Pull the Plug on the FLIGHT Forum.

[jasonX 24]

Absolutely agree with this.The demo is out. You have seen it in action. You know from the demo pretty close to what the release will be. So what is there to fight about. This is the direction MS has chosen to go. It most definitely isn't what I want so I won't be one of it's future customers.Anyways I'm outa here.

[snipped]I think MS has made a short sighted mistake driven by marketing / business development folks that mistakenly see FLIGHT as the next Battle Field 3 or something close to it. I see 3PD's migrating elsewhere. I give the MS team two years at most, to re-engage with the 3PD's. After that, MS will be seeing some very talented people in our community migrating elsewhere.

[Arwen 289]

The demo is out. You have seen it in action. You know from the demo pretty close to what the release will be. So what is there to fight about. This is the direction MS has chosen to go. It most definitely isn't what I want so I won't be one of it's future customers.Anyways I'm outa here.

No demo of Flight has been released. All that has been released is a CLOSED BETA.And some videos were released of one Beta build (most by people who broke the NDA).I don't know what the released version will exactly be like yet (I'm not sure that anyone knows that yet).I do know that it won't be perfect, and that some users will enjoy it and that some will hate it (this is true for every sim).I also know that you shouldn't be so hasty to judge Flight (or any flightsim) until you actually try it for yourself.I'm just saying that you should give Flight a chanceI was impressed with what I imagined X-Plane 10 would be until I downloaded the demo and spent some time flying. Then I decided that it's "plausable world" wasn't what I was looking for (I own X-Plane 9). Others were so impressed with the demo that they immediately ordered the game.The same will happen with Flight. Some users will be disappointed in the free version and will never buy any DLC. Others will be pleasantly surprise by it. (And this apples to both groups; gamers and simmers). Edited January 19, 2012 by Arwen

[Bread Hammer 1]

... (And this apples to both groups; gamers and simmers).

How bout them apples!!!!!Sorry, couldn't resist. :(

[drumsonly2002 3]

The Flight free demo when released will do more to draw interest in sim flying than the 2006 FSX demo can ever do. I tried to get my pal into sim flying and he DL the FSX demo. His commentary, roughly said, how can you get into that? Ugly graphics, choppy performance, and nothing to do but fly. My response, buy Orbx, and a decient add on plane then we can talk. His response, cannot be bothered. So, the point. How can Flight be pre judged as a failure when it hasn't been tried by us, let alone the masses. And who really knows what the direction the add on's will take. Main point, seeing the graphics, I would guess my pal would remained interested. Probably collected a few tokens. Then the magic happens, tokens are forgotten about and the real flying and enjoyment starts. The least thing Flight will do is draw a new generation into flying.

[Marith 2]

On the other hand I was talking to a colleague at work about Flight Simulators. He had seen the video on MS Flight and didn't like it (too much like an arcade game). I spoke about FSX, and pointed out where to download the FSX demo. A few days later he told me he loved the demo and had gone out and bought FSX Gold.So maybe MS Flight will attract newcomers, but not in a way Microsoft were thinking (or maybe they were?).

[GHD 21]

"Pull the Plug on the FLIGHT Forum."If the plug was pulled, there would be nowhere for the above posters to post :(

[CarlosF 1,243]

+1On final with this one...

[EngineRoom 205]

Wow, after reading some of the replies in this thread I'm left a bit bemused.I don't think it's a surprise for anyone the way Flight has turned out. The writing was on the wall several years ago. Microsoft are out to make money and if that means making a product with more mass market appeal and jumping on the DLC bandwagon then so be it. I won't begrudge them that.Am I disappointed with the way things have turned out? Yes.Do I think MS owed us (and Aces) more than this considering how we all helped make MSFS such a stalwart of the MS software lineup for so many years? Yes.Am I surprised? No.It's easy for us here in our little forums to forget we are but a niche of a niche in a world where there is big money to be made in the entertainment software industry.Which brings me nicely on to my next point. The elitism I have read from some of the replies here is almost comic. No matter how many checklists you have in front of you or how many addon weather programmes you are running, no matter how many functioning buttons are on your 737 overhead panel or whether your FMC HOLD page has full functionality.... it's still a piece of entertainment software. Once upon a time you were all beginners and had absolutely no idea how to programme an FMC or read a METAR.Now then, the world is not going to end because Flight isn't what you all hoped it would be. The sky isn't going to fall. We still have FS9 and FSX and plenty of developers telling us they have no plans to give up development. If anything FSX is only just starting to show us what it is capable of. As long as we all stick around and continue to support the hobby it will be around for a long time yet.If Microsoft want to release a flying "game" then let them. It's not going to hurt anyone, and I certainly don't see why people are so offended or outraged by such a concept. Boycotting Flight, burying your head in the sand and pretending it doesn't exist or isn't worthy to exist in the same universe as such God-like "hardcore" flight simmers as yourselves is just childish.On a related note, I know there are a lot of people here who won't go anywhere near combat flight simulations, but that scene is really alive and kicking. We've got the likes of DCS putting out amazing state of the art simulations (with their new title hopefully coming this year). After the extreme disappointment of Il-2 Cliffs of Dover the developers have gone back to the drawing board and are reworking it from the ground up. Meanwhile the old Il-2 sim is going stronger than ever with a tremendous amount of new development from the community. Rise of Flight is going from strength to strength. The venerable Falcon 4 is still around thanks to tremendous development efforts from the community (culminating in the current Free Falcon 5 and BMS4 simulators). Old Brown Dog has achieved nothing short of a miracle with the CFS3 engine in creating Over Flanders Fields, the latest version of which will be released this year. Thirdwire's Strike Fighters series is supported by a large and very active modding community and will be joined by the latest installment in the series this year. Even Razorwork's old Enemy Engaged series has been the subject of extensive community development to turn it into much more than the original release.These are good times to be a flight simmer, so stop with all the doom and gloom, manufactured outrage and elitism and enjoy the hobby.

Edited January 19, 2012 by EngineRoom

[Mountain Man 142]

Well, you don't think much of my integrity, do you? I read the same in another of your posts. You don't know me and you have no clue as to the historical and current relationship that I and AVSIM have with MS. Never-the-less, cast aspersions on my integrity again, and you won't be posting them here again.

If you were inclined to read my comments with a more charitable eye then you would see that I'm not questioning your integrity at all. I'm just making an observation about human nature and how Microsoft is very skilled at using it to their advantage.

[Mountain Man 142]

Yet you're assuming that there are no "significant disadvantages" in controlling Flight with a mouse, when you have nothing to base this on.

The official Flight promotional video explicitly says that Flight was "specially designed for players who are used to a mouse and keyboard", so, no, I'm not basing it on nothing.

[Arwen 289]

The official Flight promotional video explicitly says that Flight was "specially designed for players who are used to a mouse and keyboard", so, no, I'm not basing it on nothing.

From http://www.microsoft.com/games/flightsimulatorx/product_info.html :Minimum System Requirements

• Windows XP SP2 / Windows Vista / Windows 7
• Processor: 1.0 Ghz
• RAM: Windows XP SP2 - 256MB, Windows Vista – 512MB
• Hard Drive: 14GB
• Video Card: 32MB DirectX 9 compatible
• Other: DX9 hardware compatibility and audio board with speakers and/or headphones
• Online/Multiplayer Requirements: 56.6 kbps or better for online play

Where does it say that a joystick is needed to fly FSX?You can fly FXS without a joystick, but most people fly FXS with a joystick. Why? Because there are significant advantages in controlling FXS with one.The same true of Flight. You're basing your opinion that there is no significant disadvantages in controlling Flight with a mouse on nothing. So again I'm asking you: Have you tried controlling Flight with a mouse? Have your tried using joystick/throttle/pedals with Flight?Because, until you have actually done so, you won't really know.So you're just spreading negative rumors, base on your interpretation of one small part of one video (which happens to be wrong).

[ZachLW 37]

Meh. I sent a corny email to get my point across. I'm sure some automated system will handle it.

It is regrettable that your studio has decided to ditch it's core supporters and enthusiast. While I understand that MS is a for profit company, it leaves a bad taste in the mouths of those who have supported the genre for 25+ years. Not to mention the relative new comers. Microsoft's Flight Simulator 98 spear headed my interest in an aviation career, playing a larger role in my career choice than any other factors (I'm currently flight instructing). Besides it's obvious influence on my life, MSFSX continues to allow for training and instrument proficiency as well as a realistic hobby driven by third party add on developers. Your studio has essentially cut ties with these developers, giving an ultimatum which is unacceptable. Not only was this done in a callous and unprofessional manner, it was done with absolutely no input from the community that has been built around the original product.I do believe that attracting a different audience is acceptable, and a downright necessity for the survival of this niche genre. But cutting out the avid fans and supporters, alienating us, is a slap in the face to say the least. Obviously there is an upside to all things: Developers are starting to bud with realistic and advanced flight simulator platforms with the dissolution of ACES. But the core community has been insulted and let down.To say that MSFS is an important part of many peoples lives is an understatement, regardless of how corny or hokey that sounds or seems.Nevertheless, best of luck with the new endeavors.

[mgh 89]

Meh. I sent a corny email to get my point across. I'm sure some automated system will handle it.

Corny is the word!

[Mountain Man 142]

Where does it say that a joystick is needed to fly FSX?

You're really clutching at straws now. :biggrin:Surely you recognize there's a difference between the minimum requirements not recommending a joystick and an official promotional video saying that Flight was "specially designed for players who are used to a mouse and keyboard".

You're basing your opinion that there is no significant disadvantages in controlling Flight with a mouse on nothing.

Sure, if you want to insist that information coming directly from Microsoft counts as nothing. Sorry, kiddo, but you've lost this round. Edited January 19, 2012 by Mountain Man

[Arwen 289]

So again I'm asking you: Have you tried controlling Flight with a mouse? Have your tried using joystick/throttle/pedals with Flight?

Until you can answer both with a yes, I'm gonna consider that I'm the one winning this round. Think whatever you like, but I happen to know for a fact that your conclusions on this particular matter are quite wrong. Edited January 19, 2012 by Arwen