Asobo/MSFS need to fix the code base…

[Ricardo41 5,949]

I have been running intel(processor/AMD (GPU) combos for years without any issues. 

[RobJC 2,069]

Can the mods change the title of this thread to “Is AMD recommended for MSFS?” 

 

[Funky D 271]

Personally, I will never again go AMD after being burned by driver and hardware issues in the (distant) past, BUT...

...to be fair, Nvidia cards have had their fair share of issues, mostly due to board partners cutting corners to try and meet MSRP targets, and Intel has been hit by every speculative execution exploit under the sun and the patches have neutered performance. I will say that MSFS does a poor job at recovering from hardware issues... for the longest time MSFS crashed when a controller disconnected.

[Glenn Fitzpatrick 3,798]

From my workplace point of view where we buy 50 to 100 new PCs and laptops a year,  AMD GPUs over the past 10 or so years have consistently about two or three times the driver issues and weird problems as Intel GPUs.

They are all solvable but in the workplace where tech time is money and if a server is down for a few hours potentially big money, we have a distinct tendency to preference Nvidia . AMD have a real issue getting enterprise to be satisfied they are now stable in the workplace as claims that AMD are now stable have been wrong before.

HOWEVER - for home/gaming use is that a big issue if the equivalent AMD GPU is cheaper and more available ?   Probably not, as if you are unfortunate enough to get a driver issue its just a matter of sitting down over the weekend doing a bit of google research and getting it sorted out.

Edited September 20, 2021 by Glenn Fitzpatrick

[NZ255 309]

if (crash()) { dontCrash(); }

[simon747 185]

Been ok with me.  Steady performance with the latest updates and no CTD's.  Just need some more planes.  The G36 is awesome and the Caravan has been great too! 

[HighTowers 1,434]

Amd vs Nvidia debate is not the solution. I have Nvidia but AMD are very good respectable cards today.   Usage is way up and people are happy overall.   A bad card can happen as it does with Nvidia cards.  

The partial solution to CTDs is to push for an actual meaningful error tracking log that we can read and makes sense of.  Something that gives real clues as to what caused recent CTD. Many simulation games have these internal logs running including XP and some other big name sim titles.   I dont understand why this hasnt been implemented yet.  Because the windows error reporting system is completely vague and useless. 

[bobcat999 8,483]

I have used AMD CPU's and GPU's, and Intel CPU's and Nvidia GPU's.  They are all as good (or bad) as each other, so I am not partisan about any of them; it is a pointless argument.  
Whichever brand you chose, they all serve 99.9% of people well for the majority of the time.

In any case, this wasn't the discussion the OP intended to raise.
MSFS is probably the best all round fight simulator we have ever had.  When it holds together and Asobo fix the regressions, it can be absolutely awe inspiring.

However, I use a lot of software, and plenty of different game titles, some of them quite demanding. 
MSFS is the only one that gives me problems, and it isn't down to GPU or CPU usage or overheating.

Sometimes I have traced a CTD to an addon (the last one was the G1000NXi before it was updated), but with MSFS, I have never know an application that is so temperamental or fragile.

People blame items in the Community folder, BUT ASOBO PUT IT THERE FOR THIS EXACT PURPOSE!   It shouldn't keep dropping you out to desktop due to what is mainly bitmaps or text files in the community folder for heavens sake.  

If people can't see that the Community folder issue, constant code regressions, convoluted update process, SDK development rate, and general program stability are slightly out of whack, then I don't know what to say.

A point people are missing is that things have been stable at times, then after an update, people start getting CTD's - for the amount of people involved, it isn't suddenly their CPU's or GPU's. So, in case anyone is in doubt, I agree with RobJC on this.

Edited September 20, 2021 by bobcat999

[Dominique_K 10,149]

I don’t suffer from CTD and have no training in coding so I have all the qualifications to give an uninformed opinion. I will not miss the chance.

If the CTD seem not exclusively but massively caused by addons rather the base code it is alto obvious that the users of MFS predecessors (P3D, FSX and before) didn’t suffer from this. It seems that MFS is unable to recognize an incompatibility and react otherwise than crashing. It is weird that liveries or buildings can crash the sim instead of MFS just displaying a blank livery or  no building or strange artifacts and still running.

Another mystery is why the code is unable to pinpoint the cause of the crash ? 

 

[Dominique_K 10,149]

10 minutes ago, bobcat999 said:

 

A point people are missing is that things have been stable at times, then after an update, people start getting CTD's - for the amount of people involved, it isn't suddenly their CPU's or GPU's. So, in case anyone is in doubt, I agree with RobJC on this.

The stability curve brutally deteriorating after a release to improve gradually when addons are progressively adapted is the sign that the code was not designed to incorporate and manage addons in the simulation...

[virtuali 4,421]

2 hours ago, HighTowers said:

Amd vs Nvidia debate is not the solution. I have Nvidia but AMD are very good respectable cards today.   Usage is way up and people are happy overall.   A bad card can happen as it does with Nvidia cards.  

I suspect AMD is getting a bit of traction lately because:

- While their street prices ARE inflated compared to MSRP, they are LESS inflated than NVidia, which are ridiculous. When a video card costs almost the same of a gaming laptop that comes with the mobile version of the same card, something's clearly wrong...

- AMD being the underdog, they are playing the "customer friendly" part, trying to paint NVidia as the bad guy, so they opened-sourced FSR and made it work their older cards and even NVidia cards, while Nvidia restricted DLSS to only their latest models. Or, when NVidia released the LHR with limited hash-rate, AMD said they would never limit their cards. So, that's "operation good feeling", trying to win back gamers because they are in 2nd place.

- Also, AMD cards seems to be a bit (not much, but still...) easier to find, hence their prices are a bit more reasonable, making them a better value, if you could call "better value" the current situation of being happy of having to pay "only" 150% of MSRP...

[John Fields 279]

13 hours ago, RobJC said:

I have been a pretty big advocate for MSFS because i can clearly see the potential for this platform. But here we are a year out still fighting crashes, and serious bugs. Regarding crashes, half the flights i have attempted have ended in CTDs, and i no longer use my CH Yoke, TrackIR, add-ons, overclocking, config tweaks, NVIDIA Inspector, etc. I really can’t go any more “stock” than i am now, and i am still getting crashes. Throw in the update issues that many users are experiencing (it is 2021!) and i think it is time for Asobo and the MSFS team to rethink how the code base is being managed. The uncertainty of MSFS between updates is really hurting the franchise, tbh. 

The first thing i would do is analyze each bug to figure out how not to repeat it. Was the bug a regression that was fixed and then broken again? If so, why? Is there a problem merging branches? Are changes being hammered because someone committed a change without merging their changes first? Something related to the process of developing and managing this code base has gone wrong.  Best practices are not being followed. Lessons are not being learned. And a lot of MSFS customers are paying for it. 

The issues here go far beyond needing more testers, or having a larger/longer beta test. There are fundamental problems with how the code base is being managed. 

The technology looks great. Super smooth performance. But what difference does it make if half the flights end in crashes? 

I think you're absolutely right, RobJC.

Thanks for your thoughts!

I wish Asobo or Microsoft take them into consideration.

Best regards.

[Christopher Low 5,353]

2 hours ago, Dominique_K said:

I don’t suffer from CTD and have no training in coding so I have all the qualifications to give an uninformed opinion. I will not miss the chance.

I had to like your comment for this line alone

[tweekz 2,165]

14 hours ago, captain420 said:

This is why I'm glad I went with an intel/NVIDIA setup for my most current build. I was so close at building an an all AMD system because of people telling me to go with AMD because it's better and all that noise. So glad I stuck with my instincts.

Intel/AMD here - no problems.

[overspeed3 410]

This has evolved into just another Forever War in the PC world...