No mention of an AP fix in the next patch - Unacceptable

[Tom_L 558]

16 hours ago, Dillon said:

we need to take a stand here.

First of all - I feel with you. I was sceptical about MSFS, had issues with installation and struggled with the UI that I found anything but intuitive. Three days later I had 90% of the functionality I was used to in P3D restored - without any addon - and started to enjoy weather and scenery. After another few days I noticed the well known bugs and limitations of the sim and started „zendesking“ eagerly, driven by the desire to get the best and most complete sim I ever had, immediately!

Well, then came 1.8.3.0, 1.9.3.0 - you know what happened. And RSR over at PMDG announced a 1-year delay for the 737NG.

And I realized, that I will have to wait longer than anticipated for the sim that I felt was promised to me.

It’s just what it is. 200 developers, just working to fulfil my wishes? No! 200 developers, divided into teams, dealing with small portions of a very complex simulation. Autopilot issues, Lightning in clear skies, Garmin deficits,Turboprop logic and more - all duly noted and scheduled, to our liking or not. But there are other issues not mentioned: Two photosceneries in relative vicinity to each other lead to the sim not loading, Navaids are missing in 3rd party scenery and many more. 3rd party developers - not unimportant for MS/ASOBO and us - have requests and requirements that need to be taken care of, without the community taking notice.

So yes, I am disappointed! MS/ASOBO have their share in that because I feel they promised me something that wasn’t there - yet!

But I still have an inkling that behind all of that marketing stuff (yes MS/ASOBO, I realize that!) there’s an honest will to deliver.

And what’s the alternative? Back to P3D? Well, I recently installed the P3D-scenery of my home airport. And despite it being extraordinary well modelled, I spent several hours of troubleshooting because I thought my autogen of the surrounding Orbx region was flawed by the installation. No, it wasn‘t. It just looks so bad, compared to MSFS (base) scenery.

Conclusion: I appreciate your effort concerning the autopilot issues and will upvote for sure. But on the other hand I would like to give you an advice: keep calm. The history of MS Flightsimulator shows a lot of failure and success: while FS4 was a widely respected and stable platform, FS95 - it successor - was not. And FSX became really usable only after service pack 1, nearly half a year after release. So we are pretty much on schedule. Just kidding 🙂

[KenG 492]

34 minutes ago, JRBarrett said:

I’ve never flown the Longitude either pre or post patch, and if the problem was specific only to that model, I would suspect that it is an error in the flight dynamics of that one aircraft...

...The Longitude, from what I have read, has always had a very poor flight model, and very poor system functionality. The TBM, by contrast has been noted as being one of the more stable and reliable aircraft in the current MSFS fleet. I have certainly found that to be the case. If an aircraft that has consistently performed well in the past suddenly manifests a bug after a new patch for some users, then those having the problem need to submit a report to Zendesk, with as much detail as possible, and focusing on an aircraft that worked well previously.

It is not just the Longitude, but most of the Deluxe and Premium edition aircraft. I bought the premium edition at a highly inflated premium price specifically for the Longitude. To discover that it is the worse modeled aircraft in their fleet and they have no plans to work on it until after patch 8 is unacceptable. 

I understand that it is not game crashing and thus not a priority for Asobo, but that still does not help that the DLC was broken when shipped. Then to find out they locked down the Longitude so no one can fix the issues such as 10,000 pounds less fuel is mind blowing. This would be a simple .cfg file fix in the non-premium aircraft. I am very frustrated.

At this point I have set aside MSFS until they fix the major avionics and aircraft issues. There is no use playing a game that is frustrating. The game should have been marketed as early release or pre release and the DLC held off until they got it right. This release is as bad as FSFW95. 

I know complaining about MSFS on AVSIM is like going to a political rally to complain about the politician holding the rally.

[Dillon 2,198]

2 hours ago, JRBarrett said:

It may not be an easy fix because it does not affect all users. I have had zero issues with the autopilot in the TBM since the patch came out. It operates no differently after patch 3 than it did in patch 2. I have tried to deliberately provoke the “dolphin dance” by climbing at various airspeeds in both IAS and VS modes to capture altitudes at both low and high levels, and it works correctly every time - captures smoothly and holds selected altitude with no vertical oscillations.

Here's proof it happens in the TBM:

 

[HiFlyer 9,372]

1 minute ago, Dillon said:

Here's proof it happens in the TBM:

That would still only be proof that it happens to some people. Now Asobo has the task of reproducing it reliably, finding the different (or single) issue(s) and creating a hopefully universal fix, while not accidently breaking anything else.

All while people are yelling at them to go faster.

When Asobo itself have concluded that going too fast and trying to do too much at once was part of the problem.

[andyjohnston.net 617]

1 hour ago, Tom_L said:

 FS4 was a widely respected and stable platform, FS95 - it successor - was not. 

Err...there was an FS-5, which was then followed by FS-5.1 (the first version I had) before FS95.

[Tom_L 558]

21 minutes ago, andyjohnston.net said:

there was an FS-5

Don't remember, googled it - and you're right. I had it for sure, but I can't remember as well as the awful performance and graphics of FS95.

[odourboy 1,290]

Not my video, but another example. I've experienced far worse in the Longitude.

 

[ryanbatc 13,022]

17 hours ago, bean_sprout said:

Garmin is going to be doing the Garmin code so give them time to get ramped up.  

Push all you want but it won't speed up the process.

 

Regards

bs

What?  Garmin is actually doing something in this sim?

[RobJC 2,073]

Lets see what really comes in the next patch before we jump to conclusions. The comment about a contract team building this and then leaving is baseless. 

[JRBarrett 3,121]

1 hour ago, Dillon said:

Here's proof it happens in the TBM:

 

I have absolutely no doubt it does, but not for all users. The video is amusing, but absolutely useless for any kind of troubleshooting on Asobo’s part.

That is the entire point of my original response to you. Some users have this issue in the TBM every single time - some do not. I am in the latter category. I absolutely cannot provoke the pitch oscillation in the TBM no matter what I do. Climbing at low airspeed or high, IAS mode or VS mode, low altitude or high altitude, it is rock-solid in climb, and 100 percent smooth in capturing and maintaining a selected altitude.

But just because it does not happen to me does not mean there is not a problem, as the video demonstrates.

The fact that many users who never had this problem with the TBM now do, clearly indicates that “something” got broken in the patch. A bug that affects 100 percent of users 100 percent of the time is (generally) relatively easy to find and fix. A bug that affects some (but not all) users can be far more difficult to pin down. That is why it is essential for anyone who does have the problem to file a detailed Zendesk report. 

Edited October 10, 2020 by JRBarrett

[Flyfaster_MTN002 412]

1 hour ago, HiFlyer said:

That would still only be proof that it happens to some people. Now Asobo has the task of reproducing it reliably, finding the different (or single) issue(s) and creating a hopefully universal fix, while not accidently breaking anything else.

All while people are yelling at them to go faster.

When Asobo itself have concluded that going too fast and trying to do too much at once was part of the problem.

Nobody is asking them to go faster (despite my screen name). They ARE however asking them to address this issue and prioritize it (and others). The point is many are not even listed as issues, and critical issues that are, show on their list with no status or acknowledgement the of the issue.

Edited October 10, 2020 by Flyfaster

[tweekz 2,165]

17 hours ago, bean_sprout said:

Garmin is going to be doing the Garmin code so give them time to get ramped up. 

Really? I must've missed that one. That'd be awesome.

[leprechaunlive 1,861]

5 minutes ago, Flyfaster said:

Nobody is asking them to go faster (despite my screen name). They ARE however asking them to address this issue and prioritize it (and others). The point is many are not even listed as issues, and critical issues that are, show *not started*.

Hmmm. If its expexted for patch 9, and you ask want it on patch 4, then yes, your asking them to go faster.... 

[n4gix 4,955]

19 minutes ago, JRBarrett said:

I absolutely cannot provoke the pitch oscillation in the TBM no matter what I do. Climbing at low airspeed or high, IAS mode or VS mode, low altitude or high altitude, it is rock-solid in climb, and 100 percent smooth in capturing and maintaining a selected altitude.

Have you tried FLC mode? In the other video clip a few posts up, the St. Vitus Dance is clearly shown to occur when FLC mode is selected. Switching to VS mode, the phugoid oscillation stops completely.

[JRBarrett 3,121]

Just now, n4gix said:

Have you tried FLC mode? In the other video clip a few posts up, the St. Vitus Dance is clearly shown to be when FLC mode is selected. Switching to VS mode, the phugoid oscillation stops completely.

Yes. I normally climb in FLC (IAS) mode. I have tried low speed / high angle climbs, and high speed / low angle climbs (with a constant power setting) I have tried it with and without Live Weather. No matter what I do, I cannot get this particular bug to manifest. The TBM autopilot in patch 3 behaves no differently than it did in patch 2 on my particular MSFS installation.