Another lump of coal: PMDG Update [24DEC22]

[Stearmandriver 2,304]

6 hours ago, bendead said:

Loading fuel, passengers, controlling pushback via the FMS, is that really better? 

Is it really worse?  No.  It's exactly the same thing.

You're interacting with a rectangular shaped portion of your computer screen, to click through menus.  Whether the frame of this portion of your screen is designed to look like a CDU vs an ipad has no effect on its functionally at all.  It's still just a rectangular portion of your computer screen.

Navigraph (and similar) solutions don't require alt-tabbing, not that that's any different than using your mouse to click on a different portion of your screen to pop up a display that's designed to look like an ipad.

Now a built in perf calculator somewhere would be nice; it doesn't effect me much because I know the airplane and can easily figure a ballpark perf data solution for a given takeoff or landing, but I see why most folks would want this.  But what kind of interface it's built into... Just doesn't matter.  In the end, it's just a portion of your display.

Obviously people want it and so I hope they get it eventually, but I really can't see prioritizing it over actual functionality of the simulated aircraft.  There really isn't anything an EFB can do that can't already be done.

[pete_auau 1,163]

9 hours ago, Christopher Low said:

Robert provides relatively frequent and detailed updates on the PMDG forum, and then gets hammered for writing a wall of text! The guy can't win with some of you.

just imagine  if  he  didn't  post  any updates

[Bdub22 1,612]

Of course, this PMDG update post is all over the place, with some saying that an EFB is pointless to others saying that can't fly without one. There have been some good points made that I agree with, especially with some saying that PMDG has essentially just been re-releasing the same planes for almost a decade now, without innovating much. I think anyone would be hard-pressed to make an argument against that. It's been years and they still can't even show a preview of the EFB. Other payware and freeware developers most of us love have been able to produce absolutely stellar EFB's. It's my opinion that PMDG is no longer as prestigious as they once were, and I've been a customer since 2002. They simply just stopped innovating like they used to. I know they are simply not porting over previous planes, but lets stop kidding ourselves, because thats exactly what they're doing. If someone can tell me one thing PMDG has introduced and/or innovated that is new and exciting in the last 5 years, I'd love to hear about it. They're stale. And I hope all the rising new talent in the 3PD industry lights a fire under them, because they desperately need it. 

[Fiorentoni 4,253]

Not sure why people are trying to convince others that wanting an EFB is wrong because airplanes in the past flew without EFBs. What kind of argument is that? I mean it‘s not even about that, PMDG said there will be an EFB when they released the 737 (and made it sound like it was a month or two away…), so all people ask for is what they paid for! So it‘s completely irrelevant what is *needed* for flight simming properly or not. If PMDG said they‘ll include a pink elephant on the FO‘s seat, people would have every right to expect (and demand) that 9 months after release.

[MikeH99 156]

23 hours ago, wiler said:

no EFB yet... surprise... Bascially Randozzo got your money now so you can wait for a looong time. 

Not mine still haven't used my free credit. I'm waiting patiently for the 777 A310 doing well in the long haul space.

[MikeH99 156]

41 minutes ago, Fiorentoni said:

Not sure why people are trying to convince others that wanting an EFB is wrong because airplanes in the past flew without EFBs

EFB is minimum equipment now. If you don't have it your plane ain't complete sorry.

[Fiorentoni 4,253]

1 hour ago, MikeH99 said:

EFB is minimum equipment now. If you don't have it your plane ain't complete sorry.

Either you misunderstood or I misunderstand but I fail to see how that is an answer to my post…?

[JBDB-MD80 1,473]

PMDG apologist stop making excuses for them and demand them to deliver something they promised months ago. I have the 736 don't fly it anymore in favor of the MD82 because even with a more complex aircraft I can move around better with a flight tablet.

This nonsense of about the past (not tablet) makes no sense anymore. Its Almost 2023 No airliner (credible) flies without it anymore.

 

Edited December 25, 2022 by jbdbow1970

[Farlis 2,288]

3 hours ago, Fiorentoni said:

I mean it‘s not even about that, PMDG said there will be an EFB when they released the 737 (and made it sound like it was a month or two away…),

And that is the real issue here, I agree.

It won't come to what happened with the Digital Aviation Fokker 100 back in FSX days which was released with 2D Panels only and the developer promised a Virtual Cockpit later and never delivered one. But it is definately similar behaviour.

But also nothing new from PMDG. Does anyone here remember if they ever managed to relase something without overshooting an estimated given deadline they gave by at least 3 months? On average Robert's estimates are always about 6 to 9 Months short of actual relase. It has always been this way.

[bhx22 40]

Does MSFS really need every flavour of the 737 family? I think the 737-800 would have been fine and then put all resources into the 777 just my opinion.

Not knocking PMDG fantastic products.

[Dominique_K 10,150]

4 hours ago, Fiorentoni said:

Not sure why people are trying to convince others that wanting an EFB is wrong because airplanes in the past flew without EFBs. What kind of argument is that? I mean it‘s not even about that, PMDG said there will be an EFB when they released the 737 (and made it sound like it was a month or two away…), so all people ask for is what they paid for! So it‘s completely irrelevant what is *needed* for flight simming properly or not. If PMDG said they‘ll include a pink elephant on the FO‘s seat, people would have every right to expect (and demand) that 9 months after release.

Known as this day onward as PEOFOSA, the Pink Elephant On FO’s Seat Argument 

[Fiorentoni 4,253]

30 minutes ago, Dominique_K said:

Known as this day onward as PEOFOSA, the Pink Elephant On FO’s Seat Argument 

Now imagine on your voice command he'd move the gear lever with his trunk , don't tell me this woudn't sell well?!

[jrw4 624]

5 hours ago, Bdub22 said:

re-releasing the same planes for almost a decade now

Yes, but Boeing has been building the same plane now for over 50 years now, over 11,000 were built, and many thousand are still flying merrily around the world. 

By the time we give up arguing about the necessity of the EFB, it will be available. Then we can argue about wing flex. Have a great holiday everyone.

[Cpt_Piett 4,703]

6 hours ago, Stearmandriver said:

You're interacting with a rectangular shaped portion of your computer screen, to click through menus.  Whether the frame of this portion of your screen is designed to look like a CDU vs an ipad has no effect on its functionally at all.  It's still just a rectangular portion of your computer screen.

I really fail to see how this strengthens your point of view. For me it makes a huge difference interacting with a well-designed EFB vs navigating the menus of the CDU. 

Just look at iniBuild’s A310 and it’s fairly basic EFB. It really does make certain tasks so much easier - loading the aircraft (it has sliders for pax number, cargo and fuel), takeoff performance calculations and handling things like the GPU, chocks and pushback. 

Surely an EFB is not used for these things IRL. But I would say it’s even more useful in the sim. 

[bendead 1,085]

7 hours ago, Stearmandriver said:

Is it really worse?  No.  It's exactly the same thing.

You're interacting with a rectangular shaped portion of your computer screen, to click through menus.  Whether the frame of this portion of your screen is designed to look like a CDU vs an ipad has no effect on its functionally at all.  It's still just a rectangular portion of your computer screen.

I agree that the function are the same, But the EFB is so much better to use.

You get a neat interface and the flow is better, if you want to remove the FLS functionality and close the main door of the plane for exemple, on the Fenix it's a couple of clicks, on the 737 you need to navigate through dozens of pages and menu to do something similar. The DC-6 would be less fun to fly, if the EFB was a text based CDU interface.

I used to fly on FSX and had no issue with the absence of an EFB. But FBW and Fenix spoiled us and now getting a liner without it, feels like a big step backward.

 

Edited December 25, 2022 by bendead