BTW, I find this way harder to do in a desktop sim than it was IRL. In an aircraft, one gets lateral acceleration information both from the vestibular system as well as, quite literally, the seat of your pants. Similarly, I don't have room to install reasonable rudders, so I use the rotation axis of a Thrustmaster 16000. That's fine for brief rudder excursions, but since there's no real feedback other than the position of my wrist, it really doesn't work all that well for precision work. In addition to all that, the feedback provided to rudders in a desktop sim doesn't take into account the aerodynamic forces on the control surface, so that makes it even harder. 

To put it another way, any landing I can walk away from in MSFS, P3D, XP, what have you is a good one. If it was good enough IRL, it'll be OK here, too.

4 hours ago, Bobsk8 said:

When I had a really strong crosswind, I would move my aiming point to the upwind side of the centerline, to give me a bit more wiggle room in case I started to drift during the flare, and couldn't correct it with the ailerons. I would also try and touchdown with the upwind main gear first. 

It is not that the crosswinds or turbulence are out of place.  They clearly belong. The rate of incidence of them, the narrow altitude band in which they are currently occuring, and the over exagerated effects are the issues.  Much like what previously happended with thunder and lightening and icing, it is not the elements that are out of place.  It is the frequency vs reported conditions and the severity that are in question.  Overcooked.  No need to eliminate.  Much to the contrary. Need to find a more realistic level.

Well, I must respectfully disagree with most respondents on this thread.   Aboso got the winds PEFECT this time around.   If any are having difficulty landing in a crosswind, likely they are inexperienced and using the wrong technique.   I'm to understand that Aboso literally spend an entire year modifying code to facilitate the new wind gusts, and worked closely with some of the world's leading meteorology authorities to absolutely perfect the wind we are seeing in MSFS2020 since the release of SU10. 

Asobo further initiated a massive beta testing campaign that spanned most of this year just to make sure the new winds were free of any anomalies.   

 

Edited October 6, 20223 yr by hobart escin

11 minutes ago, hobart escin said:

Well, I must respectfully disagree with most respondents on this thread.   Aboso got the winds PEFECT this time around.   If any are having difficulty landing in a crosswind, likely they are inexperienced and using the wrong technique.   I'm to understand that Aboso literally spend an entire year modifying code to facilitate the new wind gusts, and worked closely with some of the world's leading meteorology authorities to absolutely perfect the wind we are seeing in MSFS2020 since the release of SU10. 

Asobo further initiated a massive beta testing campaign that spanned most of this year just to make sure the new winds were free of any anomalies.   

Have you tried defragmenting your hard drive with the latest video drivers from Nvidia?  

The troll is back.

11 minutes ago, Alvega said:

The troll is back.

Wow.  Ummm, you really seem to hate Asobo?   Maybe if you'd take the time to really learn the aircraft you fly in the simulator, it would work out for you.  

9 hours ago, RandallR said:

Just before touch-down go to forward-slip (rudder the nose to the center-line and drop the windward wing)

Just as an aside, I would call this a side slip (body of the a/c aligned with the ground track).  In a forward slip, the body (nose) of the a/c is canted to the side wrt the ground track. Typically the goal of the forward slip is to increase drag (and thus descent rate) by presenting more of the side of the a/c to the direction of flight.  In both cases you are using crossed controls. At least that is the way I was taught, but admittedly it has been "more than a few years"!  

🤔

Al

Edited October 6, 20223 yr by ark

10 hours ago, wiggum said:

the second i touch down there is a violent jerk into the wind which can only be controled (barely) by full opposite rudder. 

Just to be clear.

• In a real aircraft there is NO tendency to weathervane into the wind while you are still airborne - you just tend to drift downwind basically pointing the same way you always did but get blown off course gradually, any unexpected yaw that does occur will be a result of adverse yaw from you correcting with aileron, not the wind itself.
• This changes the instant your wheels touch the runway, in a real aircraft any crosswind acting on the tail surface WILL cause your aircraft to pivot into the wind around the point the wheels touch. The bigger the tail surface the more pronounced this effect will be.

Sooo ... TLDR -  suddenly weather vaning into the wind once the wheels touch is working entirely as expected. 

NOW whether currently "in game" this effect is a bit overdone is a different question altogether. The weather vane effect may be too extreme and need toning down. 

  

31 minutes ago, ark said:

I would call this a side slip (body of the a/c aligned with the ground track).   🤔

Al

 

Yeah agreed, as far as I understand the definitions you:

• forward slip down final  with the nose pointed into the wind, mainly to lose speed
• and then side slip the very last bit by straightening the nose to align with the runway.

Something like that, I always found the terminology confusing to be honest.

 

Edited October 6, 20223 yr by Glenn Fitzpatrick

34 minutes ago, Glenn Fitzpatrick said:

Just to be clear.

• In a real aircraft there is NO tendency to weathervane into the wind while you are still airborne - you just tend to drift downwind basically pointing the same way you always did but get blown off course gradually, any unexpected yaw that does occur will be a result of adverse yaw from you correcting with aileron, not the wind itself.
• This changes the instant your wheels touch the runway, in a real aircraft any crosswind acting on the tail surface WILL cause your aircraft to pivot into the wind around the point the wheels touch. The bigger the tail surface the more pronounced this effect will be.

Sooo ... TLDR -  suddenly weather vaning into the wind once the wheels touch is working entirely as expected. 

NOW whether currently "in game" this effect is a bit overdone is a different question altogether. The weather vane effect may be too extreme and need toning down. 

  

 

Yeah agreed, as far as I understand the definitions you:

• forward slip down final  with the nose pointed into the wind
• and then side slip the very last bit by straightening the nose to align with the runway.

I always found the terminology confusing to be honest.

 

You can crab down final, which doesn't require a slip, and then go into a side slip to align the landing gear with the runway heading. Even in a no wind condition, you might use a forward slip on final to increase descent rate without increasing ground speed. That technique is probably not used much these days since most a/c have flaps, speed brakes, etc that "get the job done".

I do agree the slip terminology can be confusing.

Al

Edited October 6, 20223 yr by ark

3 hours ago, Glenn Fitzpatrick said:

NOW whether currently "in game" this effect is a bit overdone is a different question altogether. The weather vane effect may be too extreme and need toning down. 

Perhaps. The Vertigo was recently updated to include "Full CFD, including CFD ground effect". I was flying in winds around 10kts IIRC, and the aircraft was constantly shifting around it's yaw axis, side to side. It's interesting what you mention: 

3 hours ago, Glenn Fitzpatrick said:

In a real aircraft there is NO tendency to weathervane into the wind while you are still airborne

So clearly something awkward was happening here. 

14 hours ago, TrafficPilot said:

You're at the runway threshold at 90 knots in which aircraft?

You have read the POH for the Cessna Caravan haven't you? 

If not your answer lies there.

Hint: vREF 🙂

A bit fast i guess?

Should be more like  75-85 KIAS with full flaps?

14 hours ago, jrw4 said:

BTW, I find this way harder to do in a desktop sim than it was IRL. In an aircraft, one gets lateral acceleration information both from the vestibular system as well as, quite literally, the seat of your pants. Similarly, I don't have room to install reasonable rudders, so I use the rotation axis of a Thrustmaster 16000. That's fine for brief rudder excursions, but since there's no real feedback other than the position of my wrist, it really doesn't work all that well for precision work. In addition to all that, the feedback provided to rudders in a desktop sim doesn't take into account the aerodynamic forces on the control surface, so that makes it even harder. 

To put it another way, any landing I can walk away from in MSFS, P3D, XP, what have you is a good one. If it was good enough IRL, it'll be OK here, too.

I tried the twist grip rudder control when my CH Pedals malfunctioned a few years ago, and found it impossible to do a good job controlling the aircraft, especially on landing in a crosswind. Couldn't wait to set up my new rudder pedals. 

8 hours ago, Glenn Fitzpatrick said:

Just to be clear.

• In a real aircraft there is NO tendency to weathervane into the wind while you are still airborne

 

 

Sorry that's wrong, the aircraft always weathervanes into wind or airflow which is the same thing.

If it didnt it would be considered to be lacking in directional stability and would be extremely tiring to fly

Just to make it easier to understand, if you fly with a constant  20 knot wind at 90 degrees to your flight path and feet off the rudder take a look at the slip ball, it will be in the same place as it would be with no wind.

What would be true to state is that when at cruise speed the airflow component derived from the wind is a smaller proportion of the resultant total airflow velocity the aircraft is experiencing than it is at approach speed, this reduces the into wind angle that the the aircraft weathervanes into compared to its track, but it always wearhervanes into the resultant airflow till its pointing straight into it

Cessna 172 Landing in 33Kt Crosswind - YouTube

5 minutes ago, jcomm said:

Cessna 172 Landing in 33Kt Crosswind - YouTube

Misleading title, which was posted on another thread. The wind was gusting as high as 33 Knots but when he landed , looked more like it was around 15 knots. Much more than that, the rudder in a 172 wouldn't be able to hold the centerline straight.