787WannabePilot

Practicing Taking Off / Landing in on Flight

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Greetings,

Are there any basic setups that would allow me just to practice taking off and landing from the same airport?

Maybe a tutorial?

 

 

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14 minutes ago, 787WannabePilot said:

Greetings,

Are there any basic setups that would allow me just to practice taking off and landing from the same airport?

Maybe a tutorial?

 

 

You could use the provided tutorial and just remove the climb/cruise/descent parts. Just focus on takeoff and approach/landing.

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The best thing you can do is become familiar with your aircraft.

Start from cold & dark and then do full VFR pattern work at an airport of your choice!

Just a suggestion, practice with different fuel loads and payloads to really feel the aircraft.

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I do that on occasion, especially when beta testing.  My nearest big hub is KIAH Houston so I start there, weather as desired, configure the aircraft with a default start state because heavy is easier to fly.  My route is simply KIAH to KIAH with one enroute waypoint which I use DAS a nearby VORTAC as a good one. I don't intend to fly to DAS but sometimes the FMS can do strange things if you don't have at least one enroute waypoint. I enter the departure runway, usually 15L and for arrival I usually pick 27. Set up the V speeds and thrust for takeoff and off we go.  Hand flying always but use the FD as much as possible to reduce workload.  Climb on runway heading to 600 then climbing left turn to 090 and level off at 3000 and speed 240.  Best downwind to fly is parallel to approach 5 miles away (normally used for RADAR patterns), so I use put a circle on the ND at KIAH with a 5 nm diameter to help with the distance.  Fly 090 until approaching abeam the ILS 27 FAF (your key point) and slow to 210 or 220 and when past the key point a few miles turn left to intercept the ILS, get flaps out and slow to F5.  Handfly the approach and at about 200 ft AGL hit TOGA or continue to land.  It takes time to become good at this so be patient and accept that it takes time.  You have to learn how to trim and not over control the aircraft, it can be flown with a light touch when done smoothly.  Have fun.

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The easiest way to do things is to use the DEP/ARR page on the FMC.

 

Keep in mind a full circuit (from takeoff to landing) will take around 30 minutes, and a touch and go will take about half that time. Not a fast process.

 

For the first circuit, set up a flight in the FMC. The departure and arrival airport should be the same. In the dep/arr page select your desired runways for takeoff and landing, and set any SID/STARs if you'd like. Check the route before you execute it on the ND. You may have to close any discontinuities. You can also remove STAR points that take you excessive distance from the airport if you'd like - pick a waypoint closer to the airport and copy it to the top line of the legs or route page.

Set your heading bug, altitude and safe climbout speed on the MCP.

I think many if not most airlines arm the LNAV and VNAV on the ground, so the flight directors need to be on. Set up the aircraft configuration (flaps, autobrakes etc) then go. With VNAV armed the aircraft will reduce from takeoff power to climb power at the height you set up in the thrust lim and perf pages before takeoff.

Practice rotating smoothly (No tailstrikes please) then once off the ground and climbing nicely, follow the flight director. With VNAV on the throttles will reduce to climb power even if the autopilot is not turned on. Handfly the aircraft following the flight director or just turn on the autopilot (make sure LNAV and VNAV are armed) and the aircraft will fly the circuit for you.

If you enable approach mode while on an inbound course to the airport, you can just sit back and relax and let the aircraft land itself as long as the airport has facilities allowing autoland.

 

Otherwise, follow the flight director's advice. You can check the LEGS page to get an idea of ideal speeds for the approach but they don't take into account your aircraft's weight so you will usually have to make speed interventions on the speed bug. You want to be under 200 knots when 10-15 miles away from the airport or you'll end up too high and fast for a stabilized approach.

 

Turning on the FPV (Flight path vector) may make it easier to visualize how the aircraft is descending. At no point should you hear GPWS calls unless you're passing over known mountains and they're part of your approach briefing (False GPWS calls).

 

Slow to your final approach speed at around 10 miles from the airport. You should be around 2000-2500 feet high and your gear should come down around this point. You want to be pretty stabilized by 8-10 miles out.

Follow the flight director's guidance, it will account for crosswind and everything, so as long as you follow the FD you will land right where the autoland would put you.

Make sure your spoilers are armed and autobrakes are on if you're doing a full stop landing.

If you're flying a manual approach turn off the AP (With the proper ap disconnect button, not the emergency disconnect bar). Make sure your go around altitude and runway heading are selected in the appropriate windows - you don't want to be messing with these when you're busy on the go around.

If it's raining or snowing out, aim to plant the aircraft down fairly firmly - IIRC the autoland system tries to land at somewhere around 100-350 feet per minute to avoid hydrpolaning and increase brake effectiveness. If the weather is nice out you can try to land more softly but beware of floaty landings - cut the power to idle at the appropriate point to avoid excessive float. If you do float too much to safely stop before the end of the runway, hit the TOGA switch and go around.

If you're doing a touch and go or a go around, hit TOGA, climb out following the FD's cues. Only AFTER vertical speed and airspeed starts increasing steadily and positively, should you retract gear. Gear up first, then flaps. Don't do it the other way around - this crashed an Emirates 777 a while ago.

Once in the go around, set the autopilot to LNAV/VNAV and turn it on, then in the FMC go to the dep/arr page and choose your runway and STAR for landing. It will tack them on at the end of the legs page just past the hold fix for the go around. When you're done holding at the fix, move the next waypoint into the top line and you can restart the entire approach procedure.

 

Hope this helps.

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Hi all,

Great story's but there is also a software program that brings you in several postion for the landing runway, straight or
on base leg and so one so it is not always nessecery to start up from a cold & dark situation. I forget the name of this program but for training is it very convenient.

Regards Jo va Bra

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3 hours ago, Jovabra said:

 

Hi all,

Great story's but there is also a software program that brings you in several postion for the landing runway, straight or
on base leg and so one so it is not always nessecery to start up from a cold & dark situation. I forget the name of this program but for training is it very convenient.

Regards Jo va Bra

I use lord of the landings to practice visual landings only. I go to the desired airport, configure aircraft for landing whilst on the ground, flaps, spoilers, set qnh etc, however don't program anything in CDU. Then I opened up lord of landings, select the airport and runway then click to be 4nm out from runway threshold. Then go back to p3d and press control/shift/a (this key sequence could be wrong I'm trying to remember it, but the program will tell you). Then it will load and place you 4nm out. 

It's quick and easy and great to practice your landing visual technique without doing circuits. 

Lord of the landings can be downloaded free from the Available library

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3 hours ago, Jovabra said:

 

Hi all,

Great story's but there is also a software program that brings you in several postion for the landing runway, straight or
on base leg and so one so it is not always nessecery to start up from a cold & dark situation. I forget the name of this program but for training is it very convenient.

Regards Jo va Bra

Jovaba,

I believe that the Program you refer to is called FSI PANEL. I use it myself all the time.

Among the many things it can do is easily allow you to practice takeoffs and landings from virtually any major airport anywhere in the world with any wind or weather.  You can do STARS, SIDS, almost any type of approach, or practice patterns or partial patterns. Essentially almost anything you could do in the actual aircraft you can now do with this program

The GUI is intuitive and the system is easy to learn. Should you encounter any problem the support is fast and excellent.  Google it and go to their site and be sure to Google some of the many well made Google videos about using it.

Quink   

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I just save a flight when I am on approach about 10 mm out. I can then go back to the same spot over and over again until I feel as though I got it right.  Everything loads up just fine, although you need a minute or so for things to stabilize after the reload.

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The most efficient way to practice takeoffs and landings is to fly a basic visual circuit; the entire purpose of flying such circuits in airline base training is to practice multiple takeoffs and landings within a short time period. 

The FMC setup is straightforward: select the departure runway (with no procedure) and the arrival runway (ideally so that you just get the final approach track drawn). Leave the discos in place as you don't want the plan to sequence. 

Do the weights etc as normal. Take off, climb ahead to 1500ft aal. At a safe height after takeoff, commerce a turn to downwind. I would recommend leaving a stage or two of flap out and restricting the speed to around 180 kt; no need to go blasting round rushing yourself. 

Roll out on downwind. Look out of the window to identify when you are abeam the landing threshold: as you pass abeam, start the stopwatch and time 45 seconds, minus one second per knot of tailwind. 

Approaching the end of the downwind leg (ie as your ~45sec approaches) gear down, flap 20. At 45 sec (+/- wind), start the turn to final and start reducing speed toward Vref + additive, extending landing flap as appropriate.

If you are planning a touch and go, do not arm spoilers or autobrakes. You must also NOT select reverse after touchdown. 

Land the aeroplane. Fly the nosewheel to the ground as usual and maintain centreline with rudder. Stand up the thrust levers, select flap 20, select TOGA and push the thrust levers forward as the TOGA switches may be inhibited.

Rotate at Vref. Positive rate, gear up. Climb to 1500ft aal, accelerate to 180kt/F10, turn downwind at a safe height and do it all over again. Engage the autopilot as appropriate for debriefing.

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9 hours ago, downscc said:

but use the FD as much as possible to reduce workload.

That would increase the workload. Adding the flight director into a visual circuit is inappropriate use of automation and will just keep you more busy than you have to be :laugh:

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Yes touch and go circuit training is done in the real world (I suspect less commonly used with zero flight time sims these days) and is, I find, a really good way of getting used to handling the aircraft in the sim. Every time PMDG release an aircraft, I would load it up at East Midlands or Prestwick and perform the circuits as Simon described before I did proper simulated flights in them. Also, if you look at Simon's channel, I seem to remember he has a very good video of training circuits at LFLX - not in a PMDG aircraft, admittedly, but still gives a good idea of the structure of the exercise.

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