I am back to FSHud for now... BATC is awesome when it works but too often it is a PITA. It can be a frustrating experience. I've been beta testing too long, I guess, haha! After flying with FSHud again I also noticed (again) how much features ATC is still lacking... and how awesome it is when something simply works. All the time and every time and everywhere.

I still have high hopes for BATC of course but I simply have to take a break from it. The few great things it offers are no match for the full experience I am getting with FSHud.

6 hours ago, Tuskin38 said:

That was weird. The ATC amended my flight plan into KDEN for Runway 16L, when the wind was 350 Degrees, the complete opposite for that runway.

KDEN has low tailwind operation (preferential runways) for the 16/17s in real life, which is reflected in the BATC database, i.e. if it was 350/1-5 kts, it was correct.

I was quite surprised by the accuracy it can get in the assignment, if the database is correct.

Did  flight to Frankfurt and got an ammendment to the opposite Runway as well. When I had checked before departing the real life was going in my initial planned direction. After the amendment I checked again and in real life the direction had also just been changed. Even saw an aircraft taxi out to 18 on 25C in real life. Interesting to see an active runway used as a taxiway at Frankfurt.

2 hours ago, tup61 said:

I am back to FSHud for now... BATC is awesome when it works but too often it is a PITA. It can be a frustrating experience. I've been beta testing too long, I guess, haha! After flying with FSHud again I also noticed (again) how much features ATC is still lacking... and how awesome it is when something simply works. All the time and every time and everywhere.

I still have high hopes for BATC of course but I simply have to take a break from it. The few great things it offers are no match for the full experience I am getting with FSHud.

Once I tried BATC, I couldn't go back to FSHud even with its traffic. Then I tried SI and it was so much more "real" than either of them. BATC is very good but it just seemed like the responses were on rails which, to some degree they are as SI is AI-driven in both directions: pilot and ATC. The good news is that a price drop will be announced at the upcoming FSExpo.

Since I already bought BATC, I'm using it for flights where I really need the help of a co-pilot and SI is used for everything else.

Edited June 1, 20242 yr by ricka47

1 hour ago, ricka47 said:

Once I tried BATC, I couldn't go back to FSHud even with its traffic. Then I tried SI and it was so much more "real" than either of them. BATC is very good but it just seemed like the responses were on rails which, to some degree they are as SI is AI-driven in both directions: pilot and ATC. The good news is that a price drop will be announced at the upcoming FSExpo.

Since I already bought BATC, I'm using it for flights where I really need the help of a co-pilot and SI is used for everything else.

I understand the problem with things being scripted (although I don't really mind because ATC should be sort of scripted).

And I understand SI is great according to some but 1. I don't want to use my voice and 2. I don't want a subscription for ATC (even with a price drop).

And I wouldn't call BATC 'very good'. Very promising: certainly, but at this moment it's impossible to call it very good. Just now wanted to compare BATC with FSHud doing a flight which BATC had problems with a while ago but I couldn't even get started with BATC due to BATC repeating stuff and being completely buggy. As I said before: when it works it's great but it's totally unreliable and that kills it for me.

The only thing BATC has going for it right now are the voices (which still is a matter of taste too) and perhaps (I'm no expert) phraseology, But in all other aspects FSHud is (way) better (for my kind of use anyway) and certainly WAY more complete.

Still, the future looks bright for ATC addon addicts. ;)

2 minutes ago, tup61 said:

I understand the problem with things being scripted (although I don't really mind because ATC should be sort of scripted).

And I understand SI is great according to some but 1. I don't want to use my voice and 2. I don't want a subscription for ATC (even with a price drop).

And I wouldn't call BATC 'very good'. Very promising: certainly, but at this moment it's impossible to call it very good. Just now wanted to compare BATC with FSHud doing a flight which BATC had problems with a while ago but I couldn't even get started with BATC due to BATC repeating stuff and being completely buggy. As I said before: when it works it's great but it's totally unreliable and that kills it for me.

The only thing BATC has going for it right now are the voices (which still is a matter of taste too) and perhaps (I'm no expert) phraseology, But in all other aspects FSHud is (way) better (for my kind of use anyway) and certainly WAY more complete.

Still, the future looks bright for ATC addon addicts. 😉

Right - if you don't want you use your voice, then FSHud is the best option at this point. I surprised myself in that, once I started talking, the "immersion factor" increased exponentially over pointing and clicking.

3 minutes ago, ricka47 said:

Right - if you don't want you use your voice, then FSHud is the best option at this point. I surprised myself in that, once I started talking, the "immersion factor" increased exponentially over pointing and clicking.

I can imagine that! But it's not really a matter of wanting in my case: my situation simply doesn't allow me to speak while flying.

Having said that: with FSHud I hardly have to actually point and click: I can take care of 90% by using two buttons on my controls and I hardly have the UI onscreen.

11 minutes ago, ricka47 said:

Right - if you don't want you use your voice, then FSHud is the best option at this point. I surprised myself in that, once I started talking, the "immersion factor" increased exponentially over pointing and clicking.

… cue me banging the drum for VATSIM as usual 🤪

Seriously, talking to actual humans on VATSIM takes it to a whole new level … and the more who take part, the better it gets.

 

6 minutes ago, tup61 said:

I can imagine that! But it's not really a matter of wanting in my case: my situation simply doesn't allow me to speak while flying.

Having said that: with FSHud I hardly have to actually point and click: I can take care of 90% by using two buttons on my controls and I hardly have the UI onscreen.

My situation makes my wife think that I'm crazy when I'm talking to my computer!

5 minutes ago, tfm said:

… cue me banging the drum for VATSIM as usual 🤪

Seriously, talking to actual humans on VATSIM takes it to a whole new level … and the more who take part, the better it gets.

 

Right and I've had a VATSIM id for ages and it can be amazing. But, I really like the "all-in-one solution" of the ATC programs, with traffic and ATC coverage at every airport 24/7.

Since this is a BATC topic maybe it's a good idea to post the problems I am having with BATC right now (NOT in random order):

- flightplans not being loaded (so flights becoming impossible) due to 'missing' runways, SIDs or STARs (terribly annoying if you spend time preparing the flight)

- ATC missing waypoints (specially during STAR and approach) and hence ATC staying silent (terribly annoying after flying all that time and then having to end the flight without ATC)

- STAR and approach given too late (slightly annoying every now and then)

- fatal errors ending at all ( doesn't happen too often but terribly annoying when it does)

I'd like to add things like no option to change approaches (can be annoying but well...) and obviously traffic but those are missing features, not bugs, like everything I mentioned above is.

Now these are my main problems and they all have to due with reliability, really. Not being able to fly a planned flight or seeing a flight being ruined... that's what kills it for me. Reliability is way more important to me than I thought, that's for sure.

Of course all this was to be expected with an EA in beta stage (if not alpha)! So I am not saying this is bad or that I am surprised: but at this moment (and after beta testing BATC for MONTHS) it just isn't the right ATC addon for me (at this moment).

When all the above has been fixed and BATC will be as reliable as FSHud (which never has any of the mentioned problems: perhaps BATC should go the Navigraph route anyway...) I might probably start enjoying BATC again.

Edited June 1, 20242 yr by tup61

5 hours ago, Farlis said:

I was quite surprised by the accuracy it can get in the assignment, if the database is correct.

Did  flight to Frankfurt and got an ammendment to the opposite Runway as well. When I had checked before departing the real life was going in my initial planned direction. After the amendment I checked again and in real life the direction had also just been changed. Even saw an aircraft taxi out to 18 on 25C in real life. Interesting to see an active runway used as a taxiway at Frankfurt.

Just FYI: BATC cannot know what happens in real life (airports don't publish the active runways, except for in the ATIS, which is protected anywhere except for in the US). But BATC can mirror special local ops and try to give plausible assignments based on those and on the weather, which did happen in your case.

(Further info: The BATC database has set the runways in EDDF so they are being used like in real life, e.g. 18 is preferred for departure, 25R/07L is arrival only etc., and that the 25s are used more often than the 07, even in low tailwinds)

Not sure about an aircraft taxiing to RW 18 on RW 25C... are you sure about that? I can't imagine this happening in real life, I mean there are two big parallel taxiways going to 18 (taxiways L and M) and 25C is the preferred departure runway for north/west outbound traffic.

2 hours ago, tfm said:

… cue me banging the drum for VATSIM as usual 🤪

Seriously, talking to actual humans on VATSIM takes it to a whole new level … and the more who take part, the better it gets.

 

My modus operandi is now:

Use Vatsim whenever ATC is available. Use BATC when no controller on Vatsim. Switch back and forth multiple times if necessary during a flight. Works perfectly easy for me and I get the best possible ATC wherever/whenever I am.

I can easily quit and restart BATC during a flight and it will act like I was never gone.

Edited June 1, 20242 yr by Fiorentoni

2 hours ago, tup61 said:

Since this is a BATC topic maybe it's a good idea to post the problems I am having with BATC right now (NOT in random order):

- flightplans not being loaded (so flights becoming impossible) due to 'missing' runways, SIDs or STARs (terribly annoying if you spend time preparing the flight)
You could always refile a flightplan without a SID and STAR. So flight do rarely become impossible.
 

- ATC missing waypoints (specially during STAR and approach) and hence ATC staying silent (terribly annoying after flying all that time and then having to end the flight without ATC)
Yep that's annoying, needs fixing ASAP.

- STAR and approach given too late (slightly annoying every now and then)

This should be much improved with the latest update (and the hotfix for that). Also - why not ask for descent when your TOD is closing in? When you have a low cost index and FMC plans a descent speed of 244kts (Ryanair, Easyjet), your TOD will be dozens of NM earlier than ATC would calculate with a 3 degree descent path. In those cases you just have to ask for a descent, it's the same on e.g. Vatsim.

- fatal errors ending at all ( doesn't happen too often but terribly annoying when it does)
I agree, but only half annoying, since restarting BATC and resuming exactly from where you were only takes about 10 seconds. Really the ability to just jump in and let BATC take over whereever you are in your flight avoids so much frustration that would otherwise accumulate with an early access ATC.

 

That said it's fine to post your experiences with BATC so the Avsimmers can make up their own mind. My experience has been vastly more positive, that's all.

Edited June 1, 20242 yr by Fiorentoni

14 minutes ago, Fiorentoni said:

Not sure about an aircraft taxiing to RW 18 on RW 25C... are you sure about that?

Positive. I have no clue why they did that, but they did. Two actually. A tripple seven followed by a bizjet.