Here with the 13900 / 4090 front view server and 8700 / 3090 left view client over Istanbul ( 15.5 million people )…

 

On 11/6/2022 at 7:29 AM, GSalden said:

Myself, I use Intel CPU’s and NVidia GPU’s….

Gerard, what kind of Core temps are you seeing with your 13900?

Just switched from my 10700K to a 13600K (quick 5.4 all P-Core OC) over the weekend and saw noticeable improvement. 3440x1440 everything ultra, TAA, 200 TLOD and with the PMDG on the ground at Verticalsim's KBOI I gained ~10FPS (about 58FPS now) and my lows are much improved so the head panning with my Tobii is fantastic. I was hesitant to upgrade but the CPU was $30 off and I got a steal on a good Z690 MB. After selling my old MB and 10700K I was less than $200 out of pocket. 

Edited November 7, 20223 yr by vrdubin6
Spelling error

18 minutes ago, Noel said:

Gerard, what kind of Core temps are you seeing with your 13900?

35-63 degrees Celsius , but I am using a EKBW push/pull liquied  cooling system 

1 minute ago, GSalden said:

35-63 degrees Celsius

Thanks Gerard.  I'm referring to when using MSFS only, not 'stressing' software routines.  Are you seeing 63C in MSFS? 

2 hours ago, altenae said:

So you expect the 5800X3D to be more smooth then for example a I7-13700K because of the lower cache ?

Not at all, because the way the CPU and memory process data to the GPU is based on speed and cache, rather than just cache.
It is more likely to be very close on the low-end, so close you cannot tell, and it would likely vary depending on your settings.

The fact that the Intel has significantly more raw power on a per core basis, as well as wins in most other games, that generally indicates that future optimizations in drivers and in the game itself, are likely to favor the Intel over the AMD. So in that sense, the Intel is the better buy for future versions of MSFS in all probability, regardless of how they currently stack. Extra cache is really just a filler for unoptimized algorithms in code, that is why the best optimized games have the Intel farther ahead of the AMD than games with lesser optimization. Of course, it can work both ways, it's possible in some scenarios that a game is optimized in a way that gives the Intel a temporary benefit, and the next optimizations will favor the AMD (but when betting on it, always pick the CPU with more raw power, or in this case - the Intel).

 

Edited November 7, 20223 yr by Alpine Scenery

1 hour ago, Noel said:

Thanks Gerard.  I'm referring to when using MSFS only, not 'stressing' software routines.  Are you seeing 63C in MSFS? 

When at Schiphol with lots of AI and bad weather some cores go up to 60-63

48 minutes ago, GSalden said:

When at Schiphol with lots of AI and bad weather some cores go up to 60-63

Wow, that's getting up there considering the awesome cooling solution!  I wonder how AMD 7900x3D will run...

So I have just started on my new build for Flight Sim/Sim Racing (MSFS and basically every major Sim Racing Title.) and I am just as torn as many of you sound like.

I had 'Frankensteined' my old Sandybridge 2600 into a new case with a 1080 and have been surprisingly getting great performance in MSFS on Low Settings even on VR. However, the time has come to finally do this after 11 years.

So I recently snagged a 13700k on sale at Microcenter (locally here in NYC) for $399 but I am still having second doubts if I made the right decision as I feel for MSFS alone, it probably isn't the best CPU nor even the 2nd best.

My thinking of going with the I-7 Raptor Lake chip is because, of the higher heat/power requirement for the I9 13900k and my reluctance in investing in a CPU (Ryzen 5800X 3D) that in reality is an old (2 year old) processor that has been sort of resto-modded with a giant dose of L3 Cache (3 times the amount over anything else at 92mb's) but that is benefitting MSFS in particular.

From doing the research, I see that the new Raptor Lake Chips are superior over the 3D in almost everything else other then MSFS and Red Dead Redemption. However, the gains that I see for the 3D in relation to the Raptor Lake chips on MSFS seem like they are wider - the lower the resolution. So I am thinking that this is a by product of the extra Cache where it is making a bigger difference on lower resolutions but the performance margin is most likely narrower in applications where I would more realistically be using MSFS at either 1440p or at 3.5k in VR..

Also, I went with the i7  over the i5 and the i9 since the tests between the i9 and i5 were so close that I felt that going with that CPU in the middle would give me good performance but minus the aformentioned heat/power hunger of the i9 and I saved a few bucks ($180.)

Microcenter has a 2 week return policy and I have about 2 days left to make this decision.

Do I return and go with a proven cpu but with old 2 years old technology that is going to surely give me the best performance on a program that I will be using for approximately 50% of my PC time or go with the newer technology cpu that will be a little weaker in using that same program for 50% of my game/Sim time but then perhaps suffer a little more with everything else?

Edit: Meant to say: Gain a little with everything else.

Oh, and did I mention that, Microcenter just announced a new combo sale on a 12900k with an Asus TUF MoBo for $350 in total? That has been bugging me a little too 😄.

 

Edited November 7, 20223 yr by mooneyrob

34 minutes ago, mooneyrob said:

So I have just started on my new build for Flight Sim/Sim Racing (MSFS and basically every major Sim Racing Title.) and I am just as torn as many of you sound like.

I had 'Frankensteined' my old Sandybridge 2600 into a new case with a 1080 and have been surprisingly getting great performance in MSFS on Low Settings even on VR. However, the time has come to finally do this after 11 years.

So I recently snagged a 13700k on sale at Microcenter (locally here in NYC) for $399 but I am still having second doubts if I made the right decision as I feel for MSFS alone, it probably isn't the best CPU nor even the 2nd best.

 

My thinking of going with the I-7 Raptor Lake chip is because, of the higher heat/power requirement for the I9 13900k and my reluctance in investing in a CPU (Ryzen 5800X 3D) that in reality is an old (2 year old) processor that has been sort of resto-modded with a giant dose of L3 Cache (3 times the amount over anything else at 92mb's) but that is benefitting MSFS in particular.

From doing the research, I see that the new Raptor Lake Chips are superior over the 3D in almost everything else other then MSFS and Red Dead Redemption. However, the gains that I see for the 3D in relation to the Raptor Lake chips on MSFS seem like they are wider - the lower the resolution. So I am thinking that this is a by product of the extra Cache where it is making a bigger difference on lower resolutions but the performance margin is most likely narrower in applications where I would more realistically be using MSFS at either 1440p or at 3.5k in VR..

Also, I went with the i7  over the i5 and the i9 since the tests between the i9 and i5 were so close that I felt that going with that CPU in the middle would give me good performance but minus the aformentioned heat/power hunger of the i9 and I saved a few bucks ($180.)

Microcenter has a 2 week return policy and I have about 2 days left to make this decision.

 

Do I return and go with a proven cpu but with old 2 years old technology that is going to surely give me the best performance on a program that I will be using for approximately 50% of my PC time or go with the newer technology cpu that will be a little weaker in using that same program for 50% of my game/Sim time but then perhaps suffer a little more with everything else?

Oh, and did I mention that, Microcenter just announced a new combo sale on a 12900k with an Asus TUF MoBo for $350 in total? That has been bugging me a little too 😄.

 

So how do you know the 5800X3D will be better ?
I also read about second thoughts after using the 5800X3D.
Maybe we want new cpu's to do the magic trick and the reality is otherwise 

A let's be honest with not gaming use the performance of the I7-13700K is not a little more but extreme more.

Are there other FS2020 users who upgraded to the I7-13700K and are also disappointed ?

Edited November 7, 20223 yr by altenae

I'm looking at single-threaded performance which I still have no reason to believe isn't the Achille's Heel of all CPU's for MSFS.  When I look at 13,900K versus my now 3 y/o [email protected] single threaded performance on PassMark's site it's only 15% faster which is just flat out not enough to bother upgrading to.  There must be other factors to consider but this may explain why I hear stories all the time here about stutters upon arrivals w/ tamed T-LOD.  I'm talking about PMDG planes and complex arrival airports, traffic, seasons.  I had originally figured the increase would be around 35% which would absolutely justify the upgrade.  I assume these values on PassMark are reflecting turbo frequencies and they give 13,900K 5.8gHz in its perf cores.  So I used their stated PM score v my CPU overclocked to 5.0gHz.  

Here is a nice upgrade report (I7-10700K to a 5800X3D)
I wish there was one like this report for I7-10700K to a I7-13700K 😉

https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/upgrade-report-10900k-to-5800x3d/546194

Well, I should hopefully have my new 13900K cpu later this week. The estimated Amazon delivery date is 8-9 November. Once I have it installed and done a few flights, I will post my MSFS temps here. Right now with my 12900K running at 5.3 Ghz, my temps are holding around 36 degrees C. And those temps are from my current flight in the Fenix A320 flying from EGAA into EGLL with FSLTL AI traffic and MSFS Live Weather. 

4 minutes ago, sniper31 said:

Well, I should hopefully have my new 13900K cpu later this week. The estimated Amazon delivery date is 8-9 November. Once I have it installed and done a few flights, I will post my MSFS temps here. Right now with my 12900K running at 5.3 Ghz, my temps are holding around 36 degrees C. And those temps are from my current flight in the Fenix A320 flying from EGAA into EGLL with FSLTL AI traffic and MSFS Live Weather. 

Which cpu cooler do.you use?

Just now, altenae said:

Which cpu cooler do.you use?

I use an Artic Liquid Freezer II 420mm AIO cooler. BUT, it's not just a good cooler that helps keep my temps down. I focus very hard on cooling for my PC builds. So, that means a case with exceptional airflow, some good case fans with a proper push and pull setup for great airflow and balanced air pressurization. The cooler is just one important cog in the whole cooling machine when you start to run high end CPU's and GPU's. Often times, PC builders don't focus enough on the case and fan setup. When budgeting a PC build, the case and fans are an afterthought or way down the priority list for many users/builders. For my builds, case and fans are at the top of my build list.