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BWBriscoe

Fenix A320 vs FsLabs

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I don't see how I could justify purchasing yet another A320, no matter how good it is.

Perhaps the first FSLabs plane for MSFS would end up being indeed the Concorde? At least we know it is coming for MSFS. I have purchased it for P3D but stopped using a week later. The aircraft is amazing, but the platform is just too outdated. I am sure it will look/perform much better in MSFS...

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50 minutes ago, sdirand said:

It might be a difficult time for them as their income might be low with nothing yet released on msfs and probably low sales on the P3D market.

I'd love to know how many copies of the new P3D Concorde they've sold. I've hardly seen any videos, streams, reviews or general discussions about it. Not necessarily indicative, but it is not a good sign either.

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14 minutes ago, GCBraun said:

I have purchased it for P3D but stopped using a week later. The aircraft is amazing, but the platform is just too outdated. I am sure it will look/perform much better in MSFS...

With your system, performance wouldn’t be a problem. You say the platform is “outdated” but once airborne surely flying the aircraft would be just the same in MSFS as it is in P3D.


Ray (Cheshire, England).
System: P3D v5.3HF2, Intel i9-13900K, MSI 4090 GAMING X TRIO 24G, Crucial T700 4Tb M.2 SSD, Asus ROG Maximus Z790 Hero, 32Gb Corsair Vengeance DDR5 6000Mhz RAM, Win 11 Pro 64-bit, BenQ PD3200U 32” UHD monitor, Fulcrum One yoke.
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17 minutes ago, GCBraun said:

I don't see how I could justify purchasing yet another A320, no matter how good it is.

 

I agree, it would be like someone coming out with another 737 for MSFS. 

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BOBSK8             MSFS 2020 ,    ,PMDG 737-600-800 FSLTL , TrackIR ,  Avliasoft EFB2  ,  ATC  by PF3  ,

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4 minutes ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

once airborne surely flying the aircraft would be just the same in MSFS as it is in P3D.

Huh? Not at all. Between lighting, clouds, sat image streaming, and the quality of modeling that can be achieved in MSFS, it's not the same experience. 

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4 minutes ago, chapstick said:

Huh? Not at all. Between lighting, clouds, sat image streaming, and the quality of modeling that can be achieved in MSFS, it's not the same experience. 

You do realise most of Concorde's flights were supersonic over water. At Mach 2 reached at FL500 what are you expecting to see? All the weather is 20,000ft below you.

Can you define "quality of modelling"?


Ray (Cheshire, England).
System: P3D v5.3HF2, Intel i9-13900K, MSI 4090 GAMING X TRIO 24G, Crucial T700 4Tb M.2 SSD, Asus ROG Maximus Z790 Hero, 32Gb Corsair Vengeance DDR5 6000Mhz RAM, Win 11 Pro 64-bit, BenQ PD3200U 32” UHD monitor, Fulcrum One yoke.
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1 minute ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

Can you define "quality of modelling"?

Perhaps he means " implementation of the modelling". To my mind modelling would be the same standard for any platform, surely?


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34 minutes ago, GCBraun said:

I don't see how I could justify purchasing yet another A320, no matter how good it is.

Exactly for me too.  In P3D, I already owned then Aerosoft A320, but it was just ok so I bought the FSLabs version when it came out and it was one of my favourite aircraft in P3D.

However, now in MSFS we have the Fenix, which is already great, and is set to get dramatically better.  I  just don’t see what FSL could add or improve at this point to make me buy theirs if indeed they were to release one.  Hopefully they get Concorde out (I would buy that as long as it’s not some crazy three digit USD price) and then move on to something like the A330.

Or maybe they come out of left field and develop a Q400…that’s one huge gap in the sim right now 😀

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5 minutes ago, IanHarrison said:

Perhaps he means " implementation of the modelling". To my mind modelling would be the same standard for any platform, surely?

You can get much higher fidelity out of MSFS in terms of modeling, textures, and lighting than P3D without a massive hit to perf. 

 

Edited by chapstick

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59 minutes ago, chapstick said:

Huh? Not at all. Between lighting, clouds, sat image streaming, and the quality of modeling that can be achieved in MSFS, it's not the same experience. 


Apart from the world/weather rendering there's also the flight modelling, atmospheric airflow modelling, etc that all combine to make MSFS feel way more alive rather than the on-rails experience I remember in P3D (at least for me).

Edited by lwt1971
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Len
1980s: Sublogic FS II on C64 ---> 1990s: Flight Unlimited I/II, MSFS 95/98 ---> 2000s/2010s: FS/X, P3D, XP ---> 2020+: MSFS
Current system: i9 13900K, RTX 4090, 64GB DDR5 4800 RAM, 4TB NVMe SSD

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21 hours ago, DD_Arthur said:

I have a feeling that yes, MSFS2020 will effectively be declared dead by it's customer base shortly after the release of '2024.


I also agree most of the MSFS user base will switch over to 2024 quicker rather than later. But that said, we'll be able to keep 2020 running concurrently too. FWIW MS/Asobo plan to keep 2020 supported server-side for a few years after 2024 releases, at least that's what they said last July 🙂

https://www.helisimmer.com/interview/msfs-2024-helicopters-future-msfs-2020
Q: I asked Jorg if they had any idea of how many years we would expect support to continue.
Jorg: I do. But I'm not going to tell exactly what year is simply because things change. But the plan is for many years to come. At least a handful. Let's put it that way. That's probably a safe way to say it ... I think the general perception needs to be, in 2020 support continues, right? We want to make this great. When feasible, when there's improvements in 2024, we are thinking about backporting as feasible. We don't know if everything can be, most likely not everything. But we'll try, you know, make it as good as we can.

I would think the most feasible way forward for them whenever they release a major version of MSFS is to also support the N-1 version for some period of time (in the order of at least 1-2 years).. since not every add-on is going to be immediately 100% ready for the latest major version of the sim or take advantage of that major version's new features, and of course initial bugs need to be settled out, etc.
 

Edited by lwt1971
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Len
1980s: Sublogic FS II on C64 ---> 1990s: Flight Unlimited I/II, MSFS 95/98 ---> 2000s/2010s: FS/X, P3D, XP ---> 2020+: MSFS
Current system: i9 13900K, RTX 4090, 64GB DDR5 4800 RAM, 4TB NVMe SSD

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1 hour ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

With your system, performance wouldn’t be a problem. You say the platform is “outdated” but once airborne surely flying the aircraft would be just the same in MSFS as it is in P3D.

Except not flying, the sim performs much better around airports.  I see you struggling to get 30 fps.  That’s just not a problem with MSFS.  My system isn’t nearly as beefy as yours, and I get 50-60 around Toronto with a ton of aircraft in the Fenix A320, which is reasonably “heavy” on frames.  

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27 minutes ago, ATRguy said:

Except not flying, the sim performs much better around airports.  I see you struggling to get 30 fps.  That’s just not a problem with MSFS.  My system isn’t nearly as beefy as yours, and I get 50-60 around Toronto with a ton of aircraft in the Fenix A320, which is reasonably “heavy” on frames.  

I don’t struggle to get 30 fps. I have a 30Hz 4K monitor and with VSync enabled that is the delivered fps. It’s fine for landing any aircraft. I prefer my CPU not to be running flat out as it generates extra heat.

When landing Concorde your approach and landing speeds are around 35kts faster than an Airbus. Plus the delta wing acts like a huge brake at low speeds. It will take all your concentration.


Ray (Cheshire, England).
System: P3D v5.3HF2, Intel i9-13900K, MSI 4090 GAMING X TRIO 24G, Crucial T700 4Tb M.2 SSD, Asus ROG Maximus Z790 Hero, 32Gb Corsair Vengeance DDR5 6000Mhz RAM, Win 11 Pro 64-bit, BenQ PD3200U 32” UHD monitor, Fulcrum One yoke.
Cheadle Hulme Weather

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2 hours ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

You say the platform is “outdated” but once airborne surely flying the aircraft would be just the same in MSFS as it is in P3D.

Obviously you never used MSFS yourself otherwise you couldn't make such a daring statement. The cockpit textures alone make a world of difference. You see not much else than that during cruise at FL500 all the time. And it makes P3D look, well, "outdated".

To get back on topic, I think FSLabs needs to bring something completely new to MSFS if they want to get their share of the cake. And the longer it takes the harder it gets. All the developers already active in the MSFS market will make progress too; even the  freeware FBW / Headwind A330 is getting better and better. After all it might really be their best bet to bring the Concorde into MSFS first. Being a niche aircraft this is not something for the masses anyway but there will be a number of enthusiasts who will probably be willing to pay even the usual FSL-prices.

 

Edited by RALF9636
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1 hour ago, lwt1971 said:

most of the MSFS user base will switch over to 2024 quicker rather than later. But that said, we'll be able to keep 2020 running concurrently too.

Concurrently? HA!

The last couple of major sim upgrades (P3D, MSFS2020, XP) I have gone Cold Turkey, cut over to the new version, and (almost) never looked back.*

The new versions have (almost) always been so good of an upgrade that it's worth it (to me) to stay in the new sim.

And there's always enough addons that are Day 1 compatible (even if it takes a few tweaks as in P3D) to make it worthwhile.

* P3D v5.0 being the sole exception. Those graphics VRAM crashes were ROUGH.

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