1 hour ago, Redge said:

I recently waxed lyrical about MSFS2024, having just recently upgraded to it for the first time. I'm now at the point of reverting full-time to MSFS because I just can't get over the sky colors, the downgrade to the clouds and, most importantly the not-infrequent and seemingly random crashes that I'm experiencing.

I just moved to XP12 as my main sim for various reasons, including graphics.  MSFS certainly missed a trick not employing this chap, because the Sky colours in XP12 have to be seen to be believed.  MSFS 2024 remains on my system and will be used, but even though XP12 has elements that cannot come up to the level of MSFS, the OVERALL experience is better IMHO.

 

1 hour ago, Redge said:

I used XPlane 11 back in the day for a year or two before MSFS2020 was released. I never bought into 12, but I'm starting to think I should give it a go.

There is a free demo.  I have modded XP12 to display satellite imagery.  I show the image/video below to show why MSFS should have employed this chap for the colours XP12 got.

 

@Redge Can you explain the downgrade to the clouds and sky colors?

There's a yellow-ish sepia tone by default in FS2024 that isn't there in 2020, and the sunsets and mid-day sky colors (especially the transition on the horizon) look entirely unnatural and greenish. 

If you view that link I added to the MSFS forum post, you'll see very, very clearly what has happened to the clouds in the near and far distance. There are even some shots there comparing the same scene / weather between MSFS2024 and 2020.

If you meant, can I explain why it happened - well, for the clouds I'm assuming performance and/or they just didn't have the time to get around to making more improvements. But the early promo videos of 2024 showed the same relative downgrade to clouds, so I think they work as intended.

I've got no understanding of why the broke Biology's original sky colour/atmospheric scattering improvements.

2 hours ago, MrBitstFlyer said:

There is a free demo.

Thanks! And thanks for the video. I'll have to give this a go. The only thing that I'm hesitating about is the performance on your video. I have the same specs as you do from your signature, but that frame rate looks a bit choppy.

13 minutes ago, Redge said:

Thanks! And thanks for the video. I'll have to give this a go. The only thing that I'm hesitating about is the performance on your video. I have the same specs as you do from your signature, but that frame rate looks a bit choppy.

I am using Lossless Scaling so in reality I was seeing 52fps in that video.  I'm in the first week with XP12 so still learning its settings.  Most of the time it is smooth, but not as smooth as MSFS2024 at times, but I don't know if I still need to tweak for my 4K display/Rivatuner/G-sync etc.

Please be ready for that initial reaction after MSFS that you feel it isn't as good as MSFS. Once you get Map enhancement Tool/SimHeaven/Global Forests AND you give it time to adjust to XP12, you will start to appreciate the whole, rather than individual elements that are not as good as MSFS.

45 minutes ago, MrBitstFlyer said:

I am using Lossless Scaling so in reality I was seeing 52fps in that video.  I'm in the first week with XP12 so still learning its settings.  Most of the time it is smooth, but not as smooth as MSFS2024 at times, but I don't know if I still need to tweak for my 4K display/Rivatuner/G-sync etc.

Please be ready for that initial reaction after MSFS that you feel it isn't as good as MSFS. Once you get Map enhancement Tool/SimHeaven/Global Forests AND you give it time to adjust to XP12, you will start to appreciate the whole, rather than individual elements that are not as good as MSFS.

I found it funny seeing you trying to hide that flickering cloud at 1:00 in that video, lol.

30 minutes ago, Alvega said:

I found it funny seeing you trying to hide that flickering cloud at 1:00 in that video, lol.

You would be wrong on all counts.  I am running a Beta version of XP12 and one of the items on the fix list is flickering clouds in some circumstances.

4 hours ago, MrBitstFlyer said:

I am using Lossless Scaling so in reality I was seeing 52fps in that video.  I'm in the first week with XP12 so still learning its settings.  Most of the time it is smooth, but not as smooth as MSFS2024 at times, but I don't know if I still need to tweak for my 4K display/Rivatuner/G-sync etc.

Please be ready for that initial reaction after MSFS that you feel it isn't as good as MSFS. Once you get Map enhancement Tool/SimHeaven/Global Forests AND you give it time to adjust to XP12, you will start to appreciate the whole, rather than individual elements that are not as good as MSFS.

I think that’s exactly the reason why x-plane just doesn’t appeal to me anymore. I do agree that the lighting looks great in some cases and some of the shots I’ve seen here and on Reddit are just lovely. 

But invariably the subtext to all of those is hey, you can make your sim look just as good - just download *list of addons*

I remember my giga install of XP11, with 3tbs of orthos and constant adjustment to various files to keep it all together. Having to figure out why something suddenly started stuttering or resolving conflicts between janky third party plugins feels exhausting. I think it took me a year just to get everything dialed in.

Maybe I’m just getting old, but going back to that feels like a regression. I do take a peek over the fence once in a while, and hey maybe some day I’ll get tempted to try - certainly feels closer with every beta.

15 minutes ago, Georgleboui said:

I remember my giga install of XP11, with 3tbs of orthos

No need now - Map Enhancement  Tool for XP12 for global Ortho 😉

I really didn't mean to have this turn into an us vs. them discussion (we've got enough of those these days) by bringing this thread back to life. It was simply an acknowledgement that there's been, in my view, a very clear regression in terms of sky colour and cloud quality in 2024, and I was hoping for the input from someone who had a big impact on this community by bringing their expertise to the attention of Asobo/MSFS.

17 minutes ago, Redge said:

I really didn't mean to have this turn into an us vs. them discussion (we've got enough of those these days) by bringing this thread back to life. It was simply an acknowledgement that there's been, in my view, a very clear regression in terms of sky colour and cloud quality in 2024, and I was hoping for the input from someone who had a big impact on this community by bringing their expertise to the attention of Asobo/MSFS.

It's odd to me that you feel 2024 is too yellow.  To me 2020 has too warm of a color tone (too yellow).  You can tell because of how super green trees and grass looks. And the sky colors are just off from reality.  This can be so what fixed using REX Atmos.  But by default 2024 is much more realistic than 2020 in sky color alone.  

I do tend to agree there is some sort of visual downgrade in live weather in 2024.  It's like at first clouds appear but they are sometimes orientated the wrong way. And they are far too transparent.  But I've also had flights where I thought I was looking at a real cloud from above.  Imo Asobo has "nerfed" the clouds from looking totally opaque and detailed to be more compatible with Xbox.  

And then there xp12 - at release the environment was messed up badly imo.  But with the recent 12.2 beta update it's night and day - and medium to far ranged clouds look far better than 2020 (and 24).  The lighting is also incredible.  Unfortunately close range clouds in xp12 are detailness blurry puffs.  Both 20 and 24 are much better at close range.  And there's the AA issues in xp12...

There's no perfect sim.  But I wish more simmers would try multiple sims.  It's a great time to be a flight simmer!

59 minutes ago, ryanbatc said:

There's no perfect sim.  But I wish more simmers would try multiple sims.  It's a great time to be a flight simmer!

This!!

There may be a perfectly reasonable explanation why somebody may stick to one sim, but no one sim does it all!

 

1 hour ago, ryanbatc said:

It's odd to me that you feel 2024 is too yellow.  To me 2020 has too warm of a color tone (too yellow).  You can tell because of how super green trees and grass looks. And the sky colors are just off from reality.  This can be so what fixed using REX Atmos.  But by default 2024 is much more realistic than 2020 in sky color alone.  

I do tend to agree there is some sort of visual downgrade in live weather in 2024.  It's like at first clouds appear but they are sometimes orientated the wrong way. And they are far too transparent.  But I've also had flights where I thought I was looking at a real cloud from above.  Imo Asobo has "nerfed" the clouds from looking totally opaque and detailed to be more compatible with Xbox.  

And then there xp12 - at release the environment was messed up badly imo.  But with the recent 12.2 beta update it's night and day - and medium to far ranged clouds look far better than 2020 (and 24).  The lighting is also incredible.  Unfortunately close range clouds in xp12 are detailness blurry puffs.  Both 20 and 24 are much better at close range.  And there's the AA issues in xp12...

There's no perfect sim.  But I wish more simmers would try multiple sims.  It's a great time to be a flight simmer!

I too find it strange that he said 24 has a yellow tinge. If anything, it have more of a blue shift. 2024 clouds don't look great on the horizon for sure but mid to close range they can't be beat, especially when it comes to resolution. Some clouds do tend to be too transparent sometimes but it is FAR worse in 2020. XP12 has made some big strides with clouds but I can't abide the low resolution and angular shapes that pop up.

Edited May 28, 20251 yr by Krakin

8 hours ago, Redge said:

¡Gracias! Y gracias por el video. Tendré que probarlo. Lo único que me preocupa es el rendimiento de tu video. Tengo las mismas especificaciones que tú, según tu firma, pero la velocidad de fotogramas se ve un poco entrecortada.

The biggest work that Laminar still has to do is optimisation compared to 2024 is optimisation.

Anyway, with a modest computer in  nowadays, with the right settings, I enjoy X-Plane and 2024 without any major problems.

1929x1200, 3060 ti, 11700 Intel and 16 GB RAM.Logically, if you want to have all the graphics at their best and at 4K you need a much better computer for both simulators.

On 5/28/2025 at 11:52 PM, Aglos77 said:

The biggest work that Laminar still has to do is optimisation compared to 2024 is optimisation.

Anyway, with a modest computer in  nowadays, with the right settings, I enjoy X-Plane and 2024 without any major problems.

1929x1200, 3060 ti, 11700 Intel and 16 GB RAM.Logically, if you want to have all the graphics at their best and at 4K you need a much better computer for both simulators.

I am running MSFS 2024 at ultra/High settings @40fps plus FG to get 80fps
I am running XP12 at high/ultra settings @45fps plus lossless scaling to get 90fps.

Both are smooth.