Sad but true

[StoneC0ld 5]

WILL ACES BE REINSTATED AND WILL THERE BE AN FS11 AND/OR TS2?andIS THERE A POSSIBILITY THAT ACES WILL BE REINSTATED?

From what I've been reading, there's still a chance that Microsoft will eventually continue with Flight Simulator in some shape or form (hopefully not as a dumbed-down version for the xbox360)... But until this recession is over, it appears Flight Simulator 11 development is on hold until further notice....I sincerely hope the same can be said for Train Simulator X, but based on what Tom Allensworth has said, I don't think there's much chance in that happening... It might now be safe to say "stick a fork in 'er, she's done... Again..." (being the second Train Simulator project to be canceled). Best wishes to the Aces team members affected by this...

[Avantime 81]

I'm very sorry to hear about the job losses, I hope those really talented people will find new jobs soon. :( In my opinion, the Flight Simulator franchise is dead. M$ beancounters will probably come back in 2010 and say "Too small a market, not worth creating another dev team for." The beancounters only care about money. More Halo sequels, more Gears of War sequels, more Rock Band sequels, and more casual games. No one in M$ will care about the chumps at Avsim, those anorak types will go away eventually.M$ could outsource the project to someone else, but I think we all know how the Simcity franchise crashed and burned after that worthless piece of junk known as Simcity Societies.The flight sim genre died long ago, and FSX is the last nail in the coffin. Look at Jane's Combat Sim, Novalogic and MicroProse. All of them are great companies, and all of them are dead.RIP Flight Simulator, hello X-Plane. :(

[Gate99 246]

What a devastatingly sad day this is for flight sim fans everywhere. My heart and best wishes go out to everyone on the Aces team. You'll never know how much joy and entertainment MSFS brought to my life. Due to a lengthy number of ear infections growing up I sadly had to accept the fact that becoming a real world pilot was not in the cards for me. MSFS allowed me to become a virtual pilot and take to the skies, unencumbered by my scarred eardrums. I never thought I'd see the day when MS would close it's doors on it's FS division. I can only hope at this point, that somewhere down the line MS breaths new life into this tried and true simulation. As things appear now, the picture is bleak.Regards,Mark

[Guest V4DIV-CVN-70]

[\quote] ........I myself work for the largest producer of smokeless tobacco in the United States, UST (US Smokeless Tobacco Co) ie, Copenhagen/Skoal and .....The girl of my Dreams.....Like Flight Sim and Copenhagen........Ever Been to a Rodeo?,,,,,, :( :(P.S. Guess Phil is glad he left when he did.

[dmaher 0]

You assume that our cherished Flight Simulator is a "major product." I think MSFS has cultural mindshare, but the world is not going to uproar over MSFS. We've been told, numerous times, that those of us who are part of the "community" consistute a low percentage of the overall number of customers who buy MSFS.Frankly, I've be HAPPY to continue as a customer if they "graduated" MSFS from an entertainment title to a "professional" title with the sort of pricetag that accompanies such a title. I would pay 10 times what I paid for FSX to see MSFS live.

I can

[Guest SkullxBones]

No offense to the current ACES team, but if MS were to ever outsource FS to a major game developer, it would be interesting to see what they would come up with.

[Guest N6722c]

<----------------------- snip ---------------- I doubt MS will release the source code but they will keep it safe somewhere for future use. Like some others mentioned, the bright side is that we will have time to soak in FSX for now.... and I'm hoping we reach the point of developing planes and scenery for just one version of FS instead of two as is the case right now.------------------- snip ------------------------>Sherv Commercial Level Simulations Model Designer

If there is one thing that depreciates faster in value, than that new car you just drove off the showroom floor, it is old, archived, unmaintained, and poorly documented software.With the break up of it's software development team, the FSX software will fast become more obsolete and unmaintainable, and quickly become of no commercial value to anyone.Looking on the bright side, in a number of years, once MSFS does reach this stage, the only viable option will be a completely new, modern design, without the limitations and backwards compatability issues that have always hindered MFSF advances.Then maybe, without the Microsoft monopoly, or threat of competition ( Viz Historic Netscape), the doors will be open for a progressive game developer, to start looking at the next generation of Flight simulator. Till then, we potentially have many useful years of FSX use, and addon development.Geoff

[dmaher 0]

Ya, It's the people not the code....without the team the code base is a dead patient. But staring over in say five years would be a massive undertaking. It would be a much smaller title

[phoenixphire 50]

I have to say that I am deeply saddened on several layers. First for all the for the people and their families that are now left without jobs. Secondly for the possible loss of the technological advancement of FS. I love FSX and have loved it and supported it from RTM. The sim has only matured with the SP1 and SP2 and with my many add-ons the sim is quite incredible. My concern is that while the franchise may be picked up in the future, I worry about the future of the small add-on developers who depend on FS. With small staff teams and even smaller markets, I worry that we will loose some of the most valuable third party developers to the economic downturn. If giants like Microsoft can suffer this fate I am betting this is not the first of a string of very sad announcements. I still hope for the best and I will continue to invest in FSX and play it for many years to come. I am always deeply grateful to the entire community for their investment in our great hobby.

[dmaher 0]

No offense to the current ACES team, but if MS were to ever outsource FS to a major game developer, it would be interesting to see what they would come up with.

But, ACES is a major game developer

[ahuimanu 50]

I assumed nothing I posted a link to a CNET article, please don't make false statements or accusations like that, they're really not polite nor appreciated thank you!

Of course you are right. Since I was quoting the content of your post I mistakenly ascribed the words to you while they are clearly from the article.It would have been more appropriate for me to have said: "The article assumes..."I apologize for creating the confusion.Now, back to pondering the news... :(

[Guest zzmikezz]

This has implications beyond ACES and indeed beyond MSG. When a company lays off "valued" employees who've been working 80-100 hour weeks with just 24 hours notice, that company will not be able to retain its good employees when the economy turns around, whenever that might be. Trust me -- the best and brightest of the ones who are still there, still able to collect their salaries, are all saying to themselves "If they can do this for me then they can do it to me" -- and they're right. It is a symptom of the death of the old Microsoft, and a continuation of things like the Vista fiasco, just as surely as the cessation of heartbeat is a prediction of cell death and, eventually, a stinking corpse.When a company allows itself to be ruled strictly by the numbers it is in big trouble. Evidently the suits said to themselves "If we give them one day's notice instead of two weeks notice (forget two months)", we'll save ...94 layoffs (never mind that it's really 5,000 with perhaps 4,000 of those being immediate)x$80,000/52 salaryx2 overhead factor (minimum, probably higher because of corporate)x2 weeks=$578,000not realizing that the best and the brightest of those who haven't left already will leave at the first available opportunity.xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxAs the saying goes, the real assets of technology companies go home every night. The company made a correct financial decision but they handled it cruelly and in the end stupidly. If I might have ever thought about investing in Microsoft I certainly would not now dream of it.And if I had ever thought about pulling an investor group together and make ACES fly outside the high overhead context of Microsoft corporate, I now would be unable to do it because they killed the operation instead of trying to sell it off, which would have preserved their reputation and helped ease the pain for many of the 94 victims of what I must now concede is an absolutely ruthless corporation.It's one thing to thumb your nose at the competition, or at government. It's quite another to give the finger to your own employees and stockholders.

[Guest blueconcorde]

I have nothing to add, except one thing:Are we going to cross our arms and watch FS die like that?I really believe that we should get the whole FS community together and show M$ how disappointed we are. We love this software, we spend a lot of money in hardware and addons for FS, for years!!! I don't know any other software with such loyal customers and fans, except for WoW. At least for me, this is the time to get over disagreements and get the community together, or we'll probably see what we devoted so much time into, forgotten in the past. Shouldn't we at least try to keep things in place?I like changes and I hope that something better comes out of this, but I see no good things on the horizon right now.L

[ahuimanu 50]

I have nothing to add, except one thing:Are we going to cross our arms and watch FS die like that?I really believe that we should get the whole FS community together and show M$ how disappointed we are. We love this software, we spend a lot of money in hardware and addons for FS, for years!!! I don't know any other software with such loyal customers and fans, except for WoW. At least for me, this is the time to get over disagreements and get the community together, or we'll probably see what we devoted so much time into, forgotten in the past. Shouldn't we at least try to keep things in place?I like changes and I hope that something better comes out of this, but I see no good things on the horizon right now.L

[scott967 62]

I have to say, it's hard seeing games as a core competency of MSFT. The company would probably be better off redoing the OS, rather than just doing vista sp3. I don't think it needs to be a "bean counter" drill, more of a corporate strategy to focus on the OS and reduce effort on some of the more peripheral areas of the company.I feel really bad for the TSII guys. They must have been pretty close to putting together builds for initial testing, and now it's no doubt like losing a child.scott s..