third party flight sim software doesn't strangle itself on an individual basis, it probably increases the likelihood that people will not enter our hobby beyond the basic flight simulator software and a few addons.  Add computer hardware (because of the system it takes to run flight sim software with various addons), a yoke or good joystick, rudder pedals and throttle quadrant to the mix, and the price tag just for someone to get going in flight sim is extremely high. That overall costs has kept people I know away from the hobby.

 

Looking at this another way:

 

If someone shops for payware airport scenery, and pays $32 USD, they may well stop right there. But what if there was an incentative for them to get a second scenery for say 15 USD price reduction.  It's really a win-win, especially when we consider that revenue from another product has been generated. Sure, the customer has paid more, but truly received more.

 

The changes needed in our hobby can only happen via the distributors, and it's one that I believe will increase not only sales, but the number of people who enjoy our hobby.

 

Well that's my 2 cents/pence.

 

 

My very best wishes to everyone for a very happy, flight sim filled new year!

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